1. #32241
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscipleofCazicThule View Post
    I really don't understand this rigidness to class philosophy. There's nothing saying they HAVE to base a new class on WC3. With the exception of Demon Hunters, all other classes are based on classic fantasy classes. Hell, Death Knights are just a play on DnD's unholy paladins or Everquest's Shadowknights. There's nothing to say they can't create something new. If they had to go based on previous patterns, then Shadowlands would have had a new class, which it obviously didn't.
    No, Death Knights literally came from WC3;

    http://classic.battle.net/war3/undea...thknight.shtml

    If you notice, the armor, weaponry, mount, and abilities were carried over to WoW as well.

    And as I said above, Shadowlands may not have had a new class because there was no new class available to fill the slot.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Therougetitan View Post
    Counterpoint: Most of the original devs are gone now and they have new people who want to do their own thing. This is evident with the current writing team under Steve Danuser quickly wrapping up the plots of Warcraft 3 and calling Shadowlands the end of it. They are wanting to move to a new chapter of Warcraft so whatever comes next may be completely fresh.
    That certainly IS possible, but is that restricted to story, or does that bleed into the class creation side of things as well? Also while the team may be ready to wrap up the storyline of WC3, that still doesn't change the reality that any new class needs to actually fit in Warcraft and offer something unique to the lineup. WoW's current class lineup covers a lot of bases.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2022-03-26 at 04:10 AM.

  2. #32242
    Quote Originally Posted by Hansworst View Post
    And again, the t class is sucking out all the air...
    Teriz will Teriz, etc.

  3. #32243
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    No, Death Knights literally came from WC3;

    http://classic.battle.net/war3/undea...thknight.shtml

    If you notice, the armor, weaponry, mount, and abilities were carried over to WoW as well.
    Yes. Death Knights came from WC3, but they're nothing new. Everquest had a version and came out 3 years prior. Unholy knight using dark powers is not a trope that Warcraft created. Sorry.

  4. #32244
    Quote Originally Posted by Hansworst View Post
    And again, the t class is sucking out all the air...
    More like the T user.

    Christ, talk about not taking a hint.

  5. #32245
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscipleofCazicThule View Post
    Yes. Death Knights came from WC3, but they're nothing new. Everquest had a version and came out 3 years prior. Unholy knight using dark powers is not a trope that Warcraft created. Sorry.
    I never said it was. I said that the Death Knight class in WoW comes directly from the Death Knight and associated units in WC3. I'm well aware that the concept of a Black Knight, or Dark Knight has been around for decades, proceeding videogames in general.

  6. #32246
    So anyone else piece together the Eternal Sun is going to be involved with whatever comes next
    we have the mount
    we have whispers
    we have more mention of it in 9.2.5

    we can look at the old pandaren legend even though it may be exaggerated and look at the number 5
    there were 5 suns but 4 were shot down leaving only anshe
    the lore from the taurens says that anshe protects the titan world soul during the day while the moon known to NElfs as Elune protects it at night
    this would place the sun or the being behind it on the same level as Elune in being an eternal one and a member of the pantheon of life

    so now what do we have in terms of hints
    emerald drake mount for collectors edition
    a pet that uses the vulpera model for collectors edition
    the sunwarmed furline mount as the last store mount before the expansion announcement (unless we go with the idea that everything including store mounts were delayed by 6 months)
    whispers about underneath a shining surface lies a darkness
    the undead attacking silvermoon
    new models for calia and anduin
    Khadgar is back

    taking all of this im going to guess that while we dont visit "the lifelands" we will see more influence by that cosmic power especially considering the genesaurs are creations of life and so is the overgrowth. We may see more influence by the emerald dream as well and see that the dream we know is simply a walled off version kinda like the grey shadowlands. The scourge might be defeated by the life equivalent.

    The scarlet crusade might make their move seeing the scourge attacks and the peace between the alliance and the horde as a way to stoke the fires of hatred and cause a war. The added calia and bolvar story might lead to the rebuilding of the kingdom and thus Anduin getting his queen. Depending on the role that the forces of life will take we might get the long awaited necromancer class (you can argue that it overlaps with DK all you want but ultimately it is up to blizzard not people on a forum with a love for trains) and use the magics we learned about in the shadowlands to fight back against the force that most would see as the good guys.

  7. #32247
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    I never said it was. I said that the Death Knight class in WoW comes directly from the Death Knight and associated units in WC3. I'm well aware that the concept of a Black Knight, or Dark Knight has been around for decades, proceeding videogames in general.
    Ok, got it. The point was completely missed. Cool.

  8. #32248
    Quote Originally Posted by Totally Not Dragons View Post
    The scarlet crusade might make their move seeing the scourge attacks and the peace between the alliance and the horde as a way to stoke the fires of hatred and cause a war. The added calia and bolvar story might lead to the rebuilding of the kingdom and thus Anduin getting his queen. Depending on the role that the forces of life will take we might get the long awaited necromancer class (you can argue that it overlaps with DK all you want but ultimately it is up to blizzard not people on a forum with a love for trains) and use the magics we learned about in the shadowlands to fight back against the force that most would see as the good guys.
    I’m starting to think that Taelia was not meant to be Anduin’s lover considering how little they interact. It makes WAY more sense for Calia’s daughter to be his love interest, even moreso if she’s an antagonist that mirrors his powers in the light.

    Enemies to lovers is not something Blizz has done ever, AFAIK, and it fits Anduin very well: someone who uses the light for nefarious purposes, though maybe they genuinely believe them.

    If Calias daughter posing as a man is a big character soon, I expect her to be Anduins lover in the long term.

  9. #32249
    Quote Originally Posted by DiscipleofCazicThule View Post
    Ok, got it. The point was completely missed. Cool.
    That's just kind of how it works with Teriz, my dude.

  10. #32250
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    No, Death Knights literally came from WC3;

    http://classic.battle.net/war3/undea...thknight.shtml
    He's referring to Warcraft 2. Death Knights were a big plot point in Warcraft 2. IE: Guldan was putting Orc souls in Human Bodies. See also, yeah Brewmaster is a thing but Monk wasn't uttered until World of Warcraft, but it is a staple of Dungeons & dragons.

  11. #32251
    Quote Originally Posted by PhillyCheese View Post
    I’m starting to think that Taelia was not meant to be Anduin’s lover considering how little they interact. It makes WAY more sense for Calia’s daughter to be his love interest, even moreso if she’s an antagonist that mirrors his powers in the light.

    Enemies to lovers is not something Blizz has done ever, AFAIK, and it fits Anduin very well: someone who uses the light for nefarious purposes, though maybe they genuinely believe them.

    If Calias daughter posing as a man is a big character soon, I expect her to be Anduins lover in the long term.
    Taelia is her daughter
    the scarlet crusade has a fake heir and personally i think is being manipulated by a black dragon
    BUT that is all my opinion
    The little interaction she has had with Anduin however did have him flirting a bit and we know that from Before the Storm he likes the idea of not being a noble 24/7 which would be cool for the whole "a prince longs to be normal and an orphan must adjust to life as royalty" story

    the chance of the scarlet crusade having the true heir and then throughout the conflicts they interact with anduin and eventually become a thing i think would be cool

  12. #32252
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    He's referring to Warcraft 2. Death Knights were a big plot point in Warcraft 2. IE: Guldan was putting Orc souls in Human Bodies. See also, yeah Brewmaster is a thing but Monk wasn't uttered until World of Warcraft, but it is a staple of Dungeons & dragons.
    The Death Knight class in WoW though is based entirely on the Death Knights (and undead faction) of WC3, and we were talking about WoW classes.

    Also while the Monk is a RPG staple, WoW's Monk class is based on the Pandaren Brewmaster hero. Hence why the class is Pandaren-based with the Brewmaster's abilities in the Tank and DPS spec, and multiple empowering brews throughout all three of its specs.

  13. #32253
    Quote Originally Posted by Totally Not Dragons View Post
    Taelia is her daughter
    Again I point at my theory that it feels like they built up Lilian & Taelia to be her daughter but they haven't decided which they want to go with.

    It is very weird of Calia to be hanging out with Taelia & talking her to scold her father for not being in her life but also not telling her she is her mother. What kind of bullshit is that?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    The Death Knight class in WoW though is based entirely on the Death Knights (and undead faction) of WC3, and we were talking about WoW classes.

    Also while the Monk is a RPG staple, WoW's Monk class is based on the Pandaren Brewmaster hero. Hence why the class is Pandaren-based with the Brewmaster's abilities in the Tank and DPS spec, and multiple empowering brews throughout all three of its specs.
    Cope. What exactly do you think they based the Warcraft 3 class on? We've already demonstated how most of the WoW classes are not based on W3 Hero classes? Priest is completely unrelated to Tyrande. Hunter didn't get a Warcraft 3 ability until Wrath. Rogue didn't get a Warden ability until Cataclysm. If you're arguing they waited 3+ expansions to give them abilities they were always supposed to have you're completely delusional.

  14. #32254
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    Cope. What exactly do you think they based the Warcraft 3 class on?
    Classic RPG tropes. Where and when did I say that Blizzard created classic RPG tropes btw?

    We've already demonstated how most of the WoW classes are not based on W3 Hero classes? Priest is completely unrelated to Tyrande.
    https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=19305/starshards

    Hunter didn't get a Warcraft 3 ability until Wrath.
    https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=19506/trueshot-aura

    Rogue didn't get a Warden ability until Cataclysm.
    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=51723

    If you're arguing they waited 3+ expansions to give them abilities they were always supposed to have you're completely delusional.
    No, they stagger their releases in order to have new abilities for future expansions. Thus, players are excited when a classic WC3 ability arrives in WoW. Feral Spirit for Shaman, Stampede for Hunters, Starfall for Druids, and Avatar for Warriors are just a few examples of WC3 abilities that arrived in WoW classes after Vanilla.

  15. #32255
    Love people claiming that warcrafts story going into new territory mean no classes from w3 will make it in. Yeah right... Let's just put in some random ass class out of thin air just because. Not like we already got a super popular class concept waiting to be used which has been ingrained to the very fiber of warcraft lore

    Again, lack of a new class in SL means NOTHING has priority over tinkers, absolutely NOTHING. Not Necro, not DR, not bard(lol), not blademaster, not warden.

    Think about, the pattern dictates we get a new class every two expansions. Why oh why did we not get Necro or DR in SL? Because blizzard know what class they want to make next and unfortunately it wasn't time yet story wise.

    Now that gallywix was seen in Tazavesh, we know that tinker shenanigans are about to go down. Just stop righting and join the band wagon already.

    God I can't wait till the 19th...

  16. #32256
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    snip
    Now you're saying Hunters are based on Priestess of the Moon? Okay sure. I hope the new class is Space Marine. If it just uses Tinker W3 moves that's fine. I was off by one expansion on Fan of Knives. That doesn't invalidate my point. Basing a class on a W3 hero & pulling a W3 hero ability when brainstorming new abilities YEARS LATER is not the same thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Now that gallywix was seen in Tazavesh, we know that tinker shenanigans are about to go down. Just stop righting and join the band wagon already.
    Is Gallywix even a Tinker? His class is Capitalist.
    Last edited by Ersula; 2022-03-26 at 05:12 AM.

  17. #32257
    I'm sorry, the writing is on the wall. Tinker is coming. You can either get over yourself and stop crying about them not including your dream OC class concepts invented from thin air and enjoy the eventual reveal, or keep crying for another expansion. Dark Ranger had it's shot, and the devs responded soundly with "it's already in the game, play Hunter". I'm hot happy about it. The "wacky" shit like Gnomes and Goblins ruined Warcraft, and is a major reason I hope for a Warcraft 4 which ignores WoW and wacky unfitting shit, but the writings on the wall.

  18. #32258
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    Again I point at my theory that it feels like they built up Lilian & Taelia to be her daughter but they haven't decided which they want to go with.

    It is very weird of Calia to be hanging out with Taelia & talking her to scold her father for not being in her life but also not telling her she is her mother. What kind of bullshit is that?
    i believe that they will justify the "oh my god we are a family?!?!?!" storyline by saying that when she was revived it messed with her memories so she forgot her daughter's name. The whole idea that she lost her daughter and husband in a scourge attack and they lost their mother/wife in a scourge attack is too coincidental.

  19. #32259
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    Now you're saying Hunters are based on Priestess of the Moon? Okay sure.
    No, I'm saying that the Hunter class in WoW comes from multiple sources in WC3 and a LOT of their material originated in the Night Elf faction. Tyrande in WC3 was a Priest/Hunter hybrid character, and her abilities were used to seed both classes.

    To illustrate it for you, these are the top three classes for Night Elf players;



    Notice the bow Tyrande is holding?

    I hope the new class is Space Marine. If it just uses Tinker W3 moves that's fine. I was off by one expansion on Fan of Knives. That doesn't invalidate my point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    Cope.

  20. #32260
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Classic RPG tropes. Where and when did I say that Blizzard created classic RPG tropes btw?



    https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=19305/starshards



    https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=19506/trueshot-aura



    https://wotlk.evowow.com/?spell=51723



    No, they stagger their releases in order to have new abilities for future expansions. Thus, players are excited when a classic WC3 ability arrives in WoW. Feral Spirit for Shaman, Stampede for Hunters, Starfall for Druids, and Avatar for Warriors are just a few examples of WC3 abilities that arrived in WoW classes after Vanilla.
    I think I've figured out the problem. You're mentally stuck in Wrath, where we were still thinking "Oh hey man, when are they gonna add "thing from Warcraft 3?"

    Well it's over, they added them all. Long, long ago. It's time to move on.

    It's absolutely astonishing, and a little bit sad to see you say "Priests are a Warcraft 3 concept because they had Starshards"; like, is literally impossible to use ANYTHING as inspiration without you thinking its rooted in that concept? Not minding that Starshards is completely and utterly gone and was only on 1/5 available Priest races at the time. Dude just take the L.

    You throw away any evidence to the contrary and cling to singular instances like devs don't take any inspiration from their previous work without being beholden to it. It's absolutely tiring. I say again, no wonder people are fucking tired of hearing you go on and on about Tinkers. Same with Varx, but I'm pretty sure he's trying to be that obnoxious about it on purpose.

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