Soo.. What about those Maw changes that were supposed to happen?

[enderzone]

Yea, because that was the only aspect of SL they were working on.

*sigh*

It is the reason they gave for why it was delayed...?

Let me guess you know more then blizzard right?

[LordVargK]

I see you lack the ability to comprehend what you read. Please point out where rabbit blames players. All he alluded was you guys don't understand what goes into these things.

And how was this helpful? Of course it takes time. Guess what, Blizzard delayed the release of SL to take their time on finishing it. They wrote a blogpost about how the Maw was thematically designed one way, but gameplay wise this design proved to be very boring. Now, that's not something new, it was apparent once the Maw could be tested on Beta. They then delayed SL. Now would be the time to make the changes promised in the blogpost. If the maw is not ready, why release SL now? With their announcement of the new release date they told the players "We think SL will be ready by then". Obviously the maw is ready for release in their eyes.
The feedback/points brought up in this thread is probably similar to the one on the official forums, which Blizzard reads sometimes.
Now, how is calling the players, who complain about Blizzard being content with the current iteration of the Maw, names (as in "keyboard warriors") helpful in any way?
Yes, changes take time, thanks captain obvious. Everybody knows that here. Blizzard took the time. Rabbit is just here to insult players.

[SirBeef]

And how was this helpful? Of course it takes time. Guess what, Blizzard delayed the release of SL to take their time on finishing it. They wrote a blogpost about how the Maw was thematically designed one way, but gameplay wise this design proved to be very boring. Now, that's not something new, it was apparent once the Maw could be tested on Beta. They then delayed SL. Now would be the time to make the changes promised in the blogpost. If the maw is not ready, why release SL now? With their announcement of the new release date they told the players "We think SL will be ready by then". Obviously the maw is ready for release in their eyes.
The feedback/points brought up in this thread is probably similar to the one on the official forums, which Blizzard reads sometimes.
Now, how is calling the players, who complain about Blizzard being content with the current iteration of the Maw, names (as in "keyboard warriors") helpful in any way?
Yes, changes take time, thanks captain obvious. Everybody knows that here. Blizzard took the time. Rabbit is just here to insult players.

It's relevant because you wrote someone was blaming the players for bad design when that was not what was written. His keyboard warrior comment was aimed at those that act like it's so easy to make changes. We've been over this before. Plenty of devs have commented on the challenges of making large changes.

[hulkgor]

It is the reason they gave for why it was delayed...?

Let me guess you know more then blizzard right?

If you think they delayed Shadowlands 1 month for the sole purpose of iterating The Maw, you're delusional, and oblivious to the weekly beta changes they've been doing.

But yea, keep fighting that fight buddy.

ps. I'll even help ya



"including overhauling the combat and rewards of the Maw". Hence, not the only reason.

Another one, https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/ne...on-shadowlands if u're still confused. No mention to the Maw being the sole reason for a delay.

Also just realized i'm arguing with a disposable, fresh account created for this purpose. Why bother, keep at it buddy!

[Aphrel]

I agree - The issue is not what they are SAYING they are going to do - its the results. I have seen nothing at all that has made me even remotely interested in the Maw, not even in the slightest. From a lore perspective, a vast, expansive, depressing zone with little to no life there would be cool. In a book. But this isnt a book, its a game.

If it was vast and expansive that at least would be alittle interesting. But it isnt even that, its 3 average sized islands and thats it... :<

[pfbe]

If it was vast and expansive that at least would be alittle interesting. But it isnt even that, its 3 average sized islands and thats it... :<

really? what a waste. The idea of an absolutely hostile zone where you can't mount could be made quite good and engaging, but as it is right now, with the paper-thin content and a timer, it's horrible, and if I can see it all in one day then my desire to keep going back is going to drop off precipitously.

[enderzone]

If you think they delayed Shadowlands 1 month for the sole purpose of iterating The Maw, you're delusional, and oblivious to the weekly beta changes they've been doing.

But yea, keep fighting that fight buddy.

ps. I'll even help ya



"including overhauling the combat and rewards of the Maw". Hence, not the only reason.

Another one, https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/ne...on-shadowlands if u're still confused. No mention to the Maw being the sole reason for a delay.

Also just realized i'm arguing with a disposable, fresh account created for this purpose. Why bother, keep at it buddy!

I never said they delayed it to work on the maw. I said they delayed it in a desperate attempt to salvage their borrowed power systems.

[rrayy]

It is the reason they gave for why it was delayed...?

Let me guess you know more then blizzard right?

It wasn't the only reason they gave. They gave several. You are trying to spin the narrative.

- - - Updated - - -

I never said they delayed it to work on the maw. I said they delayed it in a desperate attempt to salvage their borrowed power systems.

It is the reason they gave for why it was delayed...?

Your own words. You outright state here the the Maw was the reason for the delay. Now you are lying.

[Osmeric]

I propose we describe the expansion with the new word "mawful".

"How is Shadowlands?" "Mawful. Simply mawful."

[[Apok]]

It wasn't the only reason they gave. They gave several. You are trying to spin the narrative.

- - - Updated - - -



Your own words. You outright state here the the Maw was the reason for the delay. Now you are lying.

You're going to be waiting an extra 5 minutes for the burger as we need to cook some new patties and buns as we weren't satisfied with quality.

Later.

Heres that burger you were waiting the extra 5 minutes on, but we didn't cook new patties, only new buns.

[arkanon]

You're going to be waiting an extra 5 minutes for the burger as we need to cook some new patties and buns as we weren't satisfied with quality.

Later.

Heres that burger you were waiting the extra 5 minutes on, but we didn't cook new patties, only new buns.

"And the buns are actually the same as well, but, we sprinkled on some sesame seeds, and we added some new sauce! (ok, full disclosure, its just the same sauce from your last burger, but, we changed its name). "

[Stickiler]

You're going to be waiting an extra 5 minutes for the burger as we need to cook some new patties and buns as we weren't satisfied with quality.

Later.

Heres that burger you were waiting the extra 5 minutes on, but we didn't cook new patties, only new buns.

Your analogy falls apart at the end, a closer comparison is:

"You're going to be waiting an extra 5 minutes for the burger as we need to cook some new patties and buns as we weren't satisfied with quality."

2.5 minutes later you look into the kitchen and get angry that they've only cooked new buns thus far, even though they haven't even given you the new burger yet, and there's still time before their new deadline.



TL;DR they've got another 2 weeks, and while there's every chance they don't make any more changes, it's ludicrous to get angry before the deadline they've set, as if they're overhauling it significantly, it'll take a decent amount of time before it's ready for us to test.

[enderzone]

It wasn't the only reason they gave. They gave several. You are trying to spin the narrative.

- - - Updated - - -



Your own words. You outright state here the the Maw was the reason for the delay. Now you are lying.

Was talking to another person claiming they didn't have time to add anything and pointing out they had months since the maw was released. Instead of working on it they have been constantly trying to balance the covenant and the subsystems around it.

I can understand the confusion somewhat its best to focus more on a single post then trying to chain different responses together.

[Soon-TM]

Is that good though? You'd think that the devs would want the players to have the "fun" stuff for as long as possible. Inverting the trees and thus forcing the grind for more renown does not sound very fun. Without the inversion you get the fun stuff early on with minor upgrades in higher tiers. So the hardcore crowd will still have something to work to while the casuals don't burn themselves out over the grind.

That part was quite odd, considering that their fix to the original version of Azerite included making the most rewarding stuff immediately available, while the hardcore crowd could grind their asses for that +5 ilvl.

[LordVargK]

That part was quite odd, considering that their fix to the original version of Azerite included making the most rewarding stuff immediately available, while the hardcore crowd could grind their asses for that +5 ilvl.

Yeah, I thought that this was the lesson they learned from the Artifact system. Also conduits work similar: rank 1 gives a major bonus, every higher rank increases this bonus marginally.

[Utrrabbit]

Yeah, totally the players fault they don't want terribly designed (possibly) mandatory content once more. If the maw is still up for a redesign and the devs ran out of time, then they should make the rewards (notably the extra socket item) the Maw has to offer available through other sources. Or just make it available when it's done, since the rewards of the maw are meant as tools to give your progression in the rest of the game a little push if you run out of other sources to get power from. It's not really necessary to have the maw active right from the start.

You still do not get it. Even adding what you just said would take a min 1 month just to work on before testing.

[LordVargK]

You still do not get it. Even adding what you just said would take a min 1 month just to work on before testing.

Absolutely not. It's as simple as changing the required currency for the item and put the item into another vendor's inventory. Might need a few commands in their database. But Blizzard has definitely the ability to add and remove items from vendors in a matter of hours.
And deciding the price of the items is also nothing that should take a month.

Now, delaying the zone entirely is more difficult. But you don't have to restrict access to the zone, you just have to remove the vendor for the rewards. That way any incentive to play the zone outside of personal curiosity is removed.

[[Apok]]

The very fact it's labelled as RC means were unlikely to see any changes to the maw before launch and only further tuning updates.

They could at least communicate their intent further, but i doubt they will because they likely have no plans to improve it now before 9.1 and there will be further excuses.

people act like things like this dont happen every expansion, priest changes in bfa for example, throughout alpha and beta people gave them info on how poorly it played.
they skirted this by promising a rework of shadow priest for 8.1, when 8.1 came they got minor changes, and told to wait to the next expansion, every time there is significant issues it's always defended by apologists, its just alpha, its just beta, it's only prepatch, it's only 9.0 wait for 9.1. it wont be so bad just wait till next content patch/expansion.

Blizzard has a habit of over promising and under-delivering, and the shitstorm such an approach often brings, why cant they for once under promise and over-deliver, because many people will continue to play regardless of the level of content they put out.