Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Mehrunes]

Says you. Person who thinks Shadowlands is a good expansion

I mean, that is a good point, but I still can't think of a possible future expansion that'd make SL look like the highpoint of WoW harder than that one.

[Syegfryed]

It is a good expansion. I'm not the biggest fan of the aesthetic overall but all of the systems are *chefs kiss* its still a better aesthetic than an entire expansion focused on Goblins/Gnomes would be.

Goblins and gnomes are at least, warcraft, unlike shadowlands bs.

"better aesthetic", lmao, shadowlands was the first wow expansion that it did not look like wow.

[Teriz]

I think if they did it so that Undermine was a max level only zone ala Suramar it would work well but as a whole expansion focus I just dont see it working at all. Then again like you said they managed to expand Pandaria pretty well so who knows. MoP was definitely super one note on theme though. It's still my absolute favorite expansion by a very long margin with the best raid they ever put in the game but it was still one note. I think that's why we havent seen any expansions since then do a single aesthetic.

Well keep in mind that Undermine was at one point conceived to be a continent. Like all continents, you could have the city center, and then have outlying areas. I agree that they should use the Suramar model for the city proper, and honestly make an entire zone a massive city, maybe controlled by rival factions. Once you leave the city zone, then you can have more nature-based areas, smaller outposts/sluicetowns, underground forests, volcanic or undersea tunnels/tubes, and some other wild stuff. Maybe even some Azjol Nerub stuff, or that evil robot army from "The War" since we're underground?

With all that said, I believe WoW fans would be pleased to have a connected continent again.

[Hitei]

"better aesthetic", lmao, shadowlands was the first wow expansion that it did not look like wow.

This is in the running for the most dishonest statement I've ever seen on these forums.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

This is in the running for the most dishonest statement I've ever seen on these forums.

No I think the dude believes it, but man that sentiment is absurd.

[Revamp Man]

The old world is also very wide open and easy to navigate. The people designing wow zones since WoD have lost their minds, designing the most annoying cluttered shit ever.

I am 100% sure it is to slow players down

[Therougetitan]

It is a good expansion. I'm not the biggest fan of the aesthetic overall but all of the systems are *chefs kiss* its still a better aesthetic than an entire expansion focused on Goblins/Gnomes would be.

All the systems introduced in Shadowlands were bad on release. They are good now but at launch they were terribly implemented. Covenants either should have always been freely switchable or not have player power tied to them so it is purely aesthetic. The conduit energy was a meme and pointless so it was removed finally a year in. Anima was terrible to get and it took them several months to buff the drop rates to acceptable levels. Loot system was set to 3 drops per boss for many months before it was put up to a tolerable 4. Shards of domination was extremely bad and they realize that now.

So it strikes me as odd you give a chef's kiss to the systems when so much had to be changed after such a delay for it to be good state.

[Syegfryed]

This is in the running for the most dishonest statement I've ever seen on these forums.

compared to others, yes it is just like that. the ambience and thematic is less warcraft than pandaria was.

or, let me guess, isn't because "shadowlands already existed" despite blueman group and other bs not being a thing yet.

So all you care about is the aesthetic of an expansion?

I don't know how you get that from my comment, only talking about one thing in the specifics does not mean i only care about that.

Systems and content and progression are nothing to you? So if they put out an expansion of just two straight years of Garrosh wiping himself off with a wet towel would that be a high point in your opinion?

Might be in mine tbh cinematic Garrosh was hot af.

I like how you saw the signature and instinctively tried to go for that, like it is my reasons to live or something like that.

- - - Updated - - -

He definitely means it. Anything that isn't Orcs he hates with a passion. Has for years

Its amusing how you take that from the signature joke, when i literally said goblins and gnomes would be better.

[Hitei]

compared to others, yes it is just like that. the ambience and thematic is less warcraft than pandaria was.

or, let me guess, isn't because "shadowlands already existed" despite blueman group and other bs not being a thing yet.

Please explain to me how you think a super Paladin-y zone, a super druid-y zone, a super scourge-y zone, and a dark spirit-y zone are less "warcraft" than pandaria. Let alone shit like fucking Outland, lmao.

[Vakir]

Shadowlands zones are literally compressing already existing Warcraft aesthetics into microcosms like they're fucking Zelda temples.

Shadowlands has tons of problems but the base aesthetics are not among them. If anything they could've gone crazier which is half the complaint of Zereth Mortis.

[LemonDemonGirl]

Wouldn't mind an expansion set in WoW's distant far past. Imagine Chromie in a last-ditch effort after Zovaal or someone irrevocably ruins Azeroth transports the Horde & Alliance back in time.

So... World of Warcraft: The TrollLands?

/jk

[TheFirstOnes]

Now I don't know whats actually coming or not(Dragons or something cosmic).

Why would it be cosmic?

- - - Updated - - -

Dude it’s been a long ass time since 1.0 and we only visited one of the 6 Cosmic Forces in full showing so far, ontop of that we literally fight Zovaal whose literal being is akin to Satans, and who steps outside the “path” like Lucifer in DC cosmology

- - - Updated - - -

We got lots of story to tell man, calm down. SL taught me these plots won’t be rushed, shockingly enough

- - - Updated - - -

The telling of them may be, but they won’t be wasted on for a mere patch of another force yeah?

[Syegfryed]

Please explain to me how you think a super Paladin-y zone, a super druid-y zone, a super scourge-y zone, and a dark spirit-y zone are less "warcraft" than pandaria. Let alone shit like fucking Outland, lmao.

blue-man group, who have shit to do with the races afterlife, scorge 2 eletric bugaloo(no ice theme btw) pretending to be cool, and gothic vampires, are less warcraft than pandaria and outland, by a large mile, lmao.

Ignoring how pandrens existed since wc3, Half of pandaria was faction war and worldbuilding

And outland? serious? shadowlands is more warcraft than the place where the second war ended, homeworld of orcs, for a while home of draenei, and where ilidan and and his army took it?

[Jokubas]

Different speculation: The next expansion isn't a world revamp... it's just a Kalimdor revamp.

The increasing presence of Elune in the story, the renewal plot for the night elves, and the forgiveness theme could lead to a focus on Kalimdor. This would offset some of the issues with Cataclysm by limiting how much they have to deal with at once.

Kalimdor has a ton of potential for continuing lingering plots. Azeroth probably needs more healing and that sword wound is still there as a symbol of the damage. The night elves need a new home (Undercity needs help, but just clearing out the plague is an easy temporary solution that doesn't exist for the night elves). Perhaps a New Theramore could be built as a symbol of cross-faction grouping. Kalimdor has some of the least popular zones, and the Horde could benefit a lot from giving some of their areas a new coat of paint.

We have some improved human buildings, but we also have a lot of new night elf assets and Kalimdor files as well, not to mention some human buildings are on Kalimdor. Green dragons are heavily associated with the night elves, Elune, and Kalimdor, so if that's the deluxe edition mount it still fits.

[Hitei]

blue-man group, who have shit to do with the races afterlife, scorge 2 eletric bugaloo(no ice theme btw) pretending to be cool, and gothic vampires, are less warcraft than pandaria and outland, by a large mile, lmao.

Ignoring how pandrens existed since wc3, Half of pandaria was faction war and worldbuilding

Ah yes, the group of spirit healer paladins are definitely not like anything in warcraft or vanilla, because "blueman group xD" , and the dedicated Scourge zone has no ice theme (did you actually think this was a good argument when you typed it?), so somehow it's not Warcraft, you know, despite most of the undead campaign, and fighting-undead campaigns in WC3 having zero ice aesthetic outside of two units. Since you don't think gothic themes are warcraft, I assume you also hated Kara, and Duskwood, and an entire ICC wing and several dungeons involving the San'layn?

Your basis for pandaria being more warcraft, is that there was a single unrelated, out-of-place side character in a single WC3 map? Did you even stop to consider that "part of MoP was us ignoring Pandaria or bringing non-Pandaria story to Pandaria" is not a very convincing arugment for Pandaria being warcraft aesthetic? Or that "it had worldbuilding and a non-character in WC3" probably isn't the best argument against an expansion that is almost entirely worldbuilding, where a good portion of the cast are important supporting characters in WC3.

And outland? serious? shadowlands is more warcraft than the place where the second war ended, homeworld of orcs, for a while home of draenei, and where ilidan and and his army took it?

Yes, serious. Because I'm sure you didn't notice past the massive chip on your shoulder, but literally everything you named took place in WC3--where Outland was Hellfire, a grounded wasteland of red dirt and orc tribes. Not in floating purple turbo-space where giant vacuum machines sucked mana out of the sky and beamed it down sci-fi pipes to floating spaceship fortresses built by musical shards of light.

But I mean, Maldraxxus doesn't have ice, so I guess that's the one that the one that doesn't have a warcraft aesthetic.

[Polybius]

This is in the running for the most dishonest statement I've ever seen on these forums.

It's WoW just not in the right places or exaggerated. It felt more physical than spiritual. Maldraxxus would work better as Plaguelands, for example. Or Revendreth as an extension of Gilneas. Ardenweald almost a missed opportunity for the Emerald Dream we never got.

On the bright side, Shadowlands has other afterlives within it, we just won't get to see them soon. EDIT: Had forgotten, that Shadowlands teased a race of giants, and we don't know where the Maldraxxus biomass came from.


off topic fact: The Kyrian greek afterlife theme was foreshadowed by unused server names in other world regions.

[Makorus]

Shadowlands is not Warcrafty because it is not based on Warcraft 2/3.

Smoothbrain take.

People should really just throw all the pretense out of the window and say they hate the Shadowlands zones because they are Shadowlands zones.

They could have release Maldraxxus as Upper Plaguelands or something and people would eat that shit about because "Plaguelands? I member Plaguelands!!!"

[Therougetitan]

Because I like them. I liked them on day one. I like them now. It strikes me as odd that it's hard to grasp that everyone likes different things and are gonna have different experiences with said things.

It's why I hope going forward they just lean hard into doing what they want to do with systems and if people like it they like it, if they dont then they dont play. Better that than making them into watered down banal things like has happened multiple times in the past. Like Cata heroics as a great example. On release they were near perfectly tuned. They just should have had slightly better rewards. Instead they destroyed what made then fun rather than sticking to their guns.

There is no good game design in tying player power to covenants or restricting covenant switching. You're right though. If people don't like it they don't play it. That's what they did. That's why they changed it because it chased players off.

Cata heroics is not a good example either. They alienated their casual playerbase by providing no alternative. Cata heroics themselves were good the problem was it came right after Wrath heroics which were a lot easier even at launch. As you said, different people like different things. There were a large casual playerbase that liked casual heroics. If Blizzard had back then created the third option of mythic difficulty but introduced it into Cata instead of WoD and kept the Cata "mythics" hard and heroics easier for casuals it would have worked out. WoW has such a large playerbase of varying skill levels that they shot themselves in the foot by making heroic dungeons hard.

[LorDC]

I wouldn't mind if it was something outside of the box, since it seems like the past couple of expansions have all been relatively easily predicted by fans.

Last time they thought outside the box we got WoD. And that turned out... less than great.

[ercarp]

Last time they thought outside the box we got WoD. And that turned out... less than great.

I always thought WoD was just something they whipped up together to promote the Warcraft movie since it included most of the same cast as far as orcs go. I think MoP is a better example of an outside the box expansion, and that turned out pretty good in the end.