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  1. #141
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Well I hate political parties and identity groups such as ethno-nationalists. They're not based on an idea or a principle.
    Party platforms and ethno-nationalism in specific are, obviously, ideas/principles.

    I have no idea why you're lying this blatantly and deliberately, but that's what you're doing.


  2. #142
    Over 9000! Milchshake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Well I hate political parties and identity groups such as ethno-nationalists. They're not based on an idea or a principle.
    Your posts are the opposite of this. You're constantly obscuring the connections of ethno-nationalists to mainstream parties ... to the benefit of the ethno-nationalists.

    It's classic DARVO strategy used to gaslight vulnerable people.
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  3. #143
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Party platforms and ethno-nationalism in specific are, obviously, ideas/principles.

    I have no idea why you're lying this blatantly and deliberately, but that's what you're doing.
    In the US our two main parties are not based on their own unique principle or idea. The libertarian party is an example of a party that is actually based on its own unique principle(liberty) but even then I would say people should never be loyal to the party but they should only be loyal to the underlying principle.

    For white ethno-nationalism that's based on loyalty to genes and skin color as opposed to something that purely exists as an idea or a principle that is not exclusive to any one sub-group.
    Last edited by PC2; 2020-11-18 at 07:38 PM.

  4. #144
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    In the US our two main parties are not based on their own unique principle or idea. The libertarian party is an example of a party that is actually based on its own unique principle(liberty) but even then I would say people should never be loyal to the party but they should only be loyal to the underlying principle.
    That claim is false. The Democrats and Republicans both stand for platforms and ideas. If they didn't, there would be no identifiable difference between the two. And there clearly is.

    For white ethno-nationalism that's based on loyalty to genes and skin color as opposed to something that purely exists as an idea or a principle that is not exclusive to any one sub-group.
    That literally is an idea.

    You're lying, and gaslighting. Nothing you are posting here is done with honest good faith.


  5. #145
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    For white ethno-nationalism that's based on loyalty to genes and skin color as opposed to something that purely exists as an idea or a principle that is not exclusive to any one sub-group.
    The idea is that one race or culture is superior.

  6. #146
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    That claim is false. The Democrats and Republicans both stand for platforms and ideas. If they didn't, there would be no identifiable difference between the two. And there clearly is.
    Okay so I'm saying a person should only be loyal to the ideas they support and they should never be loyal to a political party. That's my two cents.
    That literally is an idea.

    You're lying, and gaslighting. Nothing you are posting here is done with honest good faith.
    I said "purely exists as an idea". A person's whiteness or brownness is derived from genetic values and skin pigmentation which means it does not qualify because it does not exist purely as an idea.

  7. #147
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    I said "purely exists as an idea". A person's whiteness or brownness is derived from genetic values and skin pigmentation which means it does not qualify because it does not exist purely as an idea.
    In order for ethno-nationalism to function, there has to be a way to identify in-group members so there has to be a collection of ideas concerning who is and isn't included. There are also is a collection of political ideas on how to achieve racial hegemony.
    https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-h...te-nationalist

    I really don't know what you are trying to achieve here.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    In order for ethno-nationalism to function, there has to be a way to identify in-group members so there has to be a collection of ideas concerning who is and isn't included. There are also is a collection of political ideas on how to achieve racial hegemony.
    https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-h...te-nationalist

    I really don't know what you are trying to achieve here.
    He's trying to muddy the waters to deflect for racists. The dude literally said he'd vote for Hitler.

  9. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Okay so I'm saying a person should only be loyal to the ideas they support and they should never be loyal to a political party. That's my two cents.
    Does a political party have a set of ideas?

    I said "purely exists as an idea". A person's whiteness or brownness is derived from genetic values and skin pigmentation which means it does not qualify because it does not exist purely as an idea.
    What about this denotes superiority?
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  10. #150
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Okay so I'm saying a person should only be loyal to the ideas they support and they should never be loyal to a political party. That's my two cents.
    Political parties represent ideas.

    I already pointed that out. You're just gaslighting.

    I said "purely exists as an idea". A person's whiteness or brownness is derived from genetic values and skin pigmentation which means it does not qualify because it does not exist purely as an idea.
    Adding "purely" does not change anything. It's still nothing more than an idea.

    Again, you're simply gaslighting.


  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    No that's absurd. Anthropogenic climate change will only cause the average temperature to increase by a few degrees where as the sun expanding will create numbers that are 100x higher. You must be insane if you think they are comparable and that the means of civilization cannot function if the average temperature is only a few degrees higher.
    Bro. I had this conversation with you a few dozen times, but you keep pushing this simplistic intellectually challenged dumbass argument.

    Do you know what is the average temperature difference between the Sahara and Sicily? 5 fucking degrees Fahrenheit. That is the difference between decently liveable and upper edge of what is tolerable for human habitability.

    The issue isn't with the average. The issue is with the EXTREMES OF THE AVERAGE. When your average increases by 2 degrees you get those heat waves that push every fucking hurricane into a category 5, it's what causes the droughts that wipe out every staple crop year after fucking year, what causes the fucking droughts that cause those fucking forest fires where you can't see the sky for 6 weeks a year in 5 states. It's those heat waves that light THE FUCKING ARCTIC ON FIRE FOR 3 MONTHS IN THE SUMMER and interrupt the winter ice formation cycle. It causes the fucking Red tides that kill every fucking living thing in entire continent sized swaths of ocean.

    This has been explained to you over and over and over and over and over and over and over and but you keep fucking repeating this fucking dumb shit. PLEASE, AT LEAST UPDATE YOUR REPERTOIRE OF STUPID. Come up with something new please.

  12. #152
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    In order for ethno-nationalism to function, there has to be a way to identify in-group members so there has to be a collection of ideas concerning who is and isn't included. There are also is a collection of political ideas on how to achieve racial hegemony.
    https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-h...te-nationalist
    Right, I don't support identity-based tribalism when it comes to physical properties(e.g. skin color). It's the worst. If people want to form identity tribes around a pure idea such as liberty or equality then I have no problem with that.

    I really don't know what you are trying to achieve here.
    I was giving you my viewpoint. That's all I was trying to achieve.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    He's trying to muddy the waters to deflect for racists. The dude literally said he'd vote for Hitler.
    Nah, you know that's 100% fictional. I want humanity to grow in numbers and I don't want to see millions of people murdered in war and genocide. Your claim that I secretly support Hitler and his agenda is utterly bewildering to me.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Right, I don't support identity-based tribalism when it comes to physical properties(e.g. skin color). It's the worst. If people want to form identity tribes around a pure idea such as liberty or equality then I have no problem with that.



    I was giving you my viewpoint. That's all I was trying to achieve.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Nah, you know that's 100% fictional. I want humanity to grow in numbers and I don't want to see millions of people murdered in war and genocide. Your claim that I secretly support Hitler and his agenda is utterly bewildering to me.
    Nah, it's not.

    The Proud Boys are a bunch of violent racists.

    You said you'd vote for Hitler, stop trying to blame me for the choices you make in life.

  14. #154
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Nah, it's not.

    The Proud Boys are a bunch of violent racists.

    You said you'd vote for Hitler, stop trying to blame me for the choices you make in life.
    No that is 100% fictional and imaginary. I think you may be paranoid or something...

    For the Proud Boys I don't think most of them are violent but maybe most of them are racist. Society simply has to educate them about why racism is incorrect and that all people are equal and should be treated as individuals based on the merit of their behavior. The fastest way to do that is to have calm rational discussions with them and to not be so angry, paranoid, and hysterical.
    Last edited by PC2; 2020-11-18 at 09:49 PM.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    No that is 100% fictional and imaginary. I think you may be paranoid or something...

    For the Proud Boys I don't think most of them are violent but maybe most of them are racist. Society simply has to educate them about why racism is incorrect and that all people are equal and should be treated as individuals based on the merit of their behavior. The fastest way to do that is to have calm rational discussions with them and to not be so angry, paranoid, and hysterical.
    If you still need a education on why racisme is bad then you are beyond saving. These people turned racist because they got the education.
    And really low bar when you say "most of them aren't violent", that just is agreeing that a large numbers of them are.

  16. #156
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    No that is 100% fictional and imaginary. I think you may be paranoid or something...
    I think he's referencing this post.

    For the Proud Boys I don't think most of them are violent but maybe most of them are racist. Society simply has to educate them about why racism is incorrect and that all people are equal and should be treated as individuals based on the merit of their behavior. The fastest way to do that is to have calm rational discussions with them and to not be so angry, paranoid, and hysterical.
    It's funny when people say that others are acting paranoid or being hysterical. Like, how many times have people been warning about white nationalist behavior and been treated dismissively or gaslighted by saying it wasn't happening. Now we have several groups that are openly espousing these beliefs and there's people running for office with these beliefs. Also, these people want to have discussions, they want it to be on media and talk shows so they can spread their beliefs. If they are called out on it, they just label you paranoid or hysterical.


  17. #157
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ati87 View Post
    If you still need a education on why racisme is bad then you are beyond saving.
    Do you think a felon who murdered someone is beyond saving or can they be rehabilitated? I think even felons who actually committed a crime can be rehabilitated so I certainly don't buy into the idea that racists in 2020 are "beyond saving". That attitude either comes from laziness or it could be because you feel too much anger and so you would rather just hate them instead of seeking improvement and reconciliation.
    These people turned racist because they got the education.
    I don't understand this. Education should refer to true knowledge so I don't understand how education could have turned them into racists.
    And really low bar when you say "most of them aren't violent", that just is agreeing that a large numbers of them are.
    Even if all of them are violent it still wouldn't change anything because you can't punish people until you get explicit evidence on each person. Of course you can "watch them" but our executive branch already does watch the people who are eminent threats.

  18. #158
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    No that is 100% fictional and imaginary. I think you may be paranoid or something...

    For the Proud Boys I don't think most of them are violent but maybe most of them are racist. Society simply has to educate them about why racism is incorrect and that all people are equal and should be treated as individuals based on the merit of their behavior. The fastest way to do that is to have calm rational discussions with them and to not be so angry, paranoid, and hysterical.
    If you could explain to racists why racism is stupid counterfactual bullshit, and they'd listen and change their minds as a result, there wouldn't be any racists. It would have ended back in the 19th Century. It didn't, because that flatly does not happen. It not only is not the fastest option, it isn't even an option to begin with. Racism is not adopted rationally, and thus cannot be deprogrammed through reason and logic.

    Even people who are successful with deprogramming extremists know this. That's why they aim for emotional connections with these people; because those kinds of connections are the only hope they have of getting past their programming.

    This is basic knowledge stuff, and you're disputing it. That's what gaslighting looks like. You're flatly incorrect about facts, here.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Do you think a felon who murdered someone is beyond saving or can they be rehabilitated?
    This is a dishonest false equivalence.

    Rehabilitation is a desired outcome, but not an expectation, of incarceration. It's also not something that can be brought about by the State; it has to be desired by the convict, fundamentally. It's their process, not the State's.

    Nobody's saying racists can't give up on their racism and rehabilitate themselves. We're disputing your nonsensical view that it's just a lack of education that leads to them being racist, and that just telling them racism is wrong is all that's needed to reform a racist. Which is lunacy.


  19. #159
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    I think he's referencing this post.
    Yeah it's a hypothetical which is imaginary and fictional... From 2 years ago... But for whatever reason Machismo wants to believe I truly support Hitler.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post

    Nah, you know that's 100% fictional. I want humanity to grow in numbers and I don't want to see millions of people murdered in war and genocide. Your claim that I secretly support Hitler and his agenda is utterly bewildering to me.
    He didn't say anything about your support for Hitler being "secret"

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