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  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    Whether 3rd parties use the API is not relevant when discussing whether Overwolf meets user needs
    This entire discussion though would be irrelevant then. Because it is not about the needs being fullfilled or not. Because hosting and delivering addons is a need that Overwolf is filling. All of the arguments against Overwolf has nothing to do with needs. But luxuries. They don't want ads. They don't want data mining. Etc Etc. Those are all luxuries. A lot of the objections are things that both Curse and Amazon likely did.

    Are some of the concern legitimate? Sure. But it has nothing to do with the function of the an app to download addons. And lets be fair the only real problem with the current Curseforge app is that it requires a secondary app to be installed. The main Overwolf client while essentially the same as Twitch it isn't integrated like the Mods tab is so it feels different.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  2. #282
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    Then go ahead and create alternative that also pays money for addon authors. Good luck with that.
    And you also mistake couple of tinfoil hats on forum for majority of wow players. I can assure you, most people will be using overwolf whatever you like it or not.

    Yes you can seek alternatives as end user but you just won't find one nor you will be able to create one since you are just too small and dont have money.
    Where have I said that I want to make a new platform myself? Where have I said that the majority of WoW players wont use Curseforge? I have said neither of these things and you've simply ascribed them to me to invent strawmen. The fact of the matter is that I don't, personally, care that much about the platform; however, I acknowledge people's issues with Overwolf and am comfortable enough in my position to discuss both the issues with and the benefits of Overwolf.

    Also there is absolutely nothing wrong with user experience since it boils down to open curseforge, click update all, close and forget till next month.
    As I've said, it's fine that you do not care about user experience. People have, throughout the thread, pointed out issues they have with Overwolf as relating to the experience they've had with other applications owned by Overwolf as well as issues they have with the company's predatory/malicious practices, including claims of security issues with their services. If you want to boil it down to any experience they will have, or any issues they have, with the addon manager to a single, incredibly abstract, happy path scenario, you can, but, again, it's still just handwaving problems that people have by saying "this is not a problem, move on".
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  3. #283
    "On 11/30 - addons will only be available via the CurseForge app. Additionally, the mods tab will no longer be available in the Twitch Desktop App."

    Nothing like a little change in branding to "Curseforge" app due to the negative reaction to the "Overwolf" app.

    It looks like they will remove access to the site for other apps on the 30th.

    I've always manually installed addons. This announcement makes it sound like maybe that will no longer be an option. I hope that isn't the case. I would hate to abandon addons.

  4. #284
    No thanks. I will keep using WoWUp until they cut them off (Lol) then I will just manually install from GitHub.

    Curse is dead to me, and Overwolf can go fuck themselves.
    Scheduled weekly maintenance caught me by surprise.

  5. #285
    Quote Originally Posted by Kinjin View Post
    Nothing like a little change in branding to "Curseforge" app due to the negative reaction to the "Overwolf" app.
    They have always been selling it as a Curseforge dedicated app on Overwolf. Nothing was rebranded or changed. Also that doesn't say anything that you are claiming. All it is saying is that Twitch will no longer have addons and you will need to use the Curseforge app instead. The website will allow downloads.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    This entire discussion though would be irrelevant then. Because it is not about the needs being fullfilled or not. Because hosting and delivering addons is a need that Overwolf is filling. All of the arguments against Overwolf has nothing to do with needs. But luxuries. They don't want ads. They don't want data mining. Etc Etc. Those are all luxuries. A lot of the objections are things that both Curse and Amazon likely did.

    Are some of the concern legitimate? Sure. But it has nothing to do with the function of the an app to download addons. And lets be fair the only real problem with the current Curseforge app is that it requires a secondary app to be installed. The main Overwolf client while essentially the same as Twitch it isn't integrated like the Mods tab is so it feels different.
    While 3rd party applications have been a main focus in the discussion, they're not actually very relevant to the core discussion around user experience, which is sort-of what the discussion I'm having in the quote has boiled down to. The issues users have aren't contingent on the 3rd parties existing, but it can act as an example of what users prefer in their experience and it helps users convey what they specifically don't like about the Overwolf through comparison. I do appreciate what you're saying, that users seem to prefer these platforms because of various quality of life benefits (such as no ads.) and security benefits (i.e.: no data mining, whose legality I'm dubious about for an international organization due to things like GDPR); however, many of these are just aspects of how a user interfaces with an application and affect the user's experience when using the application.

    Usability is a need. If an application is functional but users have a bad experience then the application is, for all intents, not meeting the needs of a user. For example, if you had a website and instead of having stylized pages with a proper CSS framework (such as SASS, SCSS, or LESS) you made it a dump of directory links and links to HTML pages, the argument could be applied that the user needs are being met because this application may have the same or similar functionality to the better designed PWAMP. Obviously this is an incredibly extreme example, but it's just to illustrate the point that functionality needs to be tempered by user experience. To put it another way, user experience is, effectively, a functional requirement for users.

    However, that's not to say that Overwolf is necessarily going to be a bad experience for everyone, in fact I think it would be fair to say that the majority of people will likely be OK with the addon manager. My points are more based on principle, that user experience matters as a requirement and Overwolf, by virtue of the backlash they have been receiving, seems to not be meeting user needs. A lot of people seem to be interested in handwaving the problems people have, though I agree, and have said earlier in the thread, there are definitely issues that users have which can and should probably be scrutinized to a degree. A good example that you brought up was advertisement, and user's issues with advertisement and supporting the platform is likely one of the reasons it was likely sold to Overwolf; the userbase's unwillingness to support the platform is causing it to be sold to companies who can monetize it better, which is going to lead to worse user interactions.
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  7. #287
    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    by virtue of the backlash they have been receiving, seems to not be meeting user needs. A lot of people seem to be interested in handwaving the problems people have, though I agree, and have said earlier in the thread, there are definitely issues that users have which can and should probably be scrutinized to a degree. A good example that you brought up was advertisement, and user's issues with advertisement and supporting the platform is likely one of the reasons it was likely sold to Overwolf; the userbase's unwillingness to support the platform is causing it to be sold to companies who can monetize it better, which is going to lead to worse user interactions.
    Tough luck and nothing to solve since problem really doesn't exist. If you have some immaginative problem with their addon manager you can always use website and that is. There is no alternative and I hope they will cut down leechers.

    How would you like if people used your things you built, you paid for and you maintain in a way it doesn't give you anything in return, thru a backdoor?

  8. #288
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    it is a solution because problem doesn't exist anywhere except people's minds. It isn't a problem. Just use the client is the solution.
    You seem very happy trying to speak for everyone when you clearly have no clue what other people think/like.

    Try gain some perspective outside of your own bounds before you make such broad statements in the future, okay?

  9. #289
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    Tough luck and nothing to solve since problem really doesn't exist. If you have some immaginative problem with their addon manager you can always use website and that is. There is no alternative and I hope they will cut down leechers.

    How would you like if people used your things you built, you paid for and you maintain in a way it doesn't give you anything in return, thru a backdoor?
    OK, so I'm just going to assume that you have simply not at all kept up with the thread at all, as the alternative is that you have decided to pivot away to avoid engaging with what is being said. I'm going to assume you're not just being a bad faith actor and that you've just not kept up with the thread. This is a quote one of my first posts in the thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    I've sort of put this opinion out before, but 3rd parties like WoWup are parasites that have plagued more notable addon managers for years by using their APIs in ways that aren't intended. All 3rd party managers that consume these endpoints should be assumed as having a limited lifecycle.
    With this quote in mind I'm going to ask you, very clearly as you seem to be ascribing motives and ideas to me which I have at no point professed, where have I said that 3rd party services which use the backend services of more notable addon managers is a good thing or should be supported? In case you have difficulty, I will answer this preemptively for you: I have not. Throughout this thread I've criticized both sides of the argument and acknowledged points that people have made which have merit, and you ascribing motives and ideas to me that I can easily prove as false through quoting posts of mine that say the exact opposite of what you are claiming I believe is not a great look.
    Sylvanas didn't even win the popular vote, she was elected by an indirect election of representatives. #NotMyWarchief

  10. #290
    hmmm, why would I use an addon manager to do something I can do myself?

    I wouldnt and you couldn't pay me to ever use Overwolf for anything.

    Have people really gotten so lazy with their addons that they need a manager for them ?

  11. #291
    I will use this topic - DO NOT, i repeat, DO NOT use WoWup to update ElvUI unless you want to start all over again.

  12. #292
    I'd rather update addons manually than install overwolf.

    +1

    And all adds will be blocked with maximum force. Fuck your monetisation curseforge.

  13. #293
    Quote Originally Posted by oblakoff View Post
    I will use this topic - DO NOT, i repeat, DO NOT use WoWup to update ElvUI unless you want to start all over again.
    What seems to be the issue?

    I've been updating ElvUI through WoWup and no problems at all.

  14. #294
    Quote Originally Posted by oblakoff View Post
    I will use this topic - DO NOT, i repeat, DO NOT use WoWup to update ElvUI unless you want to start all over again.
    Why?
    I updated yesterday and never had a problem

  15. #295
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Money?

    What else did you think?
    Well, they stand to lose users who are using the application, because of the lack of addon functionality. Some people watch streams and keep the app open for addons. If you don't need to have the app for addons and you don't open it daily, you probably will watch streams on average less, because the app is not there, open and giving you the random push to watch a stream. So, I suspect this will be a negative impact on Twitch's user base.

    Basically, addons and the app functionality enticed you to keep it open a lot of time and probably helped give you the push to watch twitch streams more often.

  16. #296
    Quote Originally Posted by Addiena View Post
    hmmm, why would I use an addon manager to do something I can do myself?

    I wouldnt and you couldn't pay me to ever use Overwolf for anything.

    Have people really gotten so lazy with their addons that they need a manager for them ?

    Nothing to do with lazy, imagine that people don't want to manually check and update their 50+ addons daily.

    We're living in 2020, you don't need to impose self-inflicted challenges over trivial shit.

  17. #297
    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    OK, so I'm just going to assume that you have simply not at all kept up with the thread at all, as the alternative is that you have decided to pivot away to avoid engaging with what is being said. I'm going to assume you're not just being a bad faith actor and that you've just not kept up with the thread. This is a quote one of my first posts in the thread:
    Bad faith is people spreading nonsense and outright lying about overwolf because "they heard something from someone". Their app works as intended, no issues whatsoever, no any valuable data is being collected and you are not being sold as a slave. This is getting ridiculous.

  18. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    Nothing to do with lazy, imagine that people don't want to manually check and update their 50+ addons daily.

    We're living in 2020, you don't need to impose self-inflicted challenges over trivial shit.
    Exactly, trying to keep up with 50+ addons manually just isn't feasible. I'm certainly not going to remember if I updated addon x or y since the last update when I have a ton of them. Pretty much anyone updating manually either has some addons that are extremely outdated or have less than 15 addons.

  19. #299
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    This entire discussion though would be irrelevant then. Because it is not about the needs being fullfilled or not. Because hosting and delivering addons is a need that Overwolf is filling. All of the arguments against Overwolf has nothing to do with needs. But luxuries. They don't want ads. They don't want data mining. Etc Etc. Those are all luxuries. A lot of the objections are things that both Curse and Amazon likely did.

    Are some of the concern legitimate? Sure. But it has nothing to do with the function of the an app to download addons. And lets be fair the only real problem with the current Curseforge app is that it requires a secondary app to be installed. The main Overwolf client while essentially the same as Twitch it isn't integrated like the Mods tab is so it feels different.
    I'm entirely against the notion that privacy should be seen as a luxury. Just as I don't like the idea of someone looking through my window as I read a book, I don't like the idea of someone seeing what musical window-shopping I'm doing online, either.

    & believe me, I'm well aware that concealing your digital footprint is impossible without not connecting to the net, but that doesn't devalue wanting to shut some of those windows. Why open another window when other apps can do what Overwolf does but faster & more politely?

  20. #300
    Quote Originally Posted by Toybox View Post
    Why open another window when other apps can do what Overwolf does but faster & more politely?
    Because it's unauthorized access similar to scrapping, not contributing to platform, not contributing to authors in any way.
    This is a mindset of demanding karen that just wants everything for free without giving anything in return because you deserve it.

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