Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Relapses]

Did I trigger you? Seems like that. Calm down. I just listed several factors we can measure the hype level in a few weeks. And I basically corrected your Reddit all the people are working argument. Nothing else.

That wasn't my argument. At this point I'm willing to put full blame on Blizzard for dragging their feet and waiting way too fucking long between patch cycles this expansion. Yeah, that probably has a negative impact on hype. Who fucking cares? The patch is coming out, that's a good thing. We can at least agree on that, right? Or do we need to circlejerk each other into the upper stratosphere over how bad the game is or how much Blizzard sucks for not pumping out patches every exactly 77 days? Like, get over it. Please.

[Nyel]

Got about as much going for him as Sargeras tbh...

Sure, Sargeras which has been teased for 20 years has not more going for him than the Jailer.

The heck, even Denathrius has more going than the Jailer and both have been introduced in the same expansion.

[Santandame]

I wouldn't source wowredit as what the actual community thinks but ok. Just hope the pandemic ends

''Just hope the pandemic ends''.

Hahahaha this guy always brings the goods with his posts. Didn't you know? We're going to be in a pandemic until the end of days.

Should I add an /s for you? I feel like you'd need it.

[Dracullus]

lol what are you even talking about?

You are blind if cant see that the hype for 9.2 is low, compared to other patches.

Also you assume i said there would be no1 playing 9.2 with that stupid empty server comment...dont put words in my mouth.

Of course it's lower, we're not blind to stuff that happened over last year. But that's drought issue (caused by covid, protests and bad managment - they should just delay whole expansion 6 months instead of making every patch 2-3 months too long) and trust to company issue (which have nothing to do with WoW devs that works on current content). SL is tainted by this and only drastic changes/news (like Microsoft buyout or cross faction promise) could be a factor to slowly rebuild trust in general audience.

But it is also unmeasurable, so your comment is pretty pointless. Of course people are not hyped like they was for Argus. Of course game is far from dead. I have no idea how it compares to 8.3. So.. what's the point?

[Nyel]

That wasn't my argument. At this point I'm willing to put full blame on Blizzard for dragging their feet and waiting way too fucking long between patch cycles this expansion. Yeah, that probably has a negative impact on hype. Who fucking cares? The patch is coming out, that's a good thing. We can at least agree on that, right? Or do we need to circlejerk each other into the upper stratosphere over how bad the game is or how much Blizzard sucks for not pumping out patches every exactly 77 days? Like, get over it. Please.

I couldn’t care less, I’m totally indifferent to this expansion. Where Legion invoked love and BfA invoked hate, I feel nothing for Shadowlands. I’ve never been so bored by an expansion before. And I think a lot of players are in the same state as me.

I wasn’t even debating, I just said hype can be measured and we can do so in a few days, maybe weeks. Just compare the likes on the 8.3 and 9.1 release date announcement on Twitter. That alone will be a good indicator. Old Tweets get lost anyway so we really can’t say that the 8.3 tweet got so much more likes over the years.

I feel the same about 9.2, there is not much hype. Nowhere. But that’s just my feeling right now. We can check on that next week and see if the feeling was right or wrong.

[Adaren]

https://subredditstats.com/r/wow

You would always see a huge surge of users on reddit when a patch date was announced, we didnt this time around.

I dont care if you dont believe me.

Alternate interpretation of the same data: the WoW subreddit has become increasingly obnoxious as of late, driving users to hang out in Discord, Twitter, and other communities, and to get their news from more primary sources (like Wowhead's front page).

Just anecdotally, I fell off MMO-Champion in favor of reddit for many years, but have given up reddit entirely recently. I'm no less engaged of a player; WoW reddit just sucks.

[Chickat]

Someone said something about being from the UK, but might be that @Shadochi is from the UK. In that case, you are completely right and it was my misinterpretation.

I was asking if MRGM was from the UK.

[Relapses]

I couldn’t care less, I’m totally indifferent to this expansion. Where Legion invoked love and BfA invoked hate, I feel nothing for Shadowlands. I’ve never been so bored by an expansion before. And I think a lot of players are in the same state as me.

I wasn’t even debating, I just said hype can be measured and we can do so in a few days, maybe weeks. Just compare the likes on the 8.3 and 9.1 release date announcement on Twitter. That alone will be a good indicator. Old Tweets get lost anyway so we really can’t say that the 8.3 tweet got so much more likes over the years.

I feel the same about 9.2, there is not much hype. Nowhere. But that’s just my feeling right now. We can check on that next week and see if the feeling was right or wrong.

If you "didn't care," why the fuck are you so quick to laugh at people trying to provide reasonable explanations for content droughts? Obviously a general poor sense of planning is the bigger endemic issue but I really don't see the point in outright rejecting plausibility of other pandemic-related factors in the development of this expansion. It's just so boring to see take after take that basically amounts to "Blizzard sucks and you're a simp for even questioning this universal truth." I'm over it. I'd hope the people who self-professedly "don't care" would get over it, too.

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Just anecdotally, I fell off MMO-Champion in favor of reddit for many years, but have given up reddit entirely recently. I'm no less engaged of a player; WoW reddit just sucks.

Ironically, the /r/wowcirclejerk unjerk thread is the most positive WoW community on the website.

[TheFirstOnes]

Sure, Sargeras which has been teased for 20 years has not more going for him than the Jailer.

The heck, even Denathrius has more going than the Jailer and both have been introduced in the same expansion.

Yeah, idrc about books or indirect influences about him, I'm talking about a game where every fucking WoW villain suffers the same ole' generic lack of development trope.

[Chickat]

Two Two Two

You want more twos?

Yes, the servers will go up at 2:22pm EST. Est because its the coolest timezone. Im not biased.

[Nyel]

If you "didn't care," why the fuck are you so quick to laugh at people trying to provide reasonable explanations for content droughts? Obviously a general poor sense of planning is the bigger endemic issue but I really don't see the point in outright rejecting plausibility of other pandemic-related factors in the development of this expansion. It's just so boring to see take after take that basically amounts to "Blizzard sucks and you're a simp for even questioning this universal truth." I'm over it. I'd hope the people who self-professedly "don't care" would get over it, too.

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Ironically, the /r/wowcirclejerk unjerk thread is the most positive WoW community on the website.

COVID after two years is no reasonable explanation for the crisis Blizzard is in. That argument was already weak one year ago, right now it’s ridiculous and completely out of touch. That’s why I was denouncing that response, because it’s nonsense.

I didn’t even say anything about Blizzard. I just responded to the hype argument from another person and tried to emphasize on how we could evaluate that later on.

By the way, not caring about Shadowlands doesn’t translate to not caring about WoW.

[Chickat]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post53587601

To be fair its close enough that I will at least entertain the idea that it could be real.

Nvm some contractor would never know all this info or dates. Its fake.

[TheFirstOnes]

"SARGERAS HAD SO MUCH BUILD UP"

He didn't. He has like 3 lines in actuality, and he was rewritten 90 fucking times in the old lore.

[Nyel]

Yeah, idrc about books or indirect influences about him, I'm talking about a game where every fucking WoW villain suffers the same ole' generic lack of development trope.

Sargeras didn’t suffer from that. Neither did Gul‘dan. Nor Deathwing. Heck, even as butchered the N‘zoth storyline was, he was build up for years and years. Nothing you can say about the Jailer who came and went without leaving any impression.

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"SARGERAS HAD SO MUCH BUILD UP"

He didn't. He has like 3 lines in actuality, and he was rewritten 90 fucking times in the old lore.

This is just nonsense. He was teased in the very first novels decades ago and so was his presence in the very first games. He was the inevitable main villain until Legion. Zovaal didn’t even last as long as Gul‘dan.

[Dracullus]

Yes, the servers will go up at 2:22pm EST. Est because its the coolest timezone. Im not biased.

EST coolest timezone? CET got expac releases on midnight (that's half of expac release magic for me) and patches ready very early in the morning (I don't know how they are doing it, must beta test is somewhere else day before).

To be fair its close enough that I will at least entertain the idea that it could be real.

But seriously, don't fall on cheap tricks like this people. Let's have some standards even with fake leaks.

COVID after two years is no reasonable explanation for the crisis Blizzard is in. That argument was already weak one year ago, right now it’s ridiculous and completely out of touch. That’s why I was denouncing that response, because it’s nonsense.

So you seriously see no connection between droughts and covid, huh? You don't grasp idea that events from past has consequences now? 8.1/7.1 was revealed like within month from release and 9.1 3 months after SL launch because they said to themselves "good job lads, let's do nothing for 2 months and drink all that milk we have stolen"?

Obviously reality is much more complicated and of course covid had more impact on 9.0 than 9.2. There were protests, at some point they decided to scrap 9.3 and had to rethink other patches. Maybe the even moved 9.2 date to decrease 9.2->10.0 gap, PTR was suspiciously advanced since first build (of course not parts depending on feedback/data from people).

[Relapses]

COVID after two years is no reasonable explanation for the crisis Blizzard is in. That argument was already weak one year ago, right now it’s ridiculous and completely out of touch. That’s why I was denouncing that response, because it’s nonsense.

I didn’t even say anything about Blizzard. I just responded to the hype argument from another person and tried to emphasize on how we could evaluate that later on.

By the way, not caring about Shadowlands doesn’t translate to not caring about WoW.

AFAIK, they're still working at home using an entirely different work pipeline than they would have used in-office. You'd think after two years they'd get better at it but I don't see the point of speculating cynically about the internal dynamics of Blizzard. For all we know, part of the reason they're taking so long is so that they can ensure there are checks and balances in place to prevent the same thing from happening in 10.0. So while C19 is a pretty shitty excuse, it's not entirely outside the realm of reason.

Also "not caring about Shadowlands doesn't translate into not caring about WoW" is the bullshit that Bellendular built an entire YouTube empire of cynicism on. I don't believe it for a second. When I don't care about something, I stop engaging with it entirely. I don't go to forums for a product I'm not engaged with to proudly profess to the world how that product no longer engages me. (Or in Baldular's case, make five or six videos about how Blizzard's API "prove" Shadowlands sucks.) It's weird that for WoW this behavior is not only welcomed, but expected and embraced. It's so strange.

[Nask]

COVID after two years is no reasonable explanation for the crisis Blizzard is in. That argument was already weak one year ago, right now it’s ridiculous and completely out of touch. That’s why I was denouncing that response, because it’s nonsense.

I didn’t even say anything about Blizzard. I just responded to the hype argument from another person and tried to emphasize on how we could evaluate that later on.

By the way, not caring about Shadowlands doesn’t translate to not caring about WoW.

So COVID wasn't a thing one year ago or what? Let's take something other than Blizzard. Redditor's baby, Endwalker, got delayed and got content cut because of COVID and that was released late last year? The fact that you are that ignorant about how much COVID affected game development is funny and kinda sad.

[TheFirstOnes]

Sargeras didn’t suffer from that. Neither did Gul‘dan. Nor Deathwing. Heck, even as butchered the N‘zoth storyline was, he was build up for years and years. Nothing you can say about the Jailer which came and went without leaving any impression.

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This is just nonsense. He was teased in the very first novels decades ago and so was his presence in the very first games. He was the inevitable main villain until Legion. Zovaal didn’t even last as long as Gul‘dan.

Gul'dan we actually see do shit, same with Azshara. They're fine. Sargeras IN THE GAME however has like...1 cinematic of him proving ANYTHING, and like 90 other things that are either referenced IN BOOKS OR OTHERWISE, most of what Sargeras has done IN THE GAME ITSELF was be binded by his brethren, have his army FAIL horribly in tryna obtain Eonar's essence, lose Argus and have the Unmaker's nascent death empowered magics used not only against the Dark Titan himself, but have Sargeras' manifested power influence also fly alongside the OTHER part of Argus' power and fuck up the Arbiter for Zovaal to infuse it with and regain both his power, and potentially some extra raw power due to that Argus/Sargeras ordeal etc.

Hell, EVEN THEN, THAT GOT RELEGATED TO ZOVAAL DOUBLE FUCKING SARGERAS OVER NOW!!! So...Sargeras IN THE GAME has him failing to crush us while he's getting pulled by the Pantheon of Order's combined magic binding ritual, etc. BUT HE ALSO CAUSED LESS DAMAGE TO AZEROTH WHEN STABBING IT THAN DEATHWING!!! AND NOW ZOVAAL IS GOING TO FUCKING HARM AZEROTH TO CLOSE TO DEATH AND PERMANENTLY FUCK OVER THE FIRST ONES' DESIGN!!!

[Chickat]

EST coolest timezone? CET got expac releases on midnight (that's half of expac release magic for me) and patches ready very early in the morning (I don't know how they are doing it, must beta test is somewhere else day before).



But seriously, don't fall on cheap tricks like this people. Let's have some standards even with fake leaks.

Yeah, I hadn't even read it, I was just willing to entertain the idea. The whole post is terrible and unbelievable.

[Varodoc]

Gul'dan we actually see do shit, same with Azshara. They're fine. Sargeras IN THE GAME however has like...1 cinematic of him proving ANYTHING, and like 90 other things that are either referenced IN BOOKS OR OTHERWISE, most of what Sargeras has done IN THE GAME ITSELF was be binded by his brethren, have his army FAIL horribly in tryna obtain Eonar's essence, lose Argus and have the Unmaker's nascent death empowered magics used not only against the Dark Titan himself, but have Sargeras' manifested power influence also fly alongside the OTHER part of Argus' power and fuck up the Arbiter for Zovaal to infuse it with and regain both his power, and potentially some extra raw power due to that Argus/Sargeras ordeal etc.

Hell, EVEN THEN, THAT GOT RELEGATED TO ZOVAAL DOUBLE FUCKING SARGERAS OVER NOW!!! So...Sargeras IN THE GAME has him failing to crush us while he's getting pulled by the Pantheon of Order's combined magic binding ritual, etc. BUT HE ALSO CAUSED LESS DAMAGE TO AZEROTH WHEN STABBING IT THAN DEATHWING!!! AND NOW ZOVAAL IS GOING TO FUCKING HARM AZEROTH TO CLOSE TO DEATH AND PERMANENTLY FUCK OVER THE FIRST ONES' DESIGN!!!

Can you ever make an argument without going on and on about "ZOMG POWER LEVELS!!! INFINITE POEWR LEVELS!!! REALITY BREAKING 10000 OMG!!!!"

Sargeras objectively is better than the Jailer, since he was established as the main villain of the Burning Legion and orchestrator of the Burning Crusade since WC3.

Literally nobody but you cares that the Janitor can blow up stuff quicker than Sargeras or whatever Dragon Ball nonsense you're talking about.