Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Sondrelk]

I mean, as soon as you unlocked the Runecarver, it became pretty clear (if you followed the story): in Maldraxxus you learn that the Runecarver is missing; the Runecarver sealed the Seat of the Primus with five runes. In Torghast you find a mysterious giant that lost his memories. He unlocks Runecarving for you... I mean, it couldn't be more obvious.

A twist would have been that the Runecarver is not the Primus, but that would have been silly after all the foreshadowing.

There were definitely hints that made it clear if you looked at all of them and thought about it for a bit, but it was hardly an obvious spelled out twist, it did require some degree of piecing the clues together.

On a more general note though this is why twists generally are difficult to pull off in stories with large fanbases like this. Someone is eventually going to stumble upon the correct outcome, and once it gains traction it will just become increasingly obvious once more hints are added.

The important part is whether the twist works in context, and whether it is a twist in-story, which I would say it is. Necrolord players should probably have pieced it together earlier in-story, but given the limitations of 4 distinct stories it works well enough.

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Let us not forget the lesson of GoT season 8. Just because you didn't anticipate it doesn't make it a good twist.

If all you want is shock value then you could have made the Primus Zovaal from the future, or something equally absurd.

[huth]

I figured since they fuck up every squish they would save themselves future trouble and be ok with mythic of the previous tier not get replaced with normal gear

They didn't "fuck up". That was by design. They never expected it to go any other way. Not doing what you want them to isn't "fucking up". Not realising the squishes were never meant to stop the gear inflation is, though.

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There were definitely hints that made it clear if you looked at all of them and thought about it for a bit, but it was hardly an obvious spelled out twist, it did require some degree of piecing the clues together.

On a more general note though this is why twists generally are difficult to pull off in stories with large fanbases like this. Someone is eventually going to stumble upon the correct outcome, and once it gains traction it will just become increasingly obvious once more hints are added.

Let's not forget that some people actually took the Primus model as evidence he wasn't the Runecarver, despite him literally looking the same except with a robe and no mask. It's not like everybody was already convinced previously.

But yes, the only way they could actually pull off a twist would be by not foreshadowing it at all... and that wouldn't be a twist so much as an asspull.

[Xorzor]

Theory #1: Tyrande is a boss in the last patch of the expansion. Whether a raid boss or world boss, I couldn't guess.

Theory #2: If a Light-themed expansion happens, AU Xe'ra should be the final boss of the final raid - The Siege of Shattrath.

Theory #3: Murozond is still alive, and what we killed in the End Time dungeon was a temporal echo, an illusion if you will. To end Murozond once and for all, time-travel shenanigans will be employed in a time-themed expansion. The final battle will be of Endgame-like proportions.

[Sondrelk]

Theory #1: Tyrande is a boss in the last patch of the expansion. Whether a raid boss or world boss, I couldn't guess.

Theory #2: If a Light-themed expansion happens, AU Xe'ra should be the final boss of the final raid - The Siege of Shattrath.

Theory #3: Murozond is still alive, and what we killed in the End Time dungeon was a temporal echo, an illusion if you will. To end Murozond once and for all, time-travel shenanigans will be employed in a time-themed expansion. The final battle will be of Endgame-like proportions.

Just quickly chiming in for the Murozonf thing. If we want to fight him again in a climactic battle it doesnt even need toinvalidate the old fight at all honestly. Just have a boss fight where we fight him enough to weaken him so he can actually be killed by our previous selves. Would make him a credible threat as a raid boss and also retcon how weak he was as a dungeon boss.

[huth]

Just quickly chiming in for the Murozonf thing. If we want to fight him again in a climactic battle it doesnt even need toinvalidate the old fight at all honestly. Just have a boss fight where we fight him enough to weaken him so he can actually be killed by our previous selves. Would make him a credible threat as a raid boss and also retcon how weak he was as a dungeon boss.

We can even reason that we mustn't kill him yet because we have already done so later. (yay, time travel tenses!)

[TheFirstOnes]

Theory #1: Tyrande is a boss in the last patch of the expansion. Whether a raid boss or world boss, I couldn't guess.

Theory #2: If a Light-themed expansion happens, AU Xe'ra should be the final boss of the final raid - The Siege of Shattrath.

Theory #3: Murozond is still alive, and what we killed in the End Time dungeon was a temporal echo, an illusion if you will. To end Murozond once and for all, time-travel shenanigans will be employed in a time-themed expansion. The final battle will be of Endgame-like proportions.

You're seriously saying Xe'ra, someone that got 1 shot by fucking Illidan Stormrage...should be the final boss of a Light expansion?

Also, regarding the time shit and the Light, they could just be beginner plotlines in the Light/Shadow expac, and they both could end off as the beginner raids of the expac.

Then, we could go directly into the Void Lords, the realms of Void and Light, Elune, Sargeras, etc.

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Also, why would Tyrande be a boss? At worst, she's just going through what UI Goku went through in the Tournament of Power, AKA a massive toll on the body due to the massive divine power they put themselves through.

[razorpax]

What hints? At best the hints we got was that the Primus was a good blacksmith and was not confirmed dead and that there was a blacksmith trapped in Torghast who could make good weapons.

That is a perfectly reasonable amount of hints. Too many would be confirmation that he was alive, or specific acknowledgment that the last time he was seen was when he was going to check on the Jailer.

Same voice

The runecarver had amnesia which is normally the case when it’s an important character

But all that aside my point is people keep thinking blizz is going to make a giant mega twist nobody expects but it’s just really easy to figure out with the only thing people had against the two being the same person was a statues finger

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They didn't "fuck up". That was by design. They never expected it to go any other way. Not doing what you want them to isn't "fucking up". Not realising the squishes were never meant to stop the gear inflation is, though.

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Let's not forget that some people actually took the Primus model as evidence he wasn't the Runecarver, despite him literally looking the same except with a robe and no mask. It's not like everybody was already convinced previously.

But yes, the only way they could actually pull off a twist would be by not foreshadowing it at all... and that wouldn't be a twist so much as an asspull.

When I say fuck up I meant how you get wrecked in legacy content or they forget to scale hp or some trinkets

I don’t think it’s by design that a Vanilla trinket could one shot everything in current Content. Instead of all that having to be done every two years because they have an ilvl boner they could keep it low for at least two expansions by cutting the power gains in half.

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Theory #1: Tyrande is a boss in the last patch of the expansion. Whether a raid boss or world boss, I couldn't guess.

Theory #2: If a Light-themed expansion happens, AU Xe'ra should be the final boss of the final raid - The Siege of Shattrath.

Theory #3: Murozond is still alive, and what we killed in the End Time dungeon was a temporal echo, an illusion if you will. To end Murozond once and for all, time-travel shenanigans will be employed in a time-themed expansion. The final battle will be of Endgame-like proportions.

1. Doubtful due to how her story is progressing

2. Xera is possibly alive but I do wanna see the army of light with a lightforged grom

3. He is inevitable and the absence of nozdormu is the “the infinite are coming” hint

[TheFirstOnes]

Their last statement regardin class sets was that they're coming later in Shadowlands - and this was said when, last year? Or did they say anything about it during Blizzcon?
______

I liked the Legion story until 7.3. The whole Argus stuff was horrible. Suramar and Nighthold was excellent though, the best they've done yet.

Argus felt rushed imo. Antorus was badass though.

[Houle]

Argus felt rushed imo. Antorus was badass though.

the "biggest legion invasion ever" AND argus was simply too much for a single xpac.
over 2/3 of legion was us trying to push the legion back through their portal and close it. the longest part of the addon.
but then, in the last third of the addon, we suddenly rush to the legions home planet, kill everything there, end the legion and imprison sargeras. it happened wayyy to fast, given that the entire addon before was merely trying to survive them.
argus shouldve been its own xpac.

[Stardrift]

Nice theory. Better than all of the space stuff with Brokers etc. Void Lords can stay away.

By the way... what if the Eye of Odyn is the Eye of the Jailer?

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Fighting in Orbios / Arbiter's room makes sense, but what purpose des Oribos serve for the Jailer on top of that? The gateway to Azeroth.

Thanks! I absolute dread to see the theory come to fruition! While I would love that it's happening, I'd definitely hate how it's happening lol

And yes, good catch.

[TheFirstOnes]

the "biggest legion invasion ever" AND argus was simply too much for a single xpac.
over 2/3 of legion was us trying to push the legion back through their portal and close it. the longest part of the addon.
but then, in the last third of the addon, we suddenly rush to the legions home planet, kill everything there, end the legion and imprison sargeras. it happened wayyy to fast, given that the entire addon before was merely trying to survive them.
argus shouldve been its own xpac.

Maybe. But reminder what BFA and SL are...

They are also "WAY TOO MUCH" for a single expac lmaooo. Hell, BFA is 3 LITERAL EXPANSION PLOTS IN 1!!!!

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I'm onto something I believe. Hear me out

With recent PTR quests involving Odyn, I am convinced Galakrond will be resurrected by the Jailer, or somebody. He'll be the tie in to bringing the Jailer's ultimate goal in ending Azeroth and claiming her world soul.

Galakrond being the equivalent to Jormungandr from Norse mythology. Having been defeated at the hands of the Dragon aspects, in extension to the titan keepers of Northrend (Where Icecrown is located in, just overlooking Galakrond's corpse in the Dragonwastes, the same place Kel'thuzad was overseeing the resurrection of said corpse), who are also followers of Odyn.

It would make sense for Odyn to get indirectly involved in taking down Galakrond like that, especially after sacrificing his eye to view the Shadowlands and his death, at the hands of you guessed it, Galakrond.

Jailer shovels a load of anima into Galakrond, resurrecting him in order to thrust the end of all things upon Azeroth. With the return of Galakrond, who else do we look to for help? Those who last defeated him, of course! With Ysera's return, and Wrathion's most recent discovery of the Dragon Isles, where do you think we are headed in order to find a way to restore power to the Dragon Aspects??

While I would want to see Mawsworn Galakrond, I don't think that will be the factor that makes him claim Azeroth. If anything, I don't think he'll be a factor AT ALL!

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Fuckin Mawsworn Galakrond becomes a bigger threat than Sargeras LMAOOOO

[Aeluron Lightsong]

the "biggest legion invasion ever" AND argus was simply too much for a single xpac.
over 2/3 of legion was us trying to push the legion back through their portal and close it. the longest part of the addon.
but then, in the last third of the addon, we suddenly rush to the legions home planet, kill everything there, end the legion and imprison sargeras. it happened wayyy to fast, given that the entire addon before was merely trying to survive them.
argus shouldve been its own xpac.

People were already whining about how it was all about demons and Fel, it would of been too much and the story ended fine. Sargeras is being saved for the future. It would not of gone as smoothly as you think it would, maybe you and I would be pretty satisfied but that doesn't mean the whole internet would like it.

[Nagawithlegs]

I think there is a very sizable chance that 9.2 will take place in Northrend. We are out of realms in Shadowlands and have items for all of them, including the Brokers. We know Zovaal wants to come to Azeroth and he is "ascending" in the Sylvanas fight. Maybe literally.

Now check out how they recently made a polar bear model and now are updating the mammoth running animations. There is also a possible new shoveltusk model in the works (see: this trophy in the revamped human inn from the files). Even if the model isn't new, this could point to the revamped human houses being in Northrend.



What if they revamp Northrend for 9.2?

[Varodoc]

I think there is a very sizable chance that 9.2 will take place in Northrend. We are out of realms in Shadowlands and have items for all of them, including the Brokers. We know Zovaal wants to come to Azeroth and he is "ascending" in the Sylvanas fight. Maybe literally.

Now check out how they recently made a polar bear model and now are updating the mammoth running animations. There is also a possible new shoveltusk model in the works (see: this trophy in the revamped human inn from the files).



What if they revamp Northrend for 9.2?

Revamping what zone of Northrend, precisely? Grizzly Hills? Icecrown was already revamped by the way.

They aren't revamping the whole continent for a single patch though, that's not happening.

[TheFirstOnes]

I think there is a very sizable chance that 9.2 will take place in Northrend. We are out of realms in Shadowlands and have items for all of them, including the Brokers. We know Zovaal wants to come to Azeroth and he is "ascending" in the Sylvanas fight. Maybe literally.

Now check out how they recently made a polar bear model and now are updating the mammoth running animations. There is also a possible new shoveltusk model in the works (see: this trophy in the revamped human inn from the files). Even if the model isn't new, this could point to the revamped human houses being in Northrend.



What if they revamp Northrend for 9.2?

I don't know about Northrend. I do know 9.2 will be about the Jailer trying to claim Life for himself though.

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Revamping what zone of Northrend, precisely? Grizzly Hills? Icecrown was already revamped by the way.

They aren't revamping the whole continent for a single patch though, that's not happening.

I don't think that's what he means. Also, the Inn from the thing there moreso represents Goldshire. Exact same layout and everything.

[Kiivar86]

and now are updating the mammoth running animations.

Oh? First I'm hearing of this. Good if so, the mammoth's running animation always bothered me.

[TheFirstOnes]

"and now are updating the mammoth running animations."

Meh. That in itself doesn't mean much. They also updated the Boar model this patch too. They're likely prepping for a revamped Azeroth tbh, which is good...

Azeroth's been stuck in 2004/2007/2010 for over 10 years now.

[Nagawithlegs]

"and now are updating the mammoth running animations."

Meh. That in itself doesn't mean much. They also updated the Boar model this patch too. They're likely prepping for a revamped Azeroth tbh, which is good...

Azeroth's been stuck in 2004/2007/2010 for over 10 years now.

I think it means something when the mammoth hasn't received an update in ages and (if I remember right) mammoths only come from Northrend.

The boar update is great and definitely points to revamp (we're running out of NOT updated models: Gnolls and regular Dragons should be soon) but the mammoth being singled out is interesting. Almost like there will be new mammoth mounts.

[TheFirstOnes]

I think it means something when the mammoth hasn't received an update in ages and (if I remember right) mammoths only come from Northrend.

The boar update is great and definitely points to revamp (we're running out of NOT updated models: Gnolls and regular Dragons should be soon) but the mammoth being singled out is interesting. Almost like there will be new mammoth mounts.

Maybe? We had the entire pre-patch focused on Northrend though. 9.2 being all about Northrend will be off. I think 9.2 will be a mix of things, such as the Gardens of Life, the Jailer invading Reality, etc.

Also note that, for some reason, all of the regular Human buildings are being redone in HD. And you don't see those regular ass buildings in Northrend, I don't think.

[Blayze]

hardly an obvious spelled out twist

"oh no! super blacksmith mans missing!" plus "who is mysterious super blacksmith mans?" is so obvious I was hoping for Blizzard's sake they had a twist going.