Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Teriz]

I know you're mainly a gnome and goblin and tech interested player overall so I would say other than the titan related pieces of various expansions, have you ever felt they were making an effort to hook you? Or has it always just been that you found something to enjoy in most things just by chance?

Sure, but they do that via new locations I've never been to before. Despite my desire for more tech in WoW, I still wanted to see Kul'tiras, Pandaria, and Northrend. I don't care about Lordaeron, I've been there, I've quested there, I don't care about that location. I'm sure I'm not alone in that feeling.

[Factcheckerr]

I have no problem with the concept of Yrel being an antagonist, but lumping the Scarlets and the Army of the Light with them makes zero sense. Also tying that to Lordaeron also makes zero sense. Yrel would want to convert the entire planet, not just Lordaeron. The Army of Light would not view the Forsaken as an enemy force, especially under the leadership of a lightbound. I would also argue that an invasion concept really doesn't work well in a game with a persistent world like WoW. Invasions tend to work better as patches, scenarios, or raids. Like what happened with the Iron Horde.

So again I have to ask, what's the point of this expansion concept?

Grounded expansion with more classic medieval aesthetic in the zones, but also with a threat level appropriate for modern WoW (aliens). Legion was elf fantasy with invading aliens, this would be human fantasy + aliens. It also features WoW's most popular races, Humans and High/Void/Blood Elves, and possibly heavily requested revamps for big zones like Quel'thalas and Gilneas. Those alone are more requested than Dragons.

To answer your point about why Yrel would be in Lordaeron: main invasion point. Same reason as how Demons had a focal point with Tomb.

[Lahis]

Isn't Xe'ra dead?

In the main universe.

Yrel is from Alternate Universe.

[The Stormbringer]

Stromgarde warfront has no lore and Kul Tiras is not Stormwind. If Gilneas got retaken nobody would consider it Human lore, its Worgen lore despite Gilneas having humans left.

Because the human race is split up distinctly with its cultures. Playable humans = Stormwind.

Gonna have to disagree. Playable humans could have come from just about anywhere with a human nation, that was the point. The backstory of player characters is left vague, allowing players to fill in the gaps. Certainly you would be right to say Stormwind was the only major human nation we had access to at the time of Vanilla WoW, but that's no longer the case. And personally, I find it annoying that "Human = Stormwind" is pushed so hard. Back in the day, humans had different flags, colors, and styles to go along with their nations! It made them interesting and unique rather than just a single cultural blob of white stone, silvery armor, and blue paint.

[Kiria]

Yeah, that's why they got half a patch dedicated to them with a megadungeon and zone. More than Belves have received since Mists, where they split that focus with Jaina in a patch about Mogu.

So... is it based on race popularity? Because Mechagon will just blow that argument up every time.

Mechagon was garbage and the average player did the mega dungeon once to get the quest done, honestly mechagon was one of the worst parts of BFA for myself and others I played with.

[therumblings]

In the main universe.

Yrel is from Alternate Universe.

I wonder if they will make other cosmic forces work like the Legion so there is only one.

[Teriz]

Grounded expansion with more classic medieval aesthetic in the zones, but also with a threat level appropriate for modern WoW (aliens). Legion was elf fantasy with invading aliens, this would be human fantasy + aliens. It also features WoW's most popular races, Humans and High/Void/Blood Elves, and possibly heavily requested revamps for big zones like Quel'thalas and Gilneas. Those alone are more requested than Dragons.

But that's a contradiction. If the goal is a more grounded expansion, an alien invasion from another dimension complete with alien tech and spaceships kind of removes that concept entirely.

Also while Humans and Elves are WoW's most popular races, the majority of players are not those races, so we're focusing on a minority of players with a very narrow storyline. That's not a good plan for an expansion that's supposed to fix a game's problems.

To answer your point about why Yrel would be in Lordaeron: main invasion point. Same reason as how Demons had a focal point with Tomb.

Yeah, but that tomb was on a new landmass, and we spent the majority of the time exploring that new landmass and working with the new denizens that we encountered there. Retreading through Lordaeron simply doesn't have that level of appeal.

[Factcheckerr]

Gonna have to disagree. Playable humans could have come from just about anywhere with a human nation, that was the point. The backstory of player characters is left vague, allowing players to fill in the gaps. Certainly you would be right to say Stormwind was the only major human nation we had access to at the time of Vanilla WoW, but that's no longer the case. And personally, I find it annoying that "Human = Stormwind" is pushed so hard. Back in the day, humans had different flags, colors, and styles to go along with their nations! It made them interesting and unique rather than just a single cultural blob of white stone, silvery armor, and blue paint.

I agree that the nations made old humans interesting, but the playable humans as of both Vanilla and Cata come directly from Stormwind even if they originate from elsewhere (considering they trained in the Monastery). For a while now the kingdoms have been being split into distinct looking entities: regular Human = Stormwind, Forsaken = Lordaeron, Worgen = Gilneas, Half-Drust = Kul Tiran (though I expect they will add regular human model soon).

[Raetary]

I wonder if they will make other cosmic forces work like the Legion so there is only one.

Well, there already is only a single Shadowlands.

[Factcheckerr]

But that's a contradiction. If the goal is a more grounded expansion, an alien invasion from another dimension kind of removes that concept entirely.

Demons and elementals are main enemies in Vanilla.

[therumblings]

Well, there already is only a single Shadowlands.

I'm expecting them all to be just one for all timelines, it wouldn't make sense to exclude the Light while they keep doing it for all the others.

[Teriz]

In the main universe.

Yrel is from Alternate Universe.

Gotcha. That makes more sense.

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Demons and elementals are main enemies in Vanilla.

Yrel and the Lightbound are not demons and elementals though. They're literally aliens from another world.

[Factcheckerr]

Yrel and the Lightbound are not demons and elementals though. They're literally aliens from another world.

Demons are quite literally aliens from multiple worlds... just from worlds in another dimension.

[draugril]

Sure, but they do that via new locations I've never been to before. Despite my desire for more tech in WoW, I still wanted to see Kul'tiras, Pandaria, and Northrend. I don't care about Lordaeron, I've been there, I've quested there, I don't care about that location. I'm sure I'm not alone in that feeling.

I'm sure you're not alone. But there are also others who feel the inverse. Those places that we've been? Where we've quested? Where we're invested? Those are the places I care about. Those are the places I want to revisit and watch evolve. I don't care about the Shadowlands or Pandaria or Gingledoof - the proper-noun-du-jour just doesn't interest me. I might as well be playing a different game entirely if we throw out virtually the entire setting every two years.

[Teriz]

Demons are quite literally aliens from multiple worlds... just from worlds in another dimension.

If you want to get literal in extremely pedantic terms, sure. However, there's a difference between an army of demons getting pulled into Azeroth by a crazed Warlock, and a bunch of blue people invading Azeroth in literal spaceships.

[Factcheckerr]

Also arguing in the Lights Judgement thread (doubt it's real, but we will get something similar) made me realize: there must be a specific reason that the deluxe edition only has the Green Dragonflight and not a "choose your own flight" mount.

The end of Shadowlands makes Lifelands unlikely as do dev comments. Could it be because there's an anti-Cataclysm theme with rebirth instead of destruction?

[draugril]

Also arguing in the Lights Judgement thread (doubt it's real, but we will get something similar) made me realize: there must be a specific reason that the deluxe edition only has the Green Dragonflight and not a "choose your own flight" mount.

I recall the idea being thrown around that the new artifact/azerite/covenant system would be developing your own dragon companion/mount to your preference. I still think that's a great idea.

[Teriz]

I'm sure you're not alone. But there are also others who feel the inverse. Those places that we've been? Where we've quested? Where we're invested? Those are the places I care about. Those are the places I want to revisit and watch evolve. I don't care about the Shadowlands or Pandaria or Gingledoof - the proper-noun-du-jour just doesn't interest me. I might as well be playing a different game entirely if we throw out virtually the entire setting every two years.

As I said, I have no problem with the old world getting some updates. I just don't believe it should be THE expansion feature of the next expansion, since updating a few old zones would be a laughable expansion feature. I'm not really worried that it is either, since they wouldn't telegraph this on that level in 9.2.5.

[Lahis]

Gonna have to disagree. Playable humans could have come from just about anywhere with a human nation, that was the point. The backstory of player characters is left vague, allowing players to fill in the gaps. Certainly you would be right to say Stormwind was the only major human nation we had access to at the time of Vanilla WoW, but that's no longer the case. And personally, I find it annoying that "Human = Stormwind" is pushed so hard. Back in the day, humans had different flags, colors, and styles to go along with their nations! It made them interesting and unique rather than just a single cultural blob of white stone, silvery armor, and blue paint.

Single cultural blob per race makes it easier to write based on stereotypes.

[Shadochi]

Well glad to see that at least Sylvanas' judgement seems appropriate

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I am once again hopeful for more race identity with the addition of new race items for Dark Iron Dwarves and Blood Elves