If they made a new class in the future, what would it be?

[Revamp Man]

Wouldn’t a more logical conclusion be that they simply don’t plan for another death class to be in the game, and feel that the Death Knight is sufficient?

its possible
however they did say "those of you in the necrolord covenant can now feel like necromancers" means they know that players want it

that means its possible they will bring it in i mean the scourge will always be there and undeath will always be there so why not make a necromancer class

[Xeenith]

necromancer deal with the bodies of the dead, shadowlands is all about the soul that left that body, 2 different concepts

dunno about a 3rd death theme expansion, but sooner or later we'll have to invade deeper in the 6 main cosmic forces realms, and the shadowlands, like the emerald dream, don't seem to be fully part of the 6 realms, if you look at the cosmic map of wow

[Revamp Man]

necromancer deal with the bodies of the dead, shadowlands is all about the soul that left that body, 2 different concepts

dunno about a 3rd death theme expansion, but sooner or later we'll have to invade deeper in the 6 main cosmic forces realms, and the shadowlands, like the emerald dream, don't seem to be fully part of the 6 realms, if you look at the cosmic map of wow

it might not even be death themed
might be the rise of the scarlet crusade and in order for that to happen old enemies rise and we use their power against them or something

[Unholyground]

I kind of hope they make a class that's not established in lore so they can actually do something unique for once.

[Ielenia]

why would there be a 3rd death themed expansion?

By that same token: why wouldn't there be a third death themed expansion?

You think that now that we have fixed the afterlife (or will fix) no one in the entire Warcraft universe would try to take advantage of the powers of the Shadowlands? That it's all done forever? We don't even know how the expansion will end, too.

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Then why wasn’t the second death archetype class released with the second death expansion?

Actually, this is an afterlife expansion, not an undeath expansion, so that, by itself, doesn't fit the necromancer theme, or any death-themed class. Plus, the story being told did not fit a new class to be added.

[Swnem]

By that same token: why wouldn't there be a third death themed expansion?

You think that now that we have fixed the afterlife (or will fix) no one in the entire Warcraft universe would try to take advantage of the powers of the Shadowlands? That it's all done forever? We don't even know how the expansion will end, too.

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Actually, this is an afterlife expansion, not an undeath expansion, so that, by itself, doesn't fit the necromancer theme, or any death-themed class. Plus, the story being told did not fit a new class to be added.

Tell that to Kel'thuzad.

Apparantly was themed enough to bring him back. The Necromancer poster boy.

It's a lot of reaching you are doing there. But, i will say that both of you are right in a way.
It is true that this was a perfect opportunity to bring in Necromancers and another opportunity won't present itself for many years. But, it is also not impossible it will ever make it in. Just unlikely to be soon, unless something like class skins happens.

But, it is also becoming a pressing wish of the players to see another class added soon.
I cannot see us going 2 more expansions without a new class. This means Necromancer is very badly positioned to be that class as you won't see a death or afterlife theme as you say, twice that close to each other.

[AzureMage]

The point remains though, we're probably going to be staying on Azeroth for the next expansion. Which is what the community seems to want. People don't want to spend multiple expansions on other planets fighting gods in a medieval RPG.

Well, thing is that WoW has gone far beyond just being a "medieval rpg" i'd compare it to more high concept D&D settings like Planescape or Spelljammer instead of the more mediaval stasis that's typical for fantasy settings, you can't exactly dial back from going to other planes and planets to significantly mundane affairs, even the inciting incident & MacGuffin for the faction war plot of BFA Azerite is irreconcilably linked to a god-like entity stabbing the planet with a sword because he wanted to corrupt/kill the baby god sleeping in it (the ardenweald stageplay quest even makes fun of this), if i were to compare it would be like a D&D campaign going from visiting seperate planes of existence to killing a local goblin nuisance, you just can't de-escalate like that without it being even more jarring.

For better or for worse WoW's story has become about cosmic-world ending threats, something like Hearthstone can de-escalate because it's a inherently more comedic and less-serious piece of media with basically no actual centralized story but WoW (by comparison) tries takes itself seriously and has to follow a general sense of plot escalation.

[Teriz]

Well, thing is that WoW has gone far beyond just being a "medieval rpg" i'd compare it to more high concept D&D settings like Planescape or Spelljammer instead of the more mediaval stasis that's typical for fantasy settings, you can't exactly dial back from going to other planes and planets to significantly mundane affairs, even the inciting incident & MacGuffin for the faction war plot of BFA Azerite is irreconcilably linked to a god-like entity stabbing the planet with a sword because he wanted to corrupt/kill the baby god sleeping in it (the ardenweald stageplay quest even makes fun of this), if i were to compare it would be like a D&D campaign going from visiting seperate planes of existence to killing a local goblin nuisance, you just can't de-escalate like that without it being even more jarring.

For better or for worse WoW's story has become about cosmic-world ending threats, something like Hearthstone can de-escalate because it's a inherently more comedic and less-serious piece of media with basically no actual centralized story but WoW (by comparison) tries takes itself seriously and has to follow a general sense of plot escalation.

You can press the story forward without it becoming absurd. I'm sure if you ask any group of WoW players if they'd rather go to Dragon isles than to another reality to fight "the first ones", they'd choose Dragon Isles in a landslide. Why? Because its classic Warcraft lore, not this new stuff that started propping up after Legion when we beat the burning Legion and needed even more big baddies to fight.

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Tell that to Kel'thuzad.

Apparantly was themed enough to bring him back. The Necromancer poster boy.

It's a lot of reaching you are doing there. But, i will say that both of you are right in a way.
It is true that this was a perfect opportunity to bring in Necromancers and another opportunity won't present itself for many years. But, it is also not impossible it will ever make it in. Just unlikely to be soon, unless something like class skins happens.

But, it is also becoming a pressing wish of the players to see another class added soon.
I cannot see us going 2 more expansions without a new class. This means Necromancer is very badly positioned to be that class as you won't see a death or afterlife theme as you say, twice that close to each other.

I agree. If you told someone in the beginning of 2019 that the 8th expansion would take place in the Shadowlands where Anduin gets turned into the Lich King, Sylvanas joins the Jailer of death, we visit the birthplace of Necromancy, and Kelthuzad returns as a raid boss, people would say the next class was Necromancer or Dark Ranger without hesitation.

[AzureMage]

You can press the story forward without it becoming absurd. I'm sure if you ask any group of WoW players if they'd rather go to Dragon isles than to another reality to fight "the first ones", they'd choose Dragon Isles in a landslide. Why? Because its classic Warcraft lore, not this new stuff that started propping up after Legion when we beat the burning Legion and needed even more big baddies to fight.

Depends on how it's introduced, All we know about "The First Ones" is that they're presumably a step above the other pantheons (Titans, Eternal Ones), theres a good chance they'll include entities like Elune, it's also probably going to be after the Light + Void expansion which will presumably shed more light on them, frankly Pantheons, godlike entities and cosmic powers are something most players have probably gotten used to at this point since we've been exposed to them heavily for the last 3 expansions (literally meeting the titan pantheon and now the eternal ones), the Dragon Isle are a blink and you'll miss it reference in a npc's quest text.

Dragon Isle certainly has appeal (and frankly I find it more appealing than the light vs void crap we're probably getting) but I think Light vs Void and then The First Ones has more precedent at this point, at worst I think the Dragon Isle will end up as some Mechagon-tier or Single patch content thats used to close up the Dragonflights story rather than something that gets a full expansion.

[Ielenia]

Tell that to Kel'thuzad.

Apparantly was themed enough to bring him back. The Necromancer poster boy.

That's like saying BfA is a naga expansion, because of Azshara. The 'naga poster girl'.

It is true that this was a perfect opportunity to bring in Necromancers

I don't agree. I don't see how this expansion could be the "perfect opportunity" to bring in necromancers. The expansion's setting is not undeath. It's afterlife. We're fixing the afterlife, not undeath. And necromancers are about undeath, not the afterlife. If there are any classes that, theme-wise, deal with the afterlife, it's the priest and the shaman, not the necromancer.

But, it is also becoming a pressing wish of the players to see another class added soon.

Is it? Shadowlands seems to be doing quite well despite not bringing in a new class as per our expectations.

I cannot see us going 2 more expansions without a new class. This means Necromancer is very badly positioned to be that class as you won't see a death or afterlife theme as you say, twice that close to each other.[/QUOTE]

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I agree. If you told someone in the beginning of 2019 that the 8th expansion would take place in the Shadowlands where Anduin gets turned into the Lich King, Sylvanas joins the Jailer of death, we visit the birthplace of Necromancy, and Kelthuzad returns as a raid boss, people would say the next class was Necromancer or Dark Ranger without hesitation.

And if we told people back in 2017 that the 7th expansion would be themed around a new fuel source that is like overclocking any and all machines it's used on, greatly improving the world's technology, that we'd see teams of tinkers rolling around, and we'd even explore a technological island where technologically advanced cyborg gnomes live... people would say that the next class would be 'tinker' without hesitation. Would they not?

[Swnem]

That's like saying BfA is a naga expansion, because of Azshara. The 'naga poster girl'.


I don't agree. I don't see how this expansion could be the "perfect opportunity" to bring in necromancers. The expansion's setting is not undeath. It's afterlife. We're fixing the afterlife, not undeath. And necromancers are about undeath, not the afterlife. If there are any classes that, theme-wise, deal with the afterlife, it's the priest and the shaman, not the necromancer.


Is it? Shadowlands seems to be doing quite well despite not bringing in a new class as per our expectations.

I cannot see us going 2 more expansions without a new class. This means Necromancer is very badly positioned to be that class as you won't see a death or afterlife theme as you say, twice that close to each other.

Naga is a race, not a class. And if you told me if BfA was the right time to add a Naga race, i would say yes, it was. It is now very unlikely we will ever get them.

Ok, i didn't want to have this conversation. It is undeniable this expansion is about death. Just cause we go to different realms of death, doesn't mean it is not about death. Undeath is yet another state of the afterlife. It can be represented by the Necrolord creations or by the night elf wisps. Necromancers also use blood magic so Venthyr seems to fit the bill. The res spirit in azeroth is connected to the Kyrians. It is all connected. You can pretend that there are 2 different death themes if it pleases you but the umbrella here is death. It still doesn't change the fact that it is unlikely we will have another death themed expansion soon. I mean, you are debating semantics here, and it's really not a conversation i will entertain anymore. The theme is death. Wether you want to call it undeath or afterlife, it is all the same theme, death.

I disagree. That is like saying people don't want new content cause they got the content they are playing right now. Sure...

[stormrage666]

You guys are all wrong...

The next class is the CLOWN!

To reflect what Blizz think of their player base.

[Ielenia]

Ok, i didn't want to have this conversation. It is undeniable this expansion is about death.

The Shadowlands' expansion is about the realm of death, i.e., the afterlife, not undeath.

Just cause we go to different realms of death, doesn't mean it is not about death. Undeath is yet another state of the afterlife. It can be represented by the Necrolord creations or by the night elf wisps. Necromancers also use blood magic so Venthyr seems to fit the bill. The res spirit in azeroth is connected to the Kyrians. It is all connected. You can pretend that there are 2 different death themes if it pleases you but the umbrella here is death. It still doesn't change the fact that it is unlikely we will have another death themed expansion soon. I mean, you are debating semantics here, and it's really not a conversation i will entertain anymore. The theme is death. Wether you want to call it undeath of afterlife, it is all the same theme, death.

I disagree. That is like saying people don't want new content cause they got the content they are playing right now. Sure...

That's not what I said. I said that the success of an expansion is independent of it adding a class. And if "must add a class" is such a pressing wish from the playerbase, I don't think Shadowlands wouldn't be as successful as it is.

[Alkizon]

stormrage666
The next class is the CLOWN!

by the way, there'll be nothing funny/strange/unusual in this

Although, more adequate option in this uncertain situation would probably be something like jester or harlequin or trickster (last one, albeit very attractive for this concept, but also can create certain difficulties in name's translation, unless it'd be taken as is). However, this all can greatly weaken bards' "traditionally beloved/characteristic" component. This is same performance, speech, lively mind, but also there is no much music in them. Actually, concept is written from calculation of dominant pirate/adventurer component to match this theme, therefore I fully understand kind of excessive dissatisfaction of some somewhat indignant people here. In any case, if, despite their crooked RPG component/design, a pure bard will somehow appear in game (what I'll be only glad about), then it'll be enough to cut/change part of "musical theme" to for example beguiler's mechanics, and they'll get absolutely "independent" and abstract... well, someone of ones mentioned above.

[Teriz]

Depends on how it's introduced, All we know about "The First Ones" is that they're presumably a step above the other pantheons (Titans, Eternal Ones), theres a good chance they'll include entities like Elune, it's also probably going to be after the Light + Void expansion which will presumably shed more light on them, frankly Pantheons, godlike entities and cosmic powers are something most players have probably gotten used to at this point since we've been exposed to them heavily for the last 3 expansions (literally meeting the titan pantheon and now the eternal ones), the Dragon Isle are a blink and you'll miss it reference in a npc's quest text.

Dragon Isle certainly has appeal (and frankly I find it more appealing than the light vs void crap we're probably getting) but I think Light vs Void and then The First Ones has more precedent at this point, at worst I think the Dragon Isle will end up as some Mechagon-tier or Single patch content thats used to close up the Dragonflights story rather than something that gets a full expansion.

Yeah, but why would we have an expansion about that? What's the point of us going to some other realm and encountering Elune or the First Ones? What's the point? Are the First Ones trying to kill us? Is Elune in some sort of danger? Where would this even take place? Somewhere in the middle of space? Having us meeting beings above Titans makes zero sense as an expansion theme. The same applies for a light vs void theme.

Dragon Isles makes far more sense because there's actually a possible story around it, and Dragon Isles is an actual place on the map.

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Naga is a race, not a class. And if you told me if BfA was the right time to add a Naga race, i would say yes, it was. It is now very unlikely we will ever get them.

Ok, i didn't want to have this conversation. It is undeniable this expansion is about death. Just cause we go to different realms of death, doesn't mean it is not about death. Undeath is yet another state of the afterlife. It can be represented by the Necrolord creations or by the night elf wisps. Necromancers also use blood magic so Venthyr seems to fit the bill. The res spirit in azeroth is connected to the Kyrians. It is all connected. You can pretend that there are 2 different death themes if it pleases you but the umbrella here is death. It still doesn't change the fact that it is unlikely we will have another death themed expansion soon. I mean, you are debating semantics here, and it's really not a conversation i will entertain anymore. The theme is death. Wether you want to call it undeath of afterlife, it is all the same theme, death.

I disagree. That is like saying people don't want new content cause they got the content they are playing right now. Sure...

Let's also not forget that at the very beginning of this expansion there was a massive scourge invasion that we had to put down. I'm sure Blizzard could have easily wrote in that some Necromancers show up to help us push back the scourge and then decide to help us navigate the shadowlands. I mean, I'm sure a Necromancer would be quite interested in exploring the birthplace of Necromancy and Blood Magic.

But nope, we got nothing. Instead, Death Knights got more races, new exclusive weapons, an expansion of the Necromancer theme in their class, and some actually new abilities (that were also necromancer themed). That should say all we need to know about the future prospects of a Necromancer class.

[Ielenia]

That should say all we need to know about the future prospects of a Necromancer class.

And all it says is "confirmation bias".

[Revamp Man]

And all it says is "confirmation bias".

the more that we get in terms of interviews the more we see necromancer still is a possibility

we have a new form of magic now "domination" which is what the primus was a master in and we can assume domination magic is something necromancers use
i also stand by the fact they said "you can look like a necromancer" weve had players look like future classes before in armor specifically designed for it

also apparently drust druids aka KT druids use death magic according to lore

necromancers can happen no matter how much he thinks otherwise

[Triceron]

Domination magic definitely is a new and interesting gimmick, but I see this applied more towards Dark Rangers than Necromancers.

Necromancers are literally about control, not suppression. However, the idea of Domination as a means of suppression actually fits best with the Dark Rangers, like what Sylvanas is using right now and what they have been known to use with spells like Charm and Possession. It's a means of 'Suppressing' one's will to control them like a puppet, while Necromancy is literally reanimating a corpse or inanimate object that has no will of its own.

This makes more sense splitting the two definitions since we now have a more clear separation of the magic that dominated Arthas' soul when he took up Frostmourne as being something beyond simply Necromancy. It's something that can be applied to both the living and the dead.

[Ielenia]

Domination magic definitely is a new and interesting gimmick, but I see this applied more towards Dark Rangers than Necromancers.

Necromancers are literally about control, not suppression. However, the idea of Domination as a means of suppression actually fits best with the Dark Rangers, like what Sylvanas is using right now and what they have been known to use with spells like Charm and Possession. It's a means of 'Suppressing' one's will to control them like a puppet, while Necromancy is literally reanimating a corpse or inanimate object that has no will of its own.

This makes more sense splitting the two definitions since we now have a more clear separation of the magic that dominated Arthas' soul when he took up Frostmourne as being something beyond simply Necromancy. It's something that can be applied to both the living and the dead.

It does sound a little more "dark ranger-y" than "necromancer-y", I agree, but I imagine the necromancer concept could be expanded to fit this 'domination magic' thingie if it turns out to actually be its own thing and not just a fancy name. After all, technically the necromancers suppress the free will of the souls they use to animate the undead, right?

[Triceron]

It does sound a little more "dark ranger-y" than "necromancer-y", I agree, but I imagine the necromancer concept could be expanded to fit this 'domination magic' thingie if it turns out to actually be its own thing and not just a fancy name. After all, technically the necromancers suppress the free will of the souls they use to animate the undead, right?

I don't quite agree with the latter statement since the devs were making out the Jailer as using a different type of magic from what we normally associate as Necromancy. That's why they are calling it Domination magic, that's why they are saying the Jailer has been dominated and is mastering it now.

I don't think the typical Necromancy we see involves domination, and it's not suppressing the free will of souls used to animate undead. If it were that simple, the Devs wouldn't have to make any distinction to the type of magic he's using from regular Necromancy. They would just say the Jailer's using Necromancy and this is all a part of what Necromancy does.

We already assumed that Necromancy has the innate ability to dominate one's will/soul since this is what we assumed was used on Arthas. The new revelation of Domination magic is a completely new nuance that is separate from how Necromancers typically use their magic.