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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by StayTuned View Post
    You should not forget that this doesn't mean "no more PC, only mobile" or even "mobile first" at all.
    Do you really believe that?

    They are going to forsake their core customer for a "me too" play which has been the bane of the industry for the last decade or so. A dollar today and nothing tomorrow.
    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.

  2. #22
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    They never existed and that's a romanticized view of "how game development used to be!". It's always been about the money. Always. We just weren't aware of how transparently obvious that was when we were younger.
    Also, that in the days of Atari and such, the money was really just not that much. Shoestring budgets everywhere.

    These days, it's a mega-billion-dollar market. Pulling numbers from here; https://www.statista.com/topics/868/...U.S.%20dollars.

    For 2020, PC gaming's global revenue was around 37 billion. Mobile gaming? More than double that; 77 billion.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Afrospinach View Post
    Do you really believe that?

    They are going to forsake their core customer for a "me too" play which has been the bane of the industry for the last decade or so. A dollar today and nothing tomorrow.
    Do they make more money over the next year off the "core customers", or the new stuff?

    If it's the latter, that's why they're pushing to serve the market that offers them more. Those "core customers" aren't paying the bills.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Afrospinach View Post
    Do you really believe that?

    They are going to forsake their core customer for a "me too" play which has been the bane of the industry for the last decade or so. A dollar today and nothing tomorrow.
    Certainly explains their decisions for WoW for that timeframe.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Also, that in the days of Atari and such, the money was really just not that much. Shoestring budgets everywhere.

    These days, it's a mega-billion-dollar market. Pulling numbers from here; https://www.statista.com/topics/868/...U.S.%20dollars.

    For 2020, PC gaming's global revenue was around 37 billion. Mobile gaming? More than double that; 77 billion.
    Shit, that Netflix series on gaming spoke to this pretty extensively. Hell, I legit had no clue that the memed on Atari E.T. game was created largely by one dude in five freakin weeks. FIVE WEEKS. Sure, it's infinitely more simple than what we play now (and objectively awful), but that's batshit insane to me.

    Hell, back before the Atari bust it was everyone and their mother shitting out games purely for money. Not for the "art of the craft" or because they may be "passionate" or anything, it was purely because there was a large install base of consoles and companies wanted to make as much money as quickly as possible so the market was absolutely flooded with garbage.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Afrospinach View Post
    Do you really believe that?

    They are going to forsake their core customer for a "me too" play which has been the bane of the industry for the last decade or so. A dollar today and nothing tomorrow.
    Yea I do. I think AcBlizz will continue to serve both markets to the best of their ability. Because that would bring more money than just serving one market.

    Whether or not PC remains their core market remains to be seen. But again, it doesn't matter to them and it's only logical to shift your core market if

    1) it's more profitable
    2) you have the skills to pull it off

    I believe all this hate comes from how Diablo Immortal was managed and their failures at Blizzcon. But I think they have learned from that communication mistakes around Diablo Immortal.

    But this toxicity due to absolute business ignorance would drive me away from this "core market" if I was responsible at AcBlizz.

  6. #26
    Well Blizz seems determined to prove that quantity and quality don't tend to match.

  7. #27
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    Mobile games are awful. It's all gacha and cash grabbing with no substance, it's not like actual legitimate portable gaming like the 3DS which wasn't hindered by a touch screen for game interaction.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by StayTuned View Post
    But this toxicity due to absolute business ignorance would drive me away from this "core market" if I was responsible at AcBlizz.
    That is a big WTF mate. Yes giving a middle finger to your customers is definitely worth the risk because there are "other" people on the planet

    Are two cupcakes bigger than a chocolate gateaux?

    2 is more than 1 - Staytuned.

    What does Blizzard stand for? Since their rise in the mid 90s to now they have been making atmospheric story driven titles. It has only been getting more and more grand. Arguably they have the most defined fingerprint in the industry. The most defined brand. Is more better? Since you seem to like the real basics lets go back to something you would have been taught at business school. The pepsi guy:

    So clearly 2 is more than 1. If you sell 2 products it is more than selling 1 product - a quantifiable (but sadly not a qualitative) metric. So when pepsi guy took over this successful company called Apple clearly the go was to diversify the portfolio, more products, more markets, more business, a law like gravity . Eventually he almost destroyed the company with this approach. Jobs came back and did the exact opposite and repeated his success again. Clearly having a brand image/focus is worth something - this is something everyone already knew though.

    So what about Blizzard entertainment's current branding is in lockstep with mobile gaming? Other than they are both games I am going to say that mobile gaming is a polar opposite to what Blizzard stands for. Cheap, tacky gone in a minute thrills. Now would be a good time to remind you that the company under who's umbrella Blizzard resides has an entire unit dedicated to shoveling mobile shit. There is not some desperation for engagement on the platform here. Therefore, this is clearly a push to use Blizzard's name to shovel even more shit.

    The warning shots have been fired. Diablo immortal announced to possibly the worst reception to a game I can remember other than that garbage valve released a while ago. Stocks down 7%. Guess they don't know what you know. Warcraft 3 released and is panned. Garbage release. This is a company that can make mistakes with blue chip IPs and WILL get punished for it.

    It is all well and good to say there are all these opportunities everywhere but they are demonstrably not without pitfalls ok? 2 is more than 1 is far too rudimentary. They actually do have something to lose. Why is every Blizzard release breaking records? Do you understand that could all go away if the brand finds itself being used as toilet paper by Kotick's mobile shitware division?

    I am not that worried though, because a: drivel like this gets spouted all the time and b: well, TBH they have damaged themselves a lot already so why the fuck not go out with an absolute whorish sellout.
    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.

  9. #29
    I hate that direction, but they're a business. And there is a TON of business in the mobile market, it would be stupid of them not to try and capitalize on that.

  10. #30
    As long as they continue to pump out content for PC, and I guess consoles, I don't care.


    But that leads to the issue of their focus on mobile throttling their ability to pump out said content quality-wise. If they feel that the mobile market is the best option to make their money and stay afloat, then I'll take that evil if staying afloat also means being able to maintain the other games like WoW or Diablo or Overwatch or whatever.


    At the end of the day, I think most people knew Activision-Blizzard was going to floor it on mobile games. Diablo Immortal is only the beginning.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Jshadowhunter View Post
    Are you saying that OG blizzard came into existence for the SOLE reason of making money and not making money while doing something they loved and enjoyed?
    Yes. You don't make a business without the first thought being "How much money will I make." if you think otherwise you are so naive I don't believe you have even entered highschool or your nations equivilent

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Jshadowhunter View Post
    Are you saying that OG blizzard came into existence for the SOLE reason of making money and not making money while doing something they loved and enjoyed?

    This is a very naive take. Too naive. I don't see how you can care enough to make a thread about the topic, yet still think posing this question was a good idea.


    Are you saying that Activision-Blizzard should have not adapted to the times and instead should have gone under sometime in the past?

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    Guess I am taking a ride along because I agree, as a gamer I hate this but this is where the money is. The problem really is the lack of regulation in that market since it's gaming companies becoming gambling ones nowadays.
    Publishers are and always have been the problem, publishers that buy game devs up under their flag and run them with an iron grip. The same problem reared its face in the music industry for many many decades and it is the real reason many people who work in both industries are grossly underpaid.
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  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Afrospinach View Post
    That is a big WTF mate. Yes giving a middle finger to your customers is definitely worth the risk because there are "other" people on the planet

    Are two cupcakes bigger than a chocolate gateaux?

    2 is more than 1 - Staytuned.

    What does Blizzard stand for? Since their rise in the mid 90s to now they have been making atmospheric story driven titles. It has only been getting more and more grand. Arguably they have the most defined fingerprint in the industry. The most defined brand. Is more better? Since you seem to like the real basics lets go back to something you would have been taught at business school. The pepsi guy:

    So clearly 2 is more than 1. If you sell 2 products it is more than selling 1 product - a quantifiable (but sadly not a qualitative) metric. So when pepsi guy took over this successful company called Apple clearly the go was to diversify the portfolio, more products, more markets, more business, a law like gravity . Eventually he almost destroyed the company with this approach. Jobs came back and did the exact opposite and repeated his success again. Clearly having a brand image/focus is worth something - this is something everyone already knew though.

    So what about Blizzard entertainment's current branding is in lockstep with mobile gaming? Other than they are both games I am going to say that mobile gaming is a polar opposite to what Blizzard stands for. Cheap, tacky gone in a minute thrills. Now would be a good time to remind you that the company under who's umbrella Blizzard resides has an entire unit dedicated to shoveling mobile shit. There is not some desperation for engagement on the platform here. Therefore, this is clearly a push to use Blizzard's name to shovel even more shit.

    The warning shots have been fired. Diablo immortal announced to possibly the worst reception to a game I can remember other than that garbage valve released a while ago. Stocks down 7%. Guess they don't know what you know. Warcraft 3 released and is panned. Garbage release. This is a company that can make mistakes with blue chip IPs and WILL get punished for it.

    It is all well and good to say there are all these opportunities everywhere but they are demonstrably not without pitfalls ok? 2 is more than 1 is far too rudimentary. They actually do have something to lose. Why is every Blizzard release breaking records? Do you understand that could all go away if the brand finds itself being used as toilet paper by Kotick's mobile shitware division?

    I am not that worried though, because a: drivel like this gets spouted all the time and b: well, TBH they have damaged themselves a lot already so why the fuck not go out with an absolute whorish sellout.
    The fuck is all that?

    I put core market in quotation marks for a purpose. The toxic vocal minority is NOT AcBlizz's core market.

    Most people will not care if Activision Blizzard invests and produces mobile games of every IP they own.

    Only the business ignorant will still ramble about "old days", "PC exclusive", and all that inane shit.

    Diablo Immortal is only a failure for that vocal minority. Again, most mobile gamers would have played it. Heck, even most PC gamers would have at least gave it a try. The problem was timing and style of the announcement. Don't announce mobile games on a PC focused con.

    A minute snapshot of falling stocks isn't a death sentence. If their mobile market sky rockets, and with access to the Chinese market it might just happen, their stocks will sure enough rise again. Because guess what, the people giving Blizzard money only care about one thing: royalties, dividends, money.

    Remember Hearthstone? You consider that a failure? I bet investment to profit ratio is probably the highest in their whole portfolio.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I was also going to let your stupid Apple comparison slide but I just cannot.

    First of all, when Steve Jobs recognized the need for a focus on a single product, he did it with the idea of a core product + brand recognition.

    Blizzard is past that stage already. They were THE Diablo and Warcraft company. Now they're moving on.

    Imagine someone told Apple to

    *Not invest into the phone market, because omg they do PCs
    *Not invest into the watch market, because omg they do PCs
    *Not invest into Cloud technology, because they're not a Webhoster, they do PC!

    Market diversification is core of every company that wants to expland beyond their current limitations. The PC exclusive gamer market is saturated. There are opportunities to pursue. If they don't follow it, they potentially invoke the distrust of their share holders. If they do, they lose a few narcissistic die hards.

    Sounds like an easy decision for me. I'd even go into console gaming, too. But that opens another can of worms. Mobile game is the safer choice at the moment.

  15. #35
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    I forget are we still pretending the exponential growth numbers tech companies see coming out of China aren't totally fraudulent, or did they give up that ruse after Diablo Immortal's reception flopped?
    "Multiculturalism has failed!" angrily types a person of European descent living in the Americas in a Germanic language using Roman characters on a device coded with Arabic numerals before leaving in a huff to go watch cartoons made in Japan.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Mobile games are awful. It's all gacha and cash grabbing with no substance
    Only if you have a very basic knowledge of mobile games, sure.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post

    Do they make more money over the next year off the "core customers", or the new stuff?

    If it's the latter, that's why they're pushing to serve the market that offers them more. Those "core customers" aren't paying the bills.
    It really wouldn't be hard to get back to popularity on the PC platform, but considering how much they've bungled recent projects, or in the case of Heroes of the Storm and Overwatch, invested millions into products that haven't been successful. HotS is pretty much dead at this point and OW has been bleeding players for years, yet they think an OW reboot/sequel is going to keep the game going.

    Then you have the crap factory that was Warcraft 3 Remastered, a half ass, buggy and absolutely stupid release. Even Diablo 3 had its failures in how the game was designed, resulting in a short period of popularity and some of the features that released with the game pissed people off. How many stupid game design decisions do they have to keep making before they accept blame for them? It's called accountability, and the fans are holding them to it for making mediocre games rather than being apologists for their trash.
    Last edited by Rennadrel; 2020-11-03 at 03:07 PM.

  18. #38
    Mobile games are trash imo when you have the option for pc or console gaming. But have no issues with people enjoying them just that I rather play games on either a monster pc or on console with my 4k ready TV.

    Can't remember the last time I even played a mobile game, snake on Nokia 3310 perhaps.
    Last edited by ParanoiD84; 2020-11-03 at 03:14 PM.
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  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    I forget are we still pretending the exponential growth numbers tech companies see coming out of China aren't totally fraudulent, or did they give up that ruse after Diablo Immortal's reception flopped?
    Eh, I feel Diablo Immortal would have been better received, if it wouldn't have been revealed in Blizzcon as a major event. Blizzard has always been about PC gaming first and foremost, and it's a complete misread of your own audience to assume a mobile game would be well received in such an environment. Like throwing broccoli in to a pool full on hungry sharks.

    "Do you guys not have phones?"
    Quote Originally Posted by Ransath View Post
    Money laundering, especially prior to his election? I couldn't give a flying fuck.

  20. #40
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    Eh, I feel Diablo Immortal would have been better received, if it wouldn't have been revealed in Blizzcon as a major event. Blizzard has always been about PC gaming first and foremost, and it's a complete misread of your own audience to assume a mobile game would be well received in such an environment. Like throwing broccoli in to a pool full on hungry sharks.

    "Do you guys not have phones?"
    They fired people up thinking Diablo 4 was gonna be announced, and then announced Diablo Immortal. That's why there was backlash, exactly.

    If they'd announced Immortal alongside a PC release of 4, nobody would've cared. It was the marketing; "Hey, all you PC gamers, we got something special for you! A mobile game!" Ensue gnashing of teeth and wailing.

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