Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Vakir]

Datamining really does hurt the experience. It's still possible and out there with 14 but it's only possible the day of the patch and is generally frowned upon by the community. 14, however, still has the advantage of being story focused and letting their story breathe more. I wouldn't be surprised if an expansion clocks in with a word count multiple thousands of times than WoW's. Even if it really needs an editor. Early Sharlayan was painful. To say nothing of post-launch ARR.

I don't think it'll fix EVERYTHING - Zovaal is bad with or without context and we got his cinematic at the time we were meant to, Sylvanas still ends up missing context and making little sense and requires the book - but I'll third that Pelagos' step to Arbiter was at least marginally better in context.

His voice acting though. Woof. They're all kinda stilted so I'm wondering if it's misguided voice direction for the Kyrian in general.

Don't know if i missed it and it has been discussed already. But is anyone else disappointed in the mythic only jailer phase?
After N'zoth didn't have one and argus was very light on lore implications i had hopes for something like archimonde or mar'gok but its basically just 20% health added.

One last creative missed opportunity and disappointment from our bald one is fitting.

[ercarp]

Don't know if i missed it and it has been discussed already. But is anyone else disappointed in the mythic only jailer phase?
After N'zoth didn't have one and argus was very light on lore implications i had hopes for something like archimonde or mar'gok but its basically just 20% health added.

Low-effort design for a low-effort expansion. The fewer good things SL has going for it, the better, as that will make it so much easier to sweep it under the carpet and forget about it entirely.

[Ielenia]

Getting a handful of story, and then a 6 month cliff hanger is unacceptable, and a horrible way to tell the complex narrative Blizzard tries to pull off. It will never land well unless they can plan it out perfectly, which is impossible with how their deadlines / patch-shuffling / changes in schedule work.

Cliffhangers work because they keep people interested. It get them thinking what this cliffhanger might mean for the next expansion. It's no different than an "after credits scene" in movies, like when we saw glimpses of Thanos at the end of the Avengers movie, or when we saw Nick Fury show up and tell Tony Stark he was creating the Avengers initiative.

And the story of Shadowlands is pretty much self-contained. Its overarching story started at the beginning of the expansion, and ended at the last patch of the expansion. The cliffhangers, about the undead invasion of the blood elf lands and all that are the "after credits scenes" if we are comparing this to movies.

[Catastrophy349]

Unfortunately, I can neither confirm nor deny that I don’t know what the next expansion is nor isn’t based on what I don’t know is true.

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Who’s excited for the Epilogue: Judgement Chapter coming on Tuesday?!

[PhillyCheese]

I am going to start hedging my bets on Cata 2. The stuff in 9.2.5 is jumbled and even though it right now only looks like EK, we’ve seen a Teldrassil map change, so it may be a misdirect.

If they add a new questline for Nelves we will have our two “retake the zones” quests like Cata, we have an Emerald Drake deluxe mount which is almost the OPPOSITE of Deathwing (growth and rebirth over destruction), and there seems to be no direct plot connection between this expansion and 10.0 besides “Sylvanas didn’t come back”. Similar as to how the world got a breather inbetween Arthas and Deathwing so racial stories could move forward.

So I think smart money is on some kind of revamp. We still don’t know where all the HD human buildings will be.

[Polybius]

Afterall, the Bananas do seem to have a perculiar society:
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Dam..._Page_(Day_87)



https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Dam...Page_(Day_512)

Banana old god confirmed.

(I miss speculating on these breadcrumbs)

[Teriz]

I am going to start hedging my bets on Cata 2. The stuff in 9.2.5 is jumbled and even though it right now only looks like EK, we’ve seen a Teldrassil map change, so it may be a misdirect.

If they add a new questline for Nelves we will have our two “retake the zones” quests like Cata, we have an Emerald Drake deluxe mount which is almost the OPPOSITE of Deathwing (growth and rebirth over destruction), and there seems to be no direct plot connection between this expansion and 10.0 besides “Sylvanas didn’t come back”.

So I think smart money is on some kind of revamp. We still don’t know where all the HD human buildings will be.

Cataclysm 2.0 is interesting, because the original Cataclysm also introduced the Goblins and Worgens along with Dragons. That makes an expansion with Undermine, Dragon Isles, and revamped areas like Gilneas, Gadgetzan, and other locations a distinct possibility.

[Lady Atia]

Don't know if i missed it and it has been discussed already. But is anyone else disappointed in the mythic only jailer phase?
After N'zoth didn't have one and argus was very light on lore implications i had hopes for something like archimonde or mar'gok but its basically just 20% health added.

N'Zoth did have the Chamber of the Heart phase. Also they did say they never wanted to do something like Ragnaros, Archimonde or mar'gok again because you shouldn't have to play Mythic to see the full lore of an encounter, and honestly that's a good decision.

[PhillyCheese]

Cataclysm 2.0 is interesting, because the original Cataclysm also introduced the Goblins and Worgens along with Dragons. That makes an expansion with Undermine, Dragon Isles, and revamped areas like Gilneas, Gadgetzan, and other locations a distinct possibility.

Tinkers do have some connections to Dragons and Cata, though I think it’s more likely it would be because technology would advance in updated zones. And also the bronze being the best important flight which is near Tanaris.

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N'Zoth did have the Chamber of the Heart phase. Also they did say they never wanted to do something like Ragnaros, Archimonde or mar'gok again because you shouldn't have to play Mythic to see the full lore of an encounter, and honestly that's a good decision.

The chamber didn’t really add lore though, same as how Jailer making an azerite shield doesn’t have big implications.

[Lady Atia]

Cliffhangers work because they keep people interested. It get them thinking what this cliffhanger might mean for the next expansion. It's no different than an "after credits scene" in movies, like when we saw glimpses of Thanos at the end of the Avengers movie, or when we saw Nick Fury show up and tell Tony Stark he was creating the Avengers initiative.

And the story of Shadowlands is pretty much self-contained. Its overarching story started at the beginning of the expansion, and ended at the last patch of the expansion. The cliffhangers, about the undead invasion of the blood elf lands and all that are the "after credits scenes" if we are comparing this to movies.

Of course cliffhangers work, but only if you have an actual ending to a story/chapter/movie before that. Sadly Shadowlands feels like it skipped the actualy ending of it's chapters and straight went into the post credit scenes.

[Teriz]

Tinkers do have some connections to Dragons and Cata, though I think it’s more likely it would be because technology would advance in updated zones. And also the bronze being the best important flight which is near Tanaris.

Well to add to that, this was the second mechanical dragon released after BFA;

https://www.wowhead.com/item=186556/...cal-dragonling

"Dragons come in all types of temporal classification -- timeless, time-lost, and even infinite."

Sold by Historian Maldi in the Caverns of Time.

What else is in Tanaris?



If Blizzard decides to go that route of course. Why wouldn't they? If we're talking world revamp, locations like Gadgetzan should be revamped to reflect what has occurred since the Cataclsym. Further, Goblins AND Worgens should be able to come home to both Kezan and Gilneas. It really makes perfect sense.

[PhillyCheese]

Ghostlands thing isn’t a teaser, it’s simply a racial quest that happens to give the race a post BFA update.

It’s news to US because nobody thought we’d be in Azeroth until next year.

An actual teaser in that quest would be Liadrin’s kid, as like Taelias introduction she has pretty interesting implications.

[Polybius]

Ghostlands thing isn’t a teaser, it’s simply a racial quest that happens to give the race a post BFA update.

It’s news to US because nobody thought we’d be in Azeroth until next year.

An actual teaser in that quest would be Liadrin’s kid, as like Taelias introduction she has pretty interesting implications.

Looks like we may get a proper epilogue this time. The last chapter of the campaign releases next week and we've got 9.2.5 bits on Azeroth.

[Ielenia]

Of course cliffhangers work, but only if you have an actual ending to a story/chapter/movie before that. Sadly Shadowlands feels like it skipped the actualy ending of it's chapters and straight went into the post credit scenes.

Not really? We brought the covenants back to working order, we stopped the Jailer and his plans, fixed the 'machine of death' with a new arbiter, and Sylvanas is now finally gone.

Feels like a tight conclusion to me.

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Well to add to that, this was the second mechanical dragon released after BFA;

https://www.wowhead.com/item=186556/...cal-dragonling

Which, I will remind you, is non-canon since it comes from an in-game event that celebrates the anniversary of the game.

[Osmeric]

I saw a youtube clip of Bellular talking about a 4chan leak that was posted on the official forums, it mentions 'paradox' being the internal codename for 10.0 (apparently we'll find out why when its announced) & I recall on the Timeless Isles back in Mists seeing the timewalkers and thinking they'd make a good class, they've even have a faction standing (I believe everyone is 'neutral' with them) so, while I don't know about the validity of any leaks, well, it would certainly come out of left-field. Personally I'd like to see a new class, whatever it is, & I wanna start at 1, so I can do the new starting experience and level through northrend again.

The leak seems to be gone now (is that how 4chan works?) but one interesting part of it was the claim that at 9.2 WoW was down to 400K active accounts, and only 20K came back for the patch, the lowest in WoW history (even 6.1 did better.)

Was the leak true? We'll find out about some of it later.

[Lady Atia]

Not really? We brought the covenants back to working order, we stopped the Jailer and his plans, fixed the 'machine of death' with a new arbiter, and Sylvanas is now sadly gone.

Feels like a tight conclusion to me.

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Which, I will remind you, is non-canon since it comes from an in-game event that celebrates the anniversary of the game.

9.2 has that, that's true. But not 9.0/9.1.

[Teriz]

Which, I will remind you, is non-canon since it comes from an in-game event that celebrates the anniversary of the game.

Hints of future content don't need to be canon.

[Khaza-R]

I am going to start hedging my bets on Cata 2. The stuff in 9.2.5 is jumbled and even though it right now only looks like EK, we’ve seen a Teldrassil map change, so it may be a misdirect.

If they add a new questline for Nelves we will have our two “retake the zones” quests like Cata, we have an Emerald Drake deluxe mount which is almost the OPPOSITE of Deathwing (growth and rebirth over destruction), and there seems to be no direct plot connection between this expansion and 10.0 besides “Sylvanas didn’t come back”. Similar as to how the world got a breather inbetween Arthas and Deathwing so racial stories could move forward.

So I think smart money is on some kind of revamp. We still don’t know where all the HD human buildings will be.

With WorldTree2 and Lordaeron being encrypted, I think at the very least we will see a new NE and Undead capital.

A full revamp would be wonderful but I am not expecting it. At this point I would be content with just a few zones being redone like Arathi and Darkshore.

[Ersula]

The original 9 WoW classes, yes. The expansion classes are a completely different can of worms, as I described earlier. One huge difference is that expansion classes have to match the setting and story of the expansion they're being released in. So in the case of Bards, you're going to need an expansion where a Bard takes center stage, and the expansion relates to Bards.

1.) That's not absolutely necessary.
2.) Which is good for you because they 100% absolutely aren't making a Tinker-themed expansion
3.) I don't think Hero classes are going to be a thing anymore because they've effectively taken away everything about them they can. They no longer start at a boosted level (compared to allied races) and there are no longer requirements to make them.

This conversation has illustrated how frustrating making a new class would be so I'd bet on just getting new specs. I imagine Tinker could be a Rogue tank spec.

Or hey, I'd love it if they gave the crafting professions an associated combat spec. Elective specs could be 10.0's equivalent to covenants. The BFA Tailoring questline involved weaving Time Magic. Alchemist was already a Warcraft 3 hero class. Etc.

[Vakir]

I am going to start hedging my bets on Cata 2. The stuff in 9.2.5 is jumbled and even though it right now only looks like EK, we’ve seen a Teldrassil map change, so it may be a misdirect.

What Teldrassil map change? Hadn't seen that.

Edit: Ersula and Teriz debating - hide your kids and wife. We are witnessing the unstoppable force meeting the immovable object.

If we get Varodoc in, the sheer force may give us Dragonsworn and Tinkers in Cata2 with 8 new allied races and playable dragons. And somehow, finally, ogres.