Tyrande vs Sylvanas, where are we at

[Grazrug]

Sylvanas is the best. Tyrande is nothing. I hope Sylvanas defeats her in the most humiliating way possible so that all night elf fans get salty about it. This would be very satisfying.

Infracted.

[Claymore]

Characters are exactly as powerful as the story needs them to be. It will vary from scene to scene and from author to author.

Sucks, but this is absolutely true. Blizzard really showed throughout all of BFA, there was zero consistency. The ENTIRE ALLIANCE often fluctuated, where we only saw them lose in-game, sometimes we were told they were on the verge of winning the war, and then others we're told the combined might of the Alliance AND Horde forces wouldn't be enough to overthrow Sylvanas.

This expansion set the bar for storytelling so low, I honestly don't know Warcraft will honestly ever recover.

[Varodoc]

Sucks, but this is absolutely true. Blizzard really showed throughout all of BFA, there was zero consistency. The ENTIRE ALLIANCE often fluctuated, where we only saw them lose in-game, sometimes we were told they were on the verge of winning the war, and then others we're told the combined might of the Alliance AND Horde forces wouldn't be enough to overthrow Sylvanas.

This expansion set the bar for storytelling so low, I honestly don't know Warcraft will honestly ever recover.

That's because Sylvanas had the defenders' advantage, as she controlled one of the most fortified cities in the world. Garrosh had the same advantage. Even though he controlled only a minority of the orcs, he was able to hold out for long against the combined armies of the world. Historically, castles can be held out for months and even years just by a skeleton crew.

Had the battle taken place in open field, then it would be a very different story.

[Soon-TM]

Tired? Of what? Half an expansion of story? Let me guess, you'd love to have more Orc lore.

Considering that they belong to different factions, having one thing doesn't preclude from having the other. And yes, when it comes to Alliance NEs have had their "story focus" in half of Cata, a good part of Legion, half of BfA and we're getting yet another nelf themed zone in the !@#$ing Shadowlands, and even us Hordies will have to help her edgy, cringey ass. Enough is enough.

[cparle87]

Yeah, but I guess some expected she would kamehameha that part of the Eastern Plaguelands with a new moon spell.

During the fight Tyrande is playing with boyto.. Nathanos. Her main goal was to try and goad information out of him.
Otherwise she could have just sent that arrow through his head and be done with it.

Or as I noted, two moonfires would've been enough. She completely physically dominated him to try to get info.

[Xilurm]

Considering that they belong to different factions, having one thing doesn't preclude from having the other. And yes, when it comes to Alliance NEs have had their "story focus" in half of Cata, a good part of Legion, half of BfA and we're getting yet another nelf themed zone in the !@#$ing Shadowlands, and even us Hordies will have to help her edgy, cringey ass. Enough is enough.

You mean the part in Cata where their forests burn down? Amazing, such a good thing for Night Elf fans.

You mean the part in BFA where their forests burn down? Amazing, such a good thing for Night Elf fans.

If you think Tyrande is cringey then what does that make literally any other character in the game?

[Soon-TM]

You mean the part in Cata where their forests burn down? Amazing, such a good thing for Night Elf fans.

You mean the part in BFA where their forests burn down? Amazing, such a good thing for Night Elf fans.

If you think Tyrande is cringey then what does that make literally any other character in the game?

Blame Blizzard, that is the only "story focus" they are capable of. What else did you want? An avenging army what lays waste to the entirety of the Horde? Sorry, not going to happen. Besides, I never claimed that Tyrande was the only cringey character, there are others who are quite close: Sylvie, for starters.

[Feanoro]

Yeah, the only armies allowed to massively destroy are Horde's. We're very well aware.

Also, how the hell do you figure NElves got a lot of focus in Cata? Leveling was fixing damage from Deathwing and his koolaid chugging pals, the raids were dealing with Deathwing's forces including koolaid chuggers, second raid was Firelands to prevent Rags burning the world down, third raid was Dragon Shit. In between, we got to play shrink and marriage counselor to Thrall before being forced to attend his wedding.

Is even the fucking mention of "Alliance race got its ass handed to it, lol Alliance players" story focus in your eyes? We had multiple expansions about orcs and/or the Horde and its internal drama/politics, enough is enough. The other half of the paying customers would like something for their money that isn't "lol you suck, you got beaten without being able to fight, your zones are destroyed, don't like it, pay money to go Horde".

[Soon-TM]

We had multiple expansions about orcs and/or the Horde and its internal drama/politics, enough is enough..

Yeah, that much we can agree on

[LarryFromHumanResources]

Moonfire two wolves who have just under 79k health finish off a raid boss who had at least 150k health left with one blow? Sounds like a big deal to me.

Surely they had less health left when she did it, no?

[Broken Fox]

Sylvanas is redeemed and leads the raid on Tyrande's lair, who has gone mad with power. Malfurion dies in an ERP moment before the fight Majordomo style.

[jpch]

1. I say she is life because the Tears of Elune are basically the emerald dream. If you know about the dream and druids, it's all about life. Elune is peace, harmony. The Night Warrior is her wrath. I believe the pillar is a tear because the dream can never be a reality (qq), world/cosmos of peace, so ya she's basically life.
2. Tyrande struggles to kill an amalgamation with us in Torghast and she also leaves the maw. So i don't think we or her are that powerful.

You are just making assumption after assumption, state the source that says the tears of Elune are "Basically the Emerald dream"?
Elune is not harmony nor peace, she has two sides, which contradicts your argument of Life.
Tyrande does not struggle with anything, she leaves a trail of hundred corpses in the maw and kills the Amalgamation. She singlehandedly killed so many soldiers that the entities in the Maw ask Shandris about the power flowing into Tyrande. proof here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUMXPBvdy6A&t=23s

[Sarrgoth]

Personally, I believe Tyrande will be the " WOTLK-Tirion Fordring" of Shadowlands. Unless they drag her storyline into the next expansion. Night elves need a win for once.

As far as powerscaling, it's hard to say. Sylvanas hasn't had a proper "demonstration" of the power she has recieved and now she doesn't really have a goal, cuz she has achieved it.
Tyrande on the other hand has an agenda and a goal.

The whole Elune vs Zovaal is too early to discuss, since we have no solid information as to what Elune actually is. Elune has been speculated to be a god, a titan, creator of Naaru. And now you can guarantee it will be speculated she is an Eternal One.

Hopefully, Sylvanas will find herself on the rear-end of Tyrande's glaives. OR Malfurion will have his castration reversed and actually show how f****** powerful he is.

[Itori]

To be fair, we were cannon fodder so tyrande can come in and steal the spotlight like story characters usually do, and sylvanas took out an army of undead, the lich king, and now sits at the jailors side like some bad leia cosplayer thinking shes not just a pawn.

[Angrie]

You are just making assumption after assumption, state the source that says the tears of Elune are "Basically the Emerald dream"?
Elune is not harmony nor peace, she has two sides, which contradicts your argument of Life.
Tyrande does not struggle with anything, she leaves a trail of hundred corpses in the maw and kills the Amalgamation. She singlehandedly killed so many soldiers that the entities in the Maw ask Shandris about the power flowing into Tyrande. proof here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUMXPBvdy6A&t=23s

"The Tears of Elune are one of the Pillars of Creation and embody the dream of what Azeroth could be." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Tears_of_Elune


"Strongly associated with healing, tranquility and harmony, Elune is a goddess of peace, but she is not always a pacifist, as she does not advocate peace at all costs. One of her aspects is the Night Warrior, who takes the valiant among the dead and sets them riding across the sky as stars.[2][8][9] The Night Warrior is the incarnation of Elune's wrath." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Elune
What to gather from this:
1) Healing is restoring of life.
2) Tranquility is the state of peace; no fighting or war
3) Harmony is the the push-pull, ying-yang that life offers. Things must die in order to sustain life. Life and Death working together.

All sounds like LIFE to me!

The video you linked is EXACTLY what i referred to, thanks for linking it for everyone to see. What you failed to link is the events after that questline where we find out that Night Warriors can die. So based on this FACT, if Tyrande dies, she goes to the Maw. If she dies in the shadowlands she still goes to the Maw (see newest cinematic of shadowland denizens being dropped into the maw by Sire Denathrius). If Sylvanas dies, she likely goes to the Maw to be reincarnated for as long as she wants because...:

"The laws that bind the Shadowlands are meaningless within the Jailer's realm. Reality is ever changing within the Maw, which is continually altering itself to the whims of its singular master[15] who resides in Torghast, Tower of the Damned." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Maw

/thread

It appears to me that YOU are the one that needs a source and the one who is making assumptions.

[darkoms]

"The Tears of Elune are one of the Pillars of Creation and embody the dream of what Azeroth could be." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Tears_of_Elune


"Strongly associated with healing, tranquility and harmony, Elune is a goddess of peace, but she is not always a pacifist, as she does not advocate peace at all costs. One of her aspects is the Night Warrior, who takes the valiant among the dead and sets them riding across the sky as stars.[2][8][9] The Night Warrior is the incarnation of Elune's wrath." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Elune
What to gather from this:
1) Healing is restoring of life.
2) Tranquility is the state of peace; no fighting or war
3) Harmony is the the push-pull, ying-yang that life offers. Things must die in order to sustain life. Life and Death working together.

All sounds like LIFE to me!

The video you linked is EXACTLY what i referred to, thanks for linking it for everyone to see. What you failed to link is the events after that questline where we find out that Night Warriors can die. So based on this FACT, if Tyrande dies, she goes to the Maw. If she dies in the shadowlands she still goes to the Maw (see newest cinematic of shadowland denizens being dropped into the maw by Sire Denathrius). If Sylvanas dies, she likely goes to the Maw to be reincarnated for as long as she wants because...:

"The laws that bind the Shadowlands are meaningless within the Jailer's realm. Reality is ever changing within the Maw, which is continually altering itself to the whims of its singular master[15] who resides in Torghast, Tower of the Damned." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Maw

/thread

It appears to me that YOU are the one that needs a source and the one who is making assumptions.

Only if Elune doesn't save her from Maw

[jpch]

"The Tears of Elune are one of the Pillars of Creation and embody the dream of what Azeroth could be." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Tears_of_Elune


"Strongly associated with healing, tranquility and harmony, Elune is a goddess of peace, but she is not always a pacifist, as she does not advocate peace at all costs. One of her aspects is the Night Warrior, who takes the valiant among the dead and sets them riding across the sky as stars.[2][8][9] The Night Warrior is the incarnation of Elune's wrath." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Elune
What to gather from this:
1) Healing is restoring of life.
2) Tranquility is the state of peace; no fighting or war
3) Harmony is the the push-pull, ying-yang that life offers. Things must die in order to sustain life. Life and Death working together.

All sounds like LIFE to me!

The video you linked is EXACTLY what i referred to, thanks for linking it for everyone to see. What you failed to link is the events after that questline where we find out that Night Warriors can die. So based on this FACT, if Tyrande dies, she goes to the Maw. If she dies in the shadowlands she still goes to the Maw (see newest cinematic of shadowland denizens being dropped into the maw by Sire Denathrius). If Sylvanas dies, she likely goes to the Maw to be reincarnated for as long as she wants because...:

Elune is a goddess of peace, but she is not always a pacifist, as she does not advocate peace at all costs.
You conveniently forget about the Night Warrior which is incarnate of Elune's wrath!
1- Wrath is not peace, nor is "Warrior", nor the sisterhood of Elune which is known for its participation in hundreds of wars.
2- One of her aspects is healing which she is not limited to, she has other aspects which we are seeing. (Does not make her or Tyrande chosen of Life which was your previous argument)
3- Your final paragraph is just you going on and on with the conditional clause in your own fan fiction, we already know that the Night Warrior dies from Maiev and it is not relevant.

You cherry-pick information in a lore forum instead of debating canon as it is.

[Engal]

"The Tears of Elune are one of the Pillars of Creation and embody the dream of what Azeroth could be." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Tears_of_Elune


"Strongly associated with healing, tranquility and harmony, Elune is a goddess of peace, but she is not always a pacifist, as she does not advocate peace at all costs. One of her aspects is the Night Warrior, who takes the valiant among the dead and sets them riding across the sky as stars.[2][8][9] The Night Warrior is the incarnation of Elune's wrath." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Elune
What to gather from this:
1) Healing is restoring of life.
2) Tranquility is the state of peace; no fighting or war
3) Harmony is the the push-pull, ying-yang that life offers. Things must die in order to sustain life. Life and Death working together.

All sounds like LIFE to me!

The video you linked is EXACTLY what i referred to, thanks for linking it for everyone to see. What you failed to link is the events after that questline where we find out that Night Warriors can die. So based on this FACT, if Tyrande dies, she goes to the Maw. If she dies in the shadowlands she still goes to the Maw (see newest cinematic of shadowland denizens being dropped into the maw by Sire Denathrius). If Sylvanas dies, she likely goes to the Maw to be reincarnated for as long as she wants because...:

"The laws that bind the Shadowlands are meaningless within the Jailer's realm. Reality is ever changing within the Maw, which is continually altering itself to the whims of its singular master[15] who resides in Torghast, Tower of the Damned." - https://wow.gamepedia.com/Maw

/thread

It appears to me that YOU are the one that needs a source and the one who is making assumptions.

She is not life. She is balance, she is everything and nothing at the same time. She created the Naaru, she manipulates void, life, holy, etc.

How do you explain that the heart of X'era, a pure being of Light entity, reacted to the tear of Elune if this was about the emerald dream / life only ?

You are completely wrong on this.

Elune is at least, a Godess of Balance, manipulating every kind of energy in the universe. Eonar probably infused the tear of Elune with the power of Elune, this tear embody what the world could be, because Elune probably cares about azeroth more than we know, and she wept seeing Azeroth infested with old gods and such.

Moreover as stated just before, the Night Warrior is wrath, and is using void / shadow energy. It's the endless hungering power that eat Tyrande from the inside, and need to be fed.