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  1. #1

    "Deals reduced damage beyond 5 targets."

    it's the new change to Demon Hunter Elysian Decree Target Cap and you know what, this change should be apply to all those abilities limited to 5 targets, it will make the aoe farm more enjoyable.

  2. #2
    The whole target cap thing itself is stupid in the first place and next expansion blizz will remove it with another "Well this didn't work like we hoped and we've learned our lesson this time for real guys" message.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Drakainen View Post
    The whole target cap thing itself is stupid in the first place and next expansion blizz will remove it with another "Well this didn't work like we hoped and we've learned our lesson this time for real guys" message.
    Probably but for now let's just make it more bearable.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Schmilblick View Post
    it's the new change to Demon Hunter Elysian Decree Target Cap and you know what, this change should be apply to all those abilities limited to 5 targets, it will make the aoe farm more enjoyable.
    This is what people have said since the beginning of this change and even how it actually worked back in the day.

  5. #5
    I hate those changes Blizzard makes that nobody asked for. And then end up reverting it a few patches later.
    Is "detached" the right word here?

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Hyrja View Post
    I hate those changes Blizzard makes that nobody asked for. And then end up reverting it a few patches later.
    Is "detached" the right word here?
    Reining in AoE-Spam-Fest in M+ is certainly appreciated. So speak for yourself, not others.

  7. #7
    The problem isn't that target caps exist.

    The problem is that there's still some uncapped abilities.

    So rather than reigning in the AoE in M+, all they're doing is pidgeon-holing comps into those specs that can use highly effective uncapped AoE so they can keep doing insano mass pulls. It also does fucked up shit to talent choices, like picking Dragon's Roar over Bladestorm for warrior's because uncapped > capped.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    Reining in AoE-Spam-Fest in M+ is certainly appreciated. So speak for yourself, not others.
    Yeah, wouldn't want people to focus on AoE in AoE content.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    The problem isn't that target caps exist.

    The problem is that there's still some uncapped abilities.

    So rather than reigning in the AoE in M+, all they're doing is pidgeon-holing comps into those specs that can use highly effective uncapped AoE so they can keep doing insano mass pulls. It also does fucked up shit to talent choices, like picking Dragon's Roar over Bladestorm for warrior's because uncapped > capped.
    It's also that content isn't designed around the cap existing and the damage numbers aren't tuned around the caps. Uncapped specs aren't actually doing less DPS than capped specs until you reach the cap, which is the only way for it to actually work.
    If spec A is capped at 5 and spec B is uncapped, spec A needs to do more damage until you pass 5 targets, otherwise it's just objectively weaker. Currently they do comparable damage, in some cases even with the uncapped spec winning. It's the same shit as with burst vs sustained, where sustained has to do more overall damage because burst has inherent advantages over sustained damage. Blizzard is just afraid of actually doing these things, because then then the uncapped specs and burst specs would complain.
    Last edited by Tradu; 2020-11-12 at 08:07 AM.
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Tradu View Post
    Yeah, wouldn't want people to focus on AoE in AoE content
    It's not supposed to be mass AoE content. That's the entire problem, and you know...





    ...the reason why most mob packs are 2-5 mobs.

  10. #10
    wouldn't you lose all the technical/performance benefits by doing that? and wasn't that the big reason to limit the targets?

    but yeah it does certainly feel like a very artificial limit.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    wouldn't you lose all the technical/performance benefits by doing that? and wasn't that the big reason to limit the targets?

    but yeah it does certainly feel like a very artificial limit.
    Wasn't that a community made up reason?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    It's not supposed to be mass AoE content. That's the entire problem, and you know...





    ...the reason why most mob packs are 2-5 mobs.
    Except it's timed content and the best way to save time is to combine multiple packs into 1 pull. It's literally the core of M+ routing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Wasn't that a community made up reason?
    Yes, it was.
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  13. #13
    Immortal Nnyco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyrja View Post
    I hate those changes Blizzard makes that nobody asked for. And then end up reverting it a few patches later.
    Is "detached" the right word here?
    The only thing i see detached here is your comment. Aoe balance was necessary since.... always. If anything is the problem is that it took em 15years to figure it out.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    The only thing i see detached here is your comment. Aoe balance was necessary since.... always. If anything is the problem is that it took em 15years to figure it out.
    They're not actually balancing AoE by capping some specs and leaving others uncapped. They still need to actually balance the numbers, and the target caps make doing so harder if anything.
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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Hyrja View Post
    I hate those changes Blizzard makes that nobody asked for. And then end up reverting it a few patches later.
    Is "detached" the right word here?
    Nah i am immensly happy for that aoe nerf. CLasses who have not OP AoE get a chance.. maybe now
    I (and many others i know) asked for that for a long time.

  16. #16
    As a shadow priest / affliction warlock I see no problem with this new change guys, what are you all crying about?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Tradu View Post

    Yes, it was.
    Ah, as usual then.

  18. #18
    Immortal Nnyco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tradu View Post
    They're not actually balancing AoE by capping some specs and leaving others uncapped. They still need to actually balance the numbers, and the target caps make doing so harder if anything.
    The spells that are uncapped usually wouldnt work with a target cap, those however do reduced dmg after X targets.

    I fail to see how balancing becomes harder compared to how it worked before where some classes cap at 5 while others aoe'd 50+ targets no problem.

    This entire post just smells to me like "My xmog run now takes two minutes longer, HOW DARE YOU BLIZZ."
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  19. #19
    I prefer the target soft cap on the generalist AoE. That way uncapped AoE is still stronger past 5 targets, and if balanced correctly, that means cleave ability (3 targets) would shine in situations where they do considerable damage compared to the other two AoE options.

    The problem comes from time limits in both raids and M+ and encounter design. No one wants cleave if they can't help clear things fast as is required, so they'll be stuck on lower clears or forced to use their respective aoe spec instead.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    The spells that are untarget usually wouldnt work with a target cap, those however do reduced dmg after X targets.

    I fail to see how balancing becomes harder compared to how it worked before where some classes cap at 5 while others aoe'd 50+ targets no problem.
    It becomes harder because to actually balance classes with wildly different target caps, the ones with lower caps would need to do more DPS until target count goes past their cap. And (more or less) everybody has been capped at 20 since like MoP. Having a bunch of different target caps also causes balance problems because they don't actually design around making different caps shine, which is partially tied to them not actually balancing the damage output properly.
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