1. #2961
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Not really, custom maps and multiplayer game modes aren't canon.
    That's great, but we're not talking about custom maps and multiplayer game modes, we're talking about heroes and characters.

    Speaking of heroes and characters, thanks for confirming that WC3:R is canon, thus confirming that Gazlowe is a Tinker that uses a claw pack, and that the claw pack is canon.

    Again, do you think Blizzard has canonized Pit Lords working for the Alliance and Horde just because they said the Games are canon? They never stated that game modes are canon.

    And if it was, then WoW would canonize it. If it's not in WoW or in the Warcraft 3 singleplayer campaign, then it's not canon.
    Again, do you think it's canon that a group of Horde adventurers went around Azeroth and murdered all of the Alliance's leaders in order to earn a mount? Obviously game modes are canon lore. We're talking about a GAME. However, if a character appeared in a Warcraft game, that character is canonized.

    The Tinker is such a character.

    And if you use Gazlowe as the standard to canonize the Clawpack, then it means Engineers have Claw Packs.
    Of course, Tinkers are a type of engineer.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2021-01-15 at 01:12 AM.

  2. #2962
    I don't want another new class. I want more cool stuff for existing classes.

  3. #2963
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Speaking of heroes and characters, thanks for confirming that WC3:R is canon, thus confirming that Gazlowe is a Tinker that uses a claw pack, and that the claw pack is canon.
    Where in any of the games is Gazlowe called a Tinker? lol.

    Canonically speaking, any Engineer would be able to use claw packs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Well, yes. Our opinions are below the canon lore of the game, because we're not the ones writing the lore.

  4. #2964
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Where in any of the games is Gazlowe called a Tinker? lol.

    Canonically speaking, any Engineer would be able to use claw packs.
    That's not what the canon says. The canon states plainly that Tinkers use claw packs. If Gazlowe has one, then he is in fact a Tinker, regardless of his title.

  5. #2965
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Blizzard isn’t going to use the mount models for class mechs though. In other words, even if Blizzard implemented Draenei Tinkers, they wouldn’t be piloting lightforged warframes.
    oh really?? did you speak to blizzard about it??

  6. #2966
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zantheus1993 View Post
    oh really?? did you speak to blizzard about it??
    It's common sense. Classes tend to have unique models. A Tinker mech would also have a unique model.

  7. #2967
    You know, if you asked me 2 expansions ago if Tinker could be a possibility, i'd have called you batshit insane but with them making engineering more and more useless in the last 2 expansions, I could see Engineering going the way of First Aid, scopes and gadgets baked into Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing, and tinkerer becoming a real class.

    I want it to be a MAIL wearing class - We already have 3 plate, 4 leather, and 3 cloth classes, we need a 3rd Mail class.

  8. #2968
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    If Gazlowe has one, then he is in fact a Tinker, regardless of his title.
    Then Tinkers are Engineers, thus in WoW they are vendors. Canon is canon, right?

    Tinkers and Engineers use Clawpacks in War3, Tinkers and Engineers in WoW are vendors. Seems legit to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Well, yes. Our opinions are below the canon lore of the game, because we're not the ones writing the lore.

  9. #2969
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stabbyfists View Post
    You know, if you asked me 2 expansions ago if Tinker could be a possibility, i'd have called you batshit insane but with them making engineering more and more useless in the last 2 expansions, I could see Engineering going the way of First Aid, scopes and gadgets baked into Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing, and tinkerer becoming a real class.

    I want it to be a MAIL wearing class - We already have 3 plate, 4 leather, and 3 cloth classes, we need a 3rd Mail class.
    The funny thing is that you don't even need to get rid of engineering. I would honestly give Tinkers a bonus to engineering and alchemy, and give alchemy and engineering professions recipes that specifically benefit the Tinker class.

    For example, give engineers mods that effect the appearance of the Tinker claw packs and mechs. Alchemy could have potions that enhance the Tinker's resource/fuel. If done right, a Tinker class could actually create an interesting synergy between classes and professions.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2021-01-15 at 02:05 AM.

  10. #2970
    Mechagnome Sagenod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Then Tinkers are Engineers, thus in WoW they are vendors. Canon is canon, right?

    Tinkers and Engineers use Clawpacks in War3, Tinkers and Engineers in WoW are vendors. Seems legit to me.
    This is for you and Teriz both, hopefully as a means of staving off this utterly pointless argument of semantics:

    What we know about Tinkers in the World of Warcraft canon.

    Not the strictest of parameters, yeah? Whether or not you choose to include WC3 Tinker canon, as diminutive as it is, in this argument is rather unimportant. What matters is that Tinkers are a type of engineer composed primarily of Gnomes, Goblins and Dwarves. It is more a title than anything else. They are not solely vendors and they are not specifically the battle-ready machinists from WC3. There is hardly any lore for them meaning there is room for new lore to be written. Because new lore can still be written. If it were a class in World of Warcraft we would see such new lore created and it's safe to assume the Tinkers from WC3 would inspire several of the class's abilities just like essentially every other WC3 Hero unit did.
    Last edited by Sagenod; 2021-01-15 at 02:02 AM.
    Check out the Drakonaar, my playable race concept! (WIP -- Looking for artists)


  11. #2971
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    It's common sense. Classes tend to have unique models. A Tinker mech would also have a unique model.
    so we have a class right now with a 100% unique base form that looks like nothing else in game?

  12. #2972
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Then Tinkers are Engineers, thus in WoW they are vendors. Canon is canon, right?

    Tinkers and Engineers use Clawpacks in War3, Tinkers and Engineers in WoW are vendors. Seems legit to me.
    Except you're using semantics here, not canon.

    For example, Gazlowe isn't an engineer, he's a Chief Engineer.

  13. #2973
    Mechagnome Sagenod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    The funny thing is that you don't even need to get of engineering. I would honestly give Tinkers a bonus to engineering and alchemy, and give alchemy and engineering professions recipes that specifically benefit the Tinker class.

    For example, give engineers mods that effect the appearance of the Tinker claw packs and mechs. Alchemy could have potions that enhance the Tinker's resource/fuel. If done right, a Tinker class could actually create an interesting synergy between classes and professions.
    I think this would be cool if they were inclined to create synergies between other classes and professions as well. Don't just leave such a system for one class!
    Check out the Drakonaar, my playable race concept! (WIP -- Looking for artists)


  14. #2974
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zantheus1993 View Post
    so we have a class right now with a 100% unique base form that looks like nothing else in game?
    You sound surprised. Blizzard creates unique animations, art assets and features for every new class it brings into the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sagenod View Post
    I think this would be cool if they were inclined to create synergies between other classes and professions as well. Don't just leave such a system for one class!
    It's kind of like that now with engineering crafting guns and only the Hunter class being able to use them.

    But yeah, I do think that professions and classes could synch up a bit more. Especially if they have some thematic overlap. Enchanting should be a cakewalk for a Mage or a Warlock for example. Blacksmithing should come easy for Warriors. Druids should be able experts at herbalism. Monks and Rogues should have an easy time with Alchemy. Inscription should be second nature to Death Knights, etc.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2021-01-15 at 02:13 AM.

  15. #2975
    Quote Originally Posted by Sagenod View Post
    There is hardly any lore for them meaning there is room for new lore to be written. Because new lore can still be written. If it were a class in World of Warcraft we would see such new lore created and it's safe to assume the Tinkers from WC3 would inspire several of the class's abilities just like essentially every other WC3 Hero unit did.
    Pretty much this.

    Remember, if Monks and Pandaren were added to WoW, literally anything could be. Blizzard can and will retcon or expand lore from the broader Warcraft universe if they want to.

    I would guess that Tinkers (or some other class derived from that idea) would be the most likely option out of a few ideas that float around, but who knows.

  16. #2976
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Except you're using semantics here, not canon.

    For example, Gazlowe isn't an engineer, he's a Chief Engineer.
    You're trying to suggest a difference between an Engineer and a Chief Engineer, and you're criticizing me for using semantics? LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by Sagenod View Post
    It is more a title than anything else. They are not solely vendors and they are not specifically the battle-ready machinists from WC3. There is hardly any lore for them meaning there is room for new lore to be written.
    Oh, fully aware of this. My point is just that there are already Tinkers in the lore, and Tinkers in WoW.

    Teriz is the only one denying the existence of Dwarf Tinkers that are already vendors in WoW. He's saying they can't be vendors at all, and that's simply not true from what we've seen.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-01-15 at 02:23 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Well, yes. Our opinions are below the canon lore of the game, because we're not the ones writing the lore.

  17. #2977
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    You're trying to suggest a difference between an Engineer and a Chief Engineer, and you're criticizing me for using semantics? LOL
    Are you really trying to argue that there's not a difference between a Chief Engineer and a regular Engineer? Wouldn't a Chief Engineer have more experience and be a leader of engineers in general?

  18. #2978
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Are you really trying to argue that there's not a difference between a Chief Engineer and a regular Engineer? Wouldn't a Chief Engineer have more experience and be a leader of engineers in general?
    Let's be clear about the difference then, because the only difference I see is in Rank.

    Can you tell me if a Chief Engineer isn't an Engineer by profession?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Well, yes. Our opinions are below the canon lore of the game, because we're not the ones writing the lore.

  19. #2979
    what are we talking about?
    the report systems sucks and the mods are bias.

  20. #2980
    The Insane Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Let's be clear about the difference then, because the only difference I see is in Rank.

    Can you tell me if a Chief Engineer isn't an Engineer by profession?
    Not enough lore to say one way or another I'm afraid.

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