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  1. #21
    The fuck u know about subs lol.Shadowlands is shaping well

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    declining subs...didn't the latest earnings call just debunk that since engagement in SL is higher than WoD?
    It's always high around launch, probably around 10M every time. But it has nothing to do with expansion quality, since we measure it looking at endgame content.

    Many people treat WoW expac just like another game, they come on launch, play until they 'finish' and leave. No matter if endgame is good like in Legion, mediocre like BfA or non-existent like WoD, they are simply not interested in any endgame.

    That's why Blizz no longer shows subs, it creates pointless drama and competition doesn't do it anyway.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by simpleton View Post
    With declining subscriber base and the continued downward trajectory of subscriptions at what point/threshold will WOW go the F2P route and incorporate cash shops etc?

    I wish it would never happen however its an inevitability at this point. The question is when?

    I feel like Shadowlands will be the last expansion under the current model and we will see a f2P conversion during the next cycle.
    Hard to say. Game usually goes F2P, when playerbase decline makes it impossible for remaining players to actually play the game, so it's only option to keep it alive. For example when there are no players to raid with or there are no players to start BG. Playerbase should drop to several thousands in order for this to happen. And prior to that Blizzard have CRZ and crossrealm LFG to keep illusion, that this game is still alive. So, I guess, never. F2P means last breath before death anyway, so Blizzard would rather close Wow, than do it.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    It's always high around launch, probably around 10M every time. But it has nothing to do with expansion quality, since we measure it looking at endgame content.

    Many people treat WoW expac just like another game, they come on launch, play until they 'finish' and leave. No matter if endgame is good like in Legion, mediocre like BfA or non-existent like WoD, they are simply not interested in any endgame.

    That's why Blizz no longer shows subs, it creates pointless drama and competition doesn't do it anyway.
    Didn't comment on quality of expansions. Merely the notion that wow is declining in subs. If something it just shows it fluctuates. Which is quite a difference compared to declining subs or "dying".

  5. #25
    since you can sell your ingame gold for €uros and gametime the game has been free to play for me.

  6. #26
    Hopefully not while I'm still playing. F2P games tend to bring out the worst in people because there's usually little monetary investment to deter toxic behavior.
    Quote Originally Posted by AZSolii View Post
    "yes, let's piss him off because he loves his long hair. Let us twirl our evil mustaches amidst the background music of honky-tonk pianos! GENIUS!"
    Quote Originally Posted by Culexus View Post
    Yes i hate those sneaky account thieves that come to my house and steal my computer in order to steal some wow money! Those bastards! *shakes fist*

  7. #27
    the day that wow goes f2p is the day we know 100% that its dead. mmos don't go f2p unless they are on deaths door or they are korean.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Belloc View Post
    While I agree Wow's sub numbers are hardly dwindling (or probably even that low).

    Trusting a guy with no onus not to lie using a bunch of caveats and no actual hard data to the point where even the shameless shill site feels the need to hedge its bets in the next paragraph, is probably not a super good idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    Didn't comment on quality of expansions. Merely the notion that wow is declining in subs. If something it just shows it fluctuates. Which is quite a difference compared to declining subs or "dying".
    Engagement isn't a one to one translation to sub count (nor should it be). A highly engaged whale who spends $500 a month is worth 33 normal players at the end of the month.
    You should essentially never trust anything a company has to say under any circumstances. Even when they're legally obligated not to lie they pay people alot of money to spin and bury the truth as hard as they can.
    Last edited by Saltysquidoon; 2020-11-19 at 04:45 PM.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  9. #29
    I will transition to another game if/when WoW becomes F2P. I've seen F2P destroy other games, I won't stick around for that.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by simpleton View Post
    With declining subscriber base and the continued downward trajectory of subscriptions at what point/threshold will WOW go the F2P route and incorporate cash shops etc?

    I wish it would never happen however its an inevitability at this point. The question is when?

    I feel like Shadowlands will be the last expansion under the current model and we will see a f2P conversion during the next cycle.
    You are grossly underestimating how insanely profitable subscription based MMOs are. WoW is never going to go F2P. "Declining subs" is a bullshit imaginary argument used by players who think their friendslist is an accurate sample size to judge the entire playerbase by and "WoW is dying" is about the least interesting thing you could possibly say about the game. The game is hardly perfect but its business model has sustained it for longer than almost any other franchise in the video game industry, to think they'd suddenly change it because some angry ex-WoW players think the game sucks is hilariously obtuse.

  11. #31
    Mechagnome Wramp's Avatar
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    yeah, im gonna say Never, they will ride this cash train to the end of the rails. Once its done, its done and they wont "leave it up in F2P mode" because Bobby boy and Wrectivision says "free dont pay the billz"

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by simpleton View Post
    With declining subscriber base and the continued downward trajectory of subscriptions at what point/threshold will WOW go the F2P route and incorporate cash shops etc?

    I wish it would never happen however its an inevitability at this point. The question is when?

    I feel like Shadowlands will be the last expansion under the current model and we will see a f2P conversion during the next cycle.
    and why do you feel so? WoW is as profitable as ever and there's no sign of any such change in the horizons

    people are paying their subs AND buying services on top of them, why would blizzard make one of those free?...

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurhetemec View Post
    I mean, it's demonstrably untrue. WoW is seeing more engagement and making more money than it used to, quite a lot more. Seems like the low point was WoD and however this is doing, it's significantly better than that. I doubt that'll change any time soon.
    You need to keep in mind however

    1.Engagement does not equate to subscribers
    Engagement can mean a lot of things, it can mean that players spend more time total in the game or that players engage in more systems than before, both do not automatically equate to more players.

    How Blizzard exactly defines engagement is, as far as i know, not known to the playerbase.
    Let's not forget, they most likely included Classic numbers into there as well, which most certainly does boost the numbers.

    2.WoW has a lot more revenue streams than before.
    There are the MTX and the WoW Token.
    Everybody that exclusively plays WoW via Tokens makes Blizzard very happy, because Blizzard makes a lot more money via Tokens than via regular subscribers.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    That's why Blizz no longer shows subs, it creates pointless drama and competition doesn't do it anyway.
    Nah. They don't show subs because they never mattered to players in the first place. When Blizzard's QRs had subscriber numbers in them WoW was pretty much the only property that was making money for them. Now they have multiple streams of income from many different franchises so its less important for investors to see WoW's subscription levels since that alone wouldn't provide a very accurate display of the company's overall well-being.

  15. #35
    Hopefully never.

    The types of people who are playing free to play games are not people i want into the game i play. (not saying everyone is bad!)
    No cost to stop toxic people out to just cause harm. No repercussions if you cheat or hack or being a dick, since you are not losing monetary values. The community in wow is bad, but its nothing compared to free to play communities and the players joining something as popular as wow. oh boy, it would be beacon, getting in the worst of the worst

  16. #36
    Its an old username, but it checks out.
    A witty saying proves nothing.
    -Voltaire
    winning
    plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

  17. #37
    Gotta say, your name is spot on.

  18. #38
    they do like around 80 million $ each year with subscription alone
    probably the double with live service and cash shop

    you really think that ftp is coming soon ? i dont think so :P

  19. #39
    When subs start getting that low Blizzard will probably be looking into their next big thing to possibly continue the MMO genre with a sub and end WoW for good.
    I guess what I’m stating is: WoW will never go F2P.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by simpleton View Post
    With declining subscriber base and the continued downward trajectory of subscriptions at what point/threshold will WOW go the F2P route and incorporate cash shops etc?

    I wish it would never happen however its an inevitability at this point. The question is when?

    I feel like Shadowlands will be the last expansion under the current model and we will see a f2P conversion during the next cycle.

    When they lose enough subscribers.......maybe. Blizzard is soooooo damn stubborn, they would let their game die before they really give us what we want.
    People on this thread only get pissed at you when you don't agree with them...FACT

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