Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Kiivar86]

No, it wasn't. I understand that not every theme appeals to every person. You saying that a Goblin theme doesn't appeal to you is a far cry from certain posters saying that they will "quit WoW forever" if a Goblin theme or the Tinker happens in an expansion. And yes, some people have actually stated that.

Gotcha, just making sure, since I was the most recent talk about the theme and not liking it.

I'm more than willing to give it a shot. Maybe this'll be the time it clicks for me. If it happens to be the theme, anyway.

[Alanar]

I can't think of something I'd want less than Goblins and Gnomes being a focus. Their shtick gets so tiresome real quick.

Haha, thing goes boom, greedy greedy, slapped together mechanic stuff, radiation and toxic waste go everywhere.

Maybe I'm just soured from Mechagon and the Mechagnomes, though. I had higher hopes than what we got.

If its a subplot in the expansion though I guess I'll deal.

Yea gnome and goblin focus is really boring as a main thing. I can see myself getting tired of them real fast.

Mechagon was a borefest for me. The small space and going back and forth the islands within 2 minutes also became boring fast.

Man.. if either will be what we can expect from the new expansion.. i am not sure if I would care.

[Marlamin]

Last encrypted cinematic of 9.2 is out and was exactly what we expected.

Pelagos binds with the empty husk we got this week and becomes the new Arbiter.

[Syegfryed]

I think far too often people think their views are shared by the development team. In other words, if you view Pandaren as jokes, then OBVIOUSLY Blizzard also views them as a joke. That was clearly never the case. Frankly, I think some players think that way about Goblins and Gnomes as well.

"I hate Gnomes and Goblins, so OBVIOUSLY Blizzard hates them too, and would NEVER make an expansion about those races!"

I think that's really a bad way to look at things.

Its pretty easy to say current blizzard would never make an expansion about gnomes and goblins, if it was the old gang and metzen, maybe. But current one is all abut proffit and "amazing and compelling storylines with awesome and serious characters blablabla" thus focusing on humans and elves. See shadowlands? is all about sylvanus and Anduin and a story that try to be too serious with the janitor.

[Raetary]

The "old gang" were the ones to establish gnomes and goblins as comic relief races in the first place...

[Revamp Man]

I think far too often people think their views are shared by the development team. In other words, if you view Pandaren as jokes, then OBVIOUSLY Blizzard also views them as a joke. That was clearly never the case. Frankly, I think some players think that way about Goblins and Gnomes as well.

"I hate Gnomes and Goblins, so OBVIOUSLY Blizzard hates them too, and would NEVER make an expansion about those races!"

I think that's really a bad way to look at things.

You do the same thing though

[Triceron]

No, it wasn't. I understand that not every theme appeals to every person. You saying that a Goblin theme doesn't appeal to you is a far cry from certain posters saying that they will "quit WoW forever" if a Goblin theme or the Tinker happens in an expansion. And yes, some people have actually stated that.

It doesn't have mass appeal.. Otherwise Tinkers would already be playable without a second thought, instead of Demon Hunters who could barely even scrape up a 2nd spec.

The Gnome/Goblin thing is hindered by the fact that they're not just low popularity, but are outright disliked. They're considered an unpopular race and constantly considered the lowest picked of all races. That doesn't really change with a new class, as we've seen Pandarens with their own Monk class still gets overshadowed by Human and Blood Elf Monk picks instead.

If they do Tinkers, then it's gonna be very likely they'll keep it fairly broad and applicable to many races like Engineering already is.

[Syegfryed]

The "old gang" were the ones to establish gnomes and goblins as comic relief races in the first place...

like pandarens, and they still made an expansion out of it anyway

[Triceron]

like pandarens, and they still made an expansion out of it anyway

Yeah but they also learned their lesson and won't repeat that 'mistake' twice.

Look at all the Pandaren lore we've gotten since MoP.

[Dracullus]

Without hard, direct data to interpret, discussion on the topic is pointless. Everyone has their own goalposts, their own definitions, their own tolerances and preferences. If the merits or issues of the game aren't self-evident to someone, nothing that a random forum user posts is going to change anyone's mind.

Sure, but if someone complain about titanforging we can discuss pros and cons. Same with AP or any system/design. But currently it's either "game is broken" or "systems bad" after devs fulfilled like 80% of wishlist from end of BfA (and in 9.1.5 wishlist from launch). And when I see same stupid argument twice or more, always turns out it's 1:1 from some Asmon stream.

[Shadochi]

Gotcha, just making sure, since I was the most recent talk about the theme and not liking it.

I'm more than willing to give it a shot. Maybe this'll be the time it clicks for me. If it happens to be the theme, anyway.

To be honest, there aren't that many huge themes like the Legion left that arent a specific theme that could on its own work to be the only main one of an expansion (note: that is already familiar to us and not something new). There are of course broad themes (Like Draenor or Shadowlands) which aren't focused around just one faction. Then finally there are the smaller themes that would get bunched together for an expansion (Old Gods + Elements + Dragons = Cata)

IMO both Dragons and G&G fall into the last category (and tbh cosmic forces should be there even if they can be broad, but SL showed us that maybe they shouldn't be the carry) where the expansion theme is made out of multiple smaller themes.

[AngerFork]

It doesn't have mass appeal.. Otherwise Tinkers would already be playable without a second thought, instead of Demon Hunters who could barely even scrape up a 2nd spec.

The Gnome/Goblin thing is hindered by the fact that they're not just low popularity, but are outright disliked. They're considered an unpopular race and constantly considered the lowest picked of all races. That doesn't really change with a new class, as we've seen Pandarens with their own Monk class still gets overshadowed by Human and Blood Elf Monk picks instead.

If they do Tinkers, then it's gonna be very likely they'll keep it fairly broad and applicable to many races like Engineering already is.

I feel like this is one of the main issues with most new class possibilities: there really isn't a specific class that a majority of players want. DKs were very often requested before they came during Wrath. DHs were requested by many players if there was a place/theme where they could fit. Monks weren't, but with the most notable class related to Pandaren being the Brewmaster, it was easy to shape that into the Monk class we have today.

Today, there just doesn't seem to be that one class that everyone can see as a perfect fit for the game. Tinkers might be the closest, but they do not seem to have the same level of excitement overall as DKs did. Necromancers & Runemasters have their fans, as do Dark Rangers & Shadow Hunters...but none of them really have the same level of fan desire that DHs seemed to at the time. Plus there's a strong amount of players who feel the game should not have a new class until the rest of the classes are fully balanced, something which IMO is more or less an impossibility.

I'd love to see Blizz surprise us with a new class. I think the game absolutely needs one & there are plenty of unique play styles that could be used, even if we don't have a runaway contender for that spot. I just don't really see one contender (aside from maybe Tinkers) that stands out strongly above the rest.

[The Stormbringer]

Last encrypted cinematic of 9.2 is out and was exactly what we expected.

Pelagos binds with the empty husk we got this week and becomes the new Arbiter.

That's actually kind of fascinating. It leads me to believe that the Eternal Ones may have initially been "living" souls that existed in the Shadowlands, and they were bound to the robot chassis and empowered that way by the First Ones, rather than being crafted wholesale as people think. Maybe that's why the Prototypes were considered failures, because the final process actually needed a "whole" soul binding to the robot? If that's the case, I kind of like the whole "Eternals are robots" thing more now, because it's less that they're robots, and more that their souls fused with robots to get a super power upgrade.

[Raetary]

That's actually kind of fascinating. It leads me to believe that the Eternal Ones may have initially been "living" souls that existed in the Shadowlands, and they were bound to the robot chassis and empowered that way by the First Ones, rather than being crafted wholesale as people think. Maybe that's why the Prototypes were considered failures, because the final process actually needed a "whole" soul binding to the robot? If that's the case, I kind of like the whole "Eternals are robots" thing more now, because it's less that they're robots, and more that their souls fused with robots to get a super power upgrade.

A soul isn't needed.
Pelagos only becomes the Arbiter because the Dreadlords fucked over the ritual and destroyed the bots powering up the Vessel.

So he gives himself up to finish it.

[Vasoka]

What happened to the idea of Yrel Light Crusade expansion with void lords resurfacing? Wasn't that a leak direction at some point?

[unbrained]

Last encrypted cinematic of 9.2 is out and was exactly what we expected.

Pelagos binds with the empty husk we got this week and becomes the new Arbiter.

wait i thought there is still one that is 7 Min. long ?

[Marlamin]

wait i thought there is still one that is 7 Min. long ?

Nope, not sure where you got that from but there's no more encrypted cinematics left currently in the files. There are a cutscene or two left though.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

I find it utterly hilarious how, during the time of Shadowlands first reveal and official "deep dive" by Blizzard and the first weeks/months of playing the game, the Arbiter not only had official art devoted to it but cinematics made for and so much story developed around it. The whole description of "a being older than time itself" and in the end... the entire expansion it was an offline robot eventually obliterated and the role of Arbiter given to a character who has had polarized reception itself.


Just makes me go


It's one of those cases in TV shows and films where a certain character is featured EVERYWHERE in promotional marketing... only for said character to appear for a total of 30 seconds in its respective medium. I never watching Game of Thrones, so I can be off with this, but didn't Sean Bean's character die in the fist episode? Yet his character is featured in a lot of promotional shit for the franchise?


The Arbiter is on a fucking loading screen, which will be present in the game for how many years going forward, while its only contribution to the expansion's story is "why Arbiter sleepin" and before we got to 9.2's campaign quests... "why Arbiter sleepin" wasn't even the most important issue anymore. Wild.

[Triceron]

To be honest, there aren't that many huge themes like the Legion left that arent a specific theme that could on its own work to be the only main one of an expansion (note: that is already familiar to us and not something new). There are of course broad themes (Like Draenor or Shadowlands) which aren't focused around just one faction. Then finally there are the smaller themes that would get bunched together for an expansion (Old Gods + Elements + Dragons = Cata)

IMO both Dragons and G&G fall into the last category (and tbh cosmic forces should be there even if they can be broad, but SL showed us that maybe they shouldn't be the carry) where the expansion theme is made out of multiple smaller themes.

To be very honest, that's how every expansion already is set up. You'd like to think that everything centers around one huge theme, because that's where all the marketting is focused on. In reality, the content has always had a wealth of subthemes within them, and are only loosely connected by one greater one.

Look at TBC, the very first expansion. Is it just about the Legion and Illidan? They're just the macguffins for the rest of the world and themes within. You've got Karazhan, the troll raid Zul'Aman, a whole space themed subsection in Netherstorm, a return of lush plains and new animals to hunt in Nagrand, a whole history of Ogres and Gronn and their fight against Black Dragons, a bunch of bird people summoning their ancient gods, an interdimensional god of Sound that devastated some other planet and stranding their people on Outland... there's so many different themes within this one expansion.

Even with Legion, I would say if you took out the Demon Invasion, the Broken Isles would have been an Old-god related expansion. You had Deathwing and Black Dragon eggs connection in Highmountain, Xavius and the Emerald Nightmare in Valsharah, Azshara and the Naga in Azsuna, and spider-like Nightborne Driders who could have fit just as easily as servants of the Old Gods (Nerubian connections?). Everything demon related in Broken Isles is pretty much just the Broken Shore, the Invasions, and the later raids involving fighting Kil'jaeden and Sargeras. All of that had very little direct connection to Broken Isles itself as an underlying demonic threat.

[unbrained]

Nope, not sure where you got that from but there's no more encrypted cinematics left currently in the files. There are a cutscene or two left though.

"There are a cutscene or two left though" so there are cutscenes left?