Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Makabreska]

They literally said she won’t be redeemed

When was that?

Also, WIP cinematic confirms Sylvi was talking about Arthas in her ""when I loosed my arrow". AKA she was in control all that time.

And biggest fuckin shock is people actually liking new Uther-Sylvi cinematic. Actual positive Like/Dislike ratio, imagine that.

[Dracullus]

People loved Uther story and hated Sylvanas story in SL, so in 9.2 Blizzard connected them. That's some 5D chess move.

Of course I'm kidding, obviously story was going in this direction. Problem with SL narration is same like with SL content - because drought it just move too slow.

[Ersula]

Their compromise is yes, Sylvanas wasn't acting out of her own free will, but also, you're responsible things you did when you were mind controlled.

That doesn't make any sense.

Sylvanas embraced extreme antipathy because she couldn't bear the thought of what she did while she was a slave of the scourge, which the soul shard Sylvanas also cannot bear. 3 layers of sylvanas, and an enormous contradiction that you're somehow responsible for shit you weren't even mentally present for.

It's like poetry, it rhymes. Honestly it wouldn't be this big contradiction if Teldrassil wasn't part of it. Sylvanas joining the jailer doesn't add any dimension to the story. The story would have been much less confounding if she had just been the main protagonist of shadowlands. Would anything have been that different if Teldrassil didn't burn? We probably wouldn't have gotten this Elune-ruining Tyrande storyline but yeah, that's a plus.

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Where is this Nathnos stuff coming from? Did I miss something on wowhead?

It's the absence of Nathanos. He's allegedly important to her character but now he's not even mentioned. But hey, Malfurion got the same treatment.

[Bsirk]

It's the absence of Nathanos. He's allegedly important to her character but now he's not even mentioned. But hey, Malfurion got the same treatment.

Actually there is some 9.2 Sylvanus voice lines in a youtube video where she mentions finding him. (Well I'm guessing she's talking about him)

[Makorus]

To all the people who insisted that Sylvanas talks about the Jailer in the voice lines and not Arthas: Told you so.

[Sondrelk]

I am curious how they will reconcile the two very distinct halves of Sylvanas. I struggle to wrap my head around how two horribly distinct sides could possibly be reconciled. Maybe Anduin, seeing as saving him might be an action both halves would be down for?

I still don't like how the two halves are effectively treated as two separate entities though. Yes it does make sense, but it also kinda undercuts the drama when Uther and Sylvanas talks about what Sylvanus has done in the third person, rather than facing it head on.
I fear this will end up being good Sylvanas effectively shouldering blame, instead of accepting that not only was she capable of doing this, but she actually did.

This should be Sylvanas conscience almost paralyzing her, not what is effectively a time travelling Sylvanas accepting blame for actions she technically didn't commit.
Hopefully there is some more cutscenes where old and new Sylvanas actually talk and Marge into one, rather than blue eyes Sylvanas effectively removing the Sylvanas we actually know.


It might be a minor point in the grand scheme, but it really would be as if the Sylvanas we know disappeared from the plot, and we instead get a new one we don't actually know.

[Raetary]

Did they retcon High Elf eyes?

???

What did they retcon? Her eyes are blue.

Edit: nvm, i realized they don't really *glow* on her living-self.

[bagina]

Sylvia Breezejogger says:
We are more than slaves to our torments.

Holy mother of cringe. Bizarro Sylvanas.

You can't make this shit up.

[Nyel]

Oh man. All this work put into one single character this expansion, it's insane. Think about it, Sylvanas was the center of most of BfA and now Shadowlands. I don't think they give her a new model just to kill her off in 9.2. So we're stuck with her for many more years. Not even Jaina got this much exposure.

At this point she is way more prominently featured than the Jailer. The Jailer, while being above her and everything else, just feels like a random dude next to Sylvanas' screentime.

[Chickat]

Oh man. All this work put into one single character this expansion, it's insane. Think about it, Sylvanas was the center of most of BfA and now Shadowlands. I don't think they give her a new model just to kill her off in 9.2. So we're stuck with her for many more years. Not even Jaina got this much exposure.

At this point she is way more prominently featured than the Jailer. The Jailer, while being above her and everything else, just feels like a random dude next to Sylvanas' screentime.

Yeah I think they should have had her in the background for an expansion or two with just voice lines and trickles of lore about the jailer to get us used to him. Then give him much more screen time.

[YYDelive]

Nathnos...ah...What a familiar name

I suspect that after SL is over, she stayed and started looking for Nathnos, unless 9.2 will find him in Zereth Mortis

[Sondrelk]

Someone pointed out, and I wonder if this might actually be the "best" end to Sylvanas.
What if at the end of Shadowlands we just leave Sylvanas in the Shadowlands to search for Nathanos. She doesnt come back, she doesnt get a fancy new title. She is just left in exile in the Shadowlands searching for Nathanos and we never see or hear from her again?
It would remove her from the plot completely, but still leave a tiny bit of leeway in case the writers want to use her again, and it is a halfway decent callback to Alleria and Turalyon being gone "forever".

I think that kind of ending might work actually. Even if her character will be forever soured to me by the writers seemingly emotionally blackmailing us into feeling bad for blue eyes Sylvanas for actions the game has positioned itself as to not being her fault.

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Nathnos...ah...What a familiar name

I suspect that after SL is over, she will stay in the shadow world and start looking for Nathnos, unless 9.2 will find him in Zereth Mortis

I imagine that might be the best ending for her character at this point. She doesnt get redemption, she doesnt get to return to Azeroth, and she doesnt really taint the story at all with her presence.
Even for Tyrande it should be a fitting end. She doesnt get direct vengeance, but she can feel confident Sylvanas will never come back to Azeroth again.

[Raetary]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMcU1zWnws4

The new crown looks like trash.

[ParanoiD84]

Well well jailer dies as he lived atleast doing abolutely nothing lol. He must be the most boring and unoriginal villan of all times.

[Lady Atia]

Someone pointed out, and I wonder if this might actually be the "best" end to Sylvanas.
What if at the end of Shadowlands we just leave Sylvanas in the Shadowlands to search for Nathanos. She doesnt come back, she doesnt get a fancy new title. She is just left in exile in the Shadowlands searching for Nathanos and we never see or hear from her again?
It would remove her from the plot completely, but still leave a tiny bit of leeway in case the writers want to use her again, and it is a halfway decent callback to Alleria and Turalyon being gone "forever".

I think that kind of ending might work actually. Even if her character will be forever soured to me by the writers seemingly emotionally blackmailing us into feeling bad for blue eyes Sylvanas for actions the game has positioned itself as to not being her fault.

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I imagine that might be the best ending for her character at this point. She doesnt get redemption, she doesnt get to return to Azeroth, and she doesnt really taint the story at all with her presence.
Even for Tyrande it should be a fitting end. She doesnt get direct vengeance, but she can feel confident Sylvanas will never come back to Azeroth again.

They don't set up a Sylvanas with new armour and new soul for her to not going back to Azeroth. We will get our Ranger General back, and she will be a propper main character again similiar to Thrall and Jaina. Also they can do a real Windrunner reunion now. Can't wait for it!

[Sondrelk]

They don't set up a Sylvanas with new armour and new soul for her to not going back to Azeroth. We will get our Ranger General back, and she will be a propper main character again similiar to Thrall and Jaina. Also they can do a real Windrunner reunion now. Can't wait for it!

We do actually have som dialogue that implies Sylvanas will spend time finding Nathanos again, which reads to me like the writers taking Sylvanas out of the story in a way that allows her to return one day.

And characters get new models all the time only to die. Varian got a new model that was used solely for the Legion scenario on the Broken Shore. I really don't see why the same couldnt happen to Sylvanas here. It isnt exaclty a massively complex model to begin with. If she returns she can use it, but as is it is a nice model for this one patch.

[Lady Atia]

We do actually have som dialogue that implies Sylvanas will spend time finding Nathanos again, which reads to me like the writers taking Sylvanas out of the story in a way that allows her to return one day.

And characters get new models all the time only to die. Varian got a new model that was used solely for the Legion scenario on the Broken Shore. I really don't see why the same couldnt happen to Sylvanas here. It isnt exaclty a massively complex model to begin with. If she returns she can use it, but as is it is a nice model for this one patch.

They didn't even bother giving Illidan new HD glaives because they knew they wouldn't use his model for the next few Expansions. And I'm fine with her spending some time with Nathanos only for both to be back in the future. Or maybe they could turn the whole quest into a dungeon where we help her free him from Torghast, that would be cool.

[Sondrelk]

They didn't even bother giving Illidan new HD glaives because they knew they wouldn't use his model for the next few Expansions. And I'm fine with her spending some time with Nathanos only for both to be back in the future. Or maybe they could turn the whole quest into a dungeon where we help her free him from Torghast, that would be cool.

They did however give Illidan a new HD model. The lack of HD glaives meanwhile is explained by the players having them, it would be very odd to have to explain how Illidan has them despite them being a well known thing we took from him in TBC.

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Anduin got a model that was only used for a single questline in 7.2. Which of course is barely scratching the surface of the large amounts of boss models that gets used for one single boss battle.

[Lamoth]

The long 'split soul' cinematic looks off to me. Models are too anime and generally animation does not feel like wow engine. Reminds me of that horrible Arthas Vs Illidian battle cinematic from Reforged, not as bad of course, but wouldn't be surprised if they have outsourced this.

The dialog/story is good though.

[Fahrad Wagner]

Am I the only one not mad at the cinematic? Of all ways to partially redeem Sylvanas but still punish her, this was probably the best compromise.

To me, this is not a full redemption at all and that's the whole point of this video: it doesn't matter the best part of her soul was gone or locked away, those were still HER actions. They were unforgivable and she realises (and accepts?) she will have to pay for them and face consequences.

I don't know, I was expecting to hate whatever they'd come up with regarding Sylvanas, and I kind of like this. Let's wait and see, hoping they don't screw it up with the last chapter.