Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Maell]

Sylvanas will be redeemed and spend the rest of her days in a little cottage in Quel'Thalas with Steve, her newfound love as it was always ment to be.

[micwini]

I guess what 10.0 will be depends largely on when they started working on it. How long do they plan expansions ahead, and i dont mean details but the basics (where will it happen / basic story / who are the enemies&bosses)? Did they start before Shadowlands release, then it will not be a radical change from the current formula and it will release Q4/22. New systems will probably be toned down and less grindy (like a continuation from 9.1.5) but the rest will not be much different. Or did they only start in 2021 with covid and Shadowlands problems already very real? Then we could see a delay to 2023 and a very different expansion format...

If 10.0 is the revamp a lot of people want, then they should have been working on it since at least Legion. No way they do that big of a project with the same amount of time as a regular expac.

[Lahis]

If 10.0 is the revamp a lot of people want, then they should have been working on it since at least Legion. No way they do that big of a project with the same amount of time as a regular expac.

Which is why nobody should expect a revamp. It is too much work to ever happen.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Which is why nobody should expect a revamp. It is too much work to ever happen.

Exactly. Especially right now when so many have left and hiring based on prestige has become harder than every in the last 20 years.

[Nyel]

There is always a year gap between the last patch and next expansion. They can't just fart out an expansion from nothing, they need to actually make it.

And Blizz are really slow at making stuff, even without all the current bullshit in the company.

They're slow, but they've been incredibly slow during Shadowlands as well, which makes me believe they instantly started shuffling their workpower towards the next expansion and deliberately let Shadowlands be so... underwhelming. And that's a reason why it ends on 9.2. They spent all their time on the new expansion. And that has to happen in 2022 and they knew about this in 2020 already. That's why I don't want to believe (yet) that it's only coming mid 2023.

I know that the average time between final raid and new expansion is usually ~ 10-11 months and I might be too optimistic here, but 10.0 in March or April 2023 is just waaaaaaaaaaaay too late, even if it's a damn epic expansion.

[Dracullus]

I know that the average time between final raid and new expansion is usually ~ 10-11 months and I might be too optimistic here, but 10.0 in March or April 2023 is just waaaaaaaaaaaay too late, even if it's a damn epic expansion.

Patch can be late. Never expansion. It's simply reset for this game, both population and reputation.

SL would have been far better if they delay it 5 months and be ready to implement Legion cycle for patches. From design perspective it stomps over Legion, but drought make people sick of every single patch.

[Sondrelk]

Which is why nobody should expect a revamp. It is too much work to ever happen.

It really isn't that much work all things considered. The assets have been made slowly ever since MoP, really. And BfA proved that it doesn't take a while lot of work to make a zone feel fresh.

The big thing that would take the most time is quests and new zones on top of revamps. Both of which was a mistake Cata did.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

A lot of mixed messages lately. Biggest expansion ever which has been worked on since BFA 9.0 versus Maintenance Mode $40 DLC packs for each Season no more Expansions.

[Graden]

Exactly. Especially right now when so many have left and hiring based on prestige has become harder than every in the last 20 years.

You make a fair point. Hopefully you're wrong though, cause a world revamp is the only thing that would bring me back.

[infinitemeridian]

Revamp is unlikely since they would never redo every single zone for max level content in one expansion. And given that they just redid the leveling experience, they're not going to repurpose them for leveling (ala Cata) either. Thus, we can either expect the "new" zones for the expac to be a couple zones redone from Kalimdor / EK OR a new landmass aka Dragon Isles.

While it would be cool if every zone had its art updated to modern standards, I don't understand what else a world revamp would entail. Having max level content across every zone is unfeasible and would probably just amount to shallow world quests at best.

[Lady Atia]

Revamp is unlikely since they would never redo every single zone for max level content in one expansion. And given that they just redid the leveling experience, they're not going to repurpose them for leveling (ala Cata) either. Thus, we can either expect the "new" zones for the expac to be a couple zones redone from Kalimdor / EK OR a new landmass aka Dragon Isles.

While it would be cool if every zone had its art updated to modern standards, I don't understand what else a world revamp would entail. Having max level content across every zone is unfeasible and would probably just amount to shallow world quests at best.

Why? I don't think that using the Korthia formula on old world zones would be too much of a hassle tbh. And it would lead to lots of evergreen content especially if they give us lots of mounts and pets to farm there. And you could re-use them for leveling too, basically like threads of fate.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

And given that they just redid the leveling experience, they're not going to repurpose them for leveling (ala Cata) either.

Seeing where people are coming from with this, it's worth mentioning that this could also open it up and have the opposite effect.

Their overhaul with Chromie Time actually may have situated things so that Cata content can remain accessible through that, and never go away like Classic did.
Even with a revamp, I could see myself using Cata to level through the 1-50 experience depending on the character from time to time.

"Present Time" when you speak to Chromie takes you into the Shadowlands Era where it's mostly the Post-Cata World but with some changes to old world from Legion, BFA and SL.

"The Cataclysm" timeline when you speak to Chromie is already preserved there for leveling use exactly as you said, however not -certainly- there only to keep it as the 'mainline Kalimdor/EK leveling' forever.

I find Blizz making BFA the default Timeline and leveling zones for a Brand New Player indicative that Cata is considered outdated and not the ideal standard of what most of Azeroth should be.

[Makabreska]

I find Blizz making BFA the default Timeline and leveling zones for a Brand New Player indicative that Cata is considered outdated and not the ideal standard of what most of Azeroth should be.

Well the reasoning they gave us was to make new players familiar with current story and characters. But these zones are defo more attractive to them than revamped Vanilla.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

SO when can we realistically expect a 10.0 reveal? IIRC, SL was announced just 2 months after 8.3's reveal. That would put us around the January / February mark, which was when Blizzcon was supposed to be. Given it was cancelled, I would expect something maybe a little later, so probably around March / April? Alpha / Beta to follow in the Summer then a Q1 2023 release?

I'm guessing probably May at this point. Once the big guilds have cleared Sepelchur and all that information is out there on Youtube and such.

Probably beta spinning up in the Fall, launch I've honestly started to slip into Q2 2023 at this point, maybe Q1 if they get beta out in the Summer of next year yet.

- - - Updated - - -

Revamp is unlikely since they would never redo every single zone for max level content in one expansion. And given that they just redid the leveling experience, they're not going to repurpose them for leveling (ala Cata) either. Thus, we can either expect the "new" zones for the expac to be a couple zones redone from Kalimdor / EK OR a new landmass aka Dragon Isles.

While it would be cool if every zone had its art updated to modern standards, I don't understand what else a world revamp would entail. Having max level content across every zone is unfeasible and would probably just amount to shallow world quests at best.

I mean that assumes that they haven't already been working on it for a while.

I will once again encourage everyone to revisit the BFA zones. No not the KT/Zandalar zones, the EK/Kalimdor zones. Every asset in there is ready to apply globally already, plus all the HD mobs we've gotten over the years.



But I do expect the "new" content will be underwhelming either way. Revamp or no revamp, my money's on 3-4 new zones total.

[Nyel]

Patch can be late. Never expansion. It's simply reset for this game, both population and reputation.

SL would have been far better if they delay it 5 months and be ready to implement Legion cycle for patches. From design perspective it stomps over Legion, but drought make people sick of every single patch.

Oh I do not disagree here.

But I still find it super odd that they delayed everything in Shadowlands and finish the expansion with 9.2 just to give us a massively delayed expansion as well. That doesn't make any sense in my opinion.

Even if they're struggling with the lawsuit and COVID, making Shadowlands trashy is one thing that can be dealt with. But I would do everything to get the next expansion a) done right and b) in time. Delaying that on top of the entire disaster that Shadowlands was just makes absolutely no sense in my eyes and should be avoided at any cost.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Oh I do not disagree here.

But I still find it super odd that they delayed everything in Shadowlands and finish the expansion with 9.2 just to give us a massively delayed expansion as well. That doesn't make any sense in my opinion.

Even if they're struggling with the lawsuit and COVID, making Shadowlands trashy is one thing that can be dealt with. But I would do everything to get the next expansion a) done right and b) in time. Delaying that on top of the entire disaster that Shadowlands was just makes absolutely no sense in my eyes and should be avoided at any cost.

The reason to delay 10.0 and make Shadowlands trash is because Naxxrammas. So much of WoW's funky patch cycle and raid changes can be traced back to how many players bitched in 2006 that they never had a chance to step foot in Naxxrammas because of how the game was structured in Classic. It's why Blizz always leaves the final raid open way too long, it's why they eventually scaled down raid sizes, it's why catchup mechanics became the word of the day at Blizzard.

If they were bullheadedly saying "we'll delay 10.0 and give a full 3 patches to Shadowlands" we'd be talking about 10.0 in 2024 at this point to not have a rushed 9.3. If they said "We're pulling the plug on Shadowlands just get 10.0 done on time" and assuming they could get it done on time with Covid and the Lawsuit stopping production every other week it feels like, then 9.1 would have been the last patch. Meaning they would have had to have pulled the plug basically before knowing Shadowlands would be bad.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

I am genuinely impressed by how Bobby managed to steer the company into this FY2022 hole. He did not make it easier for himself thats' for sure.

Hopefully the Warcraft Mobile Titles release next year and Diablo Immortal is a huge success.

Obviously Q4 2022 with MW2 (Which will be a nostalgia bomb) and a WoW expansion would help though. But, again the timeframe of that whole expansion seems screwy unless the Shadowlands is WoD and next expansion is Legion theory hold true.

But yeah 3 Quarters where nothing is going on? Sheesh.

[Nyel]

The reason to delay 10.0 and make Shadowlands trash is because Naxxrammas. So much of WoW's funky patch cycle and raid changes can be traced back to how many players bitched in 2006 that they never had a chance to step foot in Naxxrammas because of how the game was structured in Classic. It's why Blizz always leaves the final raid open way too long, it's why they eventually scaled down raid sizes, it's why catchup mechanics became the word of the day at Blizzard.

If they were bullheadedly saying "we'll delay 10.0 and give a full 3 patches to Shadowlands" we'd be talking about 10.0 in 2024 at this point to not have a rushed 9.3. If they said "We're pulling the plug on Shadowlands just get 10.0 done on time" and assuming they could get it done on time with Covid and the Lawsuit stopping production every other week it feels like, then 9.1 would have been the last patch. Meaning they would have had to have pulled the plug basically before knowing Shadowlands would be bad.

8-9 months of Sepulcher are more than enough. No guild needs so much time to clear a raid that's catering to their capabilities (not every guild is meant to clear a mythic raid).

If they always planned Shadowlands to end with 9.2 they already were aware of this. That's why delaying 10.0 until mid 2023 makes little to no sense, even if they couldn't have known about the lawsuit and ongoing scandal.

[Hitei]

8-9 months of Sepulcher are more than enough. No guild needs so much time to clear a raid that's catering to their capabilities (not every guild is meant to clear a mythic raid).

If they always planned Shadowlands to end with 9.2 they already were aware of this. That's why delaying 10.0 until mid 2023 makes little to no sense, even if they couldn't have known about the lawsuit and ongoing scandal.

Seems totally arbitrary. Why is a guild that takes 9 months to reach farm status fine but not one that takes 10 or 11?

[huth]

Oh I do not disagree here.

But I still find it super odd that they delayed everything in Shadowlands and finish the expansion with 9.2 just to give us a massively delayed expansion as well. That doesn't make any sense in my opinion.

Even if they're struggling with the lawsuit and COVID, making Shadowlands trashy is one thing that can be dealt with. But I would do everything to get the next expansion a) done right and b) in time. Delaying that on top of the entire disaster that Shadowlands was just makes absolutely no sense in my eyes and should be avoided at any cost.

They still need to make that expansion. It's not gonna spring out of the void fully formed. Whether you like that or not has little to do with the reality of them having to do the work.