Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Ersula]

Cosmic themes can be included... just like they were in literally every expansion.

People are just fearmongering that we are going to get Shadowlands 2 3 4 and 5 and never go back to Azeroth because le epic trolling and ragecrafting from people who no longer believe Blizz can make something they want. While ignoring the multitude of dev comments saying they are going for something "grounded" (already sick of the word) as well as stuff like HD human houses that very likely are not part of the Garden of Life.

Yes and no. They specifically say they alternate between analog & cosmic expansions, but those qualifiers refer to the "vibe" of the expansion. MoP is considered cosmic because its focused on spirituality & emotions. WoD is considered analog & not cosmic because while it takes place on another planet, its focus was on classic RPG, and more or less classic Warcraft motifs of survival, wildlife & building settlements. Etc.

That's why I think a possible "analog" theme for 10.0 could be classic tabletop gaming in general. Dragons & Dungeons - DnD's popularity has exploded lately & they've marketed a theme like that before with Kobolds & Katacombs in Hearthstone:

Light & Void plot but it won't be evident at the start of the expansion. And not Light vs. Void, but Light & Void team up to take over Azeroth, using Turalyon & Alleria as their avatars. But they sell the expansion as an old-school RPG set up:
*Classic Tabletop inspired content. Dragon Hordes, Kobold Caves, Etc.
*Modular make-your-own dungeon feature. Players make their own non-canon D&D inspired instances, like in EQ2 or Neverwinter. Under the guise of players sitting at a tabletop game within WoW, like the homage in Boralus.
*New Bard Class

[PhillyCheese]

You might be right, but you are way more focused on what would make sense, rather than what Blizzard would do.
Most people were already sick of all the damned orc focus after Siege of Orgrimmar. The end result was Warlords of Draenor. People were begging to be rid of Sylvanas halfway into BfA...and it was followed by Shadowlands. They don't know when to stop, and also make illogical choices regarding what is expansion sized and what is patch sized.

Ehh who knows, maybe I'm just salty. I mean I shouldn't be, WoW will not ruin my fun. But still I just don't think a footnote of a location featuring the most overrated fantasy race is enough to mend all the damage of the past four years.

Sylvanas stuff lead to Shadowlands. Siege lead to orcs. Blizz will not change expansion plans extensively due to fan feedback: note how SL ending leads to absolutely nothing, meaning the plot is now a clean slate/they are free to follow up on the NON-Sylvanas stuff from BFA which was heavily about rebooting the status quo of Alliance and Horde.

If it was Lifelands we would have much more Elunewank this patch instead of Tyrande appearing in a single cutscene that isn't even a fancy one.

[Syegfryed]

You might be right, but you are way more focused on what would make sense, rather than what Blizzard would do.
Most people were already sick of all the damned orc focus after Siege of Orgrimmar. The end result was Warlords of Draenor. People were begging to be rid of Sylvanas halfway into BfA...and it was followed by Shadowlands. They don't know when to stop, and also make illogical choices regarding what is expansion sized and what is patch sized.

Blizzard would go for the easy route, we already peaky inside danuser's mind and the current writers, they are not as bright as they think they are, they can't make a twist like MOP out of an april's fool joke.

WoD was going to be a fine expansion if it was not by cut content, the expansion didn't just had orcs with all the draenor stuff. And yes sylvanus being a key character is danuser fault and we all knew about the redemption, i and others "theorized" the end of this shitshow in 9.0 already.

Putting all dots together and knowing how work there, the safe bet is dragon stuff.

Ehh who knows, maybe I'm just salty. I mean I shouldn't be, WoW will not ruin my fun. But still I just don't think a footnote of a location featuring the most overrated fantasy race is enough to mend all the damage of the past four years

Ah, for sure nothing will mend this game, unless they fire a lot of people and completely change the way they amke things.

[Ersula]

Sylvanas stuff lead to Shadowlands. Siege lead to orcs. Blizz will not change expansion plans extensively due to fan feedback: note how SL ending leads to absolutely nothing, meaning the plot is now a clean slate/they are free to follow up on the NON-Sylvanas stuff from BFA which was heavily about rebooting the status quo of Alliance and Horde.

I think you're confusing "Foreshadowing" & "Continuing a story thread." Clearly Shadowlands was a continuation of BFA's story but nothing in it directly foreshadowed the Shadowlands. The Shadowlands teaser was pretty shocking & everyone saying Sylvanas was going to be the next lich king was something people were saying since Wrath & the teaser was a direct subversion of that.

[Varx]

So to change the topic away from the assured chance of Tinkers, something that I would love added would be a multi class system.

Ive been playing a paladin since TBC and never mained anything else. I don't have the time to play alts and only ever leveled an alt to max once in MoP.

How nice would it be to have a multi class system where you're able to pick an additional class. You'd be able to switch between classes using the class trainers, giving them purpose again.

It'd be completely a volunteer system and gives you no player power.

[PhillyCheese]

I think you're confusing "Foreshadowing" & "Continuing a story thread." Clearly Shadowlands was a continuation of BFA's story but nothing in it directly foreshadowed the Shadowlands. The Shadowlands teaser was pretty shocking & everyone saying Sylvanas was going to be the next lich king was something people were saying since Wrath & the teaser was a direct subversion of that.

What are you talking about? The end of BFA was famously referred to on here as "Death and Dragons" because Dragons and Death were both being foreshadowed through the expansion. Drustvar and Thros, Nazmir, Naz'jatar's ghosts, the focus on Bwonsamdi in Battle for Dazar'alor, Vol'jin's plot, Sylvanas being confirmed to have a power boost for some magical reason... many many people expected a death expansion, though they didn't think it would be the Shadowlands themselves considering they had virtually no lore at the time.

[Polybius]

I think you're confusing "Foreshadowing" & "Continuing a story thread." Clearly Shadowlands was a continuation of BFA's story but nothing in it directly foreshadowed the Shadowlands. The Shadowlands teaser was pretty shocking & everyone saying Sylvanas was going to be the next lich king was something people were saying since Wrath & the teaser was a direct subversion of that.

… Drustvar, Isle Expeditions, Helya, the ‘veil’ that would be pierced? The new animations from the necro totems?

[Ersula]

… Drustvar, Isle Expeditions, Helya, the ‘veil’ that would be pierced? The new animations from the necro totems?

You describing BFA or Legion? Or Wrath? Hey, Cata included a lot of Dragons & a Scholomance dungeon revamp: That must have been intentional foreshadowing for 6 expansions later. /s

What are you talking about? The end of BFA was famously referred to on here as "Death and Dragons" because Dragons and Death were both being foreshadowed through the expansion. Drustvar and Thros, Nazmir, Naz'jatar's ghosts, the focus on Bwonsamdi in Battle for Dazar'alor, Vol'jin's plot, Sylvanas being confirmed to have a power boost for some magical reason... many many people expected a death expansion, though they didn't think it would be the Shadowlands themselves considering they had virtually no lore at the time.

There's 2 dragons in Shadowlands. And Death is a big theme in every expansion. And every expansion includes Dragons. If that's your requirement for foreshadowing, everything is foreshadowing even if it wasn't intentional. The Drust & Dragons were also in Legion. By this logic anything foreshadowed could just as easily be themes in 11.0, making it totally irrelevant to this conversation.

Unless you're saying a reference two expansions in a row is something that's absolutely going to happen. Because that means we're getting Bards & I'm totally on board.

[Polybius]

There's 2 dragons in BFA. And Death is a big theme in every expansion. And every expansion includes Dragons. If that's your requirement for foreshadowing, everything is foreshadowing even if it wasn't intentional. The Drust & Dragons were also in Legion. By this logic anything foreshadowed could just as easily be themes in 11.0, making it totally irrelevant to this conversation.

You said it wasn’t foreshadowing and now it is. Those mentions are simply references, it’s written there for worldbuilding. When the hints, assets, and story set ups stack up it’s foreshadowing. There’s a pretty good reason folks are mentioning Scarlet Crusade for 11.0, it’s being set up but unlikely to be the focus of 10.0.

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You describing BFA or Legion? Or Wrath? Hey, Cata included a lot of Dragons & a Scholomance dungeon revamp: That must have been intentional foreshadowing for 6 expansions later. /s
There's 2 dragons in Shadowlands. And Death is a big theme in every expansion. And every expansion includes Dragons. If that's your requirement for foreshadowing, everything is foreshadowing even if it wasn't intentional. The Drust & Dragons were also in Legion. By this logic anything foreshadowed could just as easily be themes in 11.0, making it totally irrelevant to this conversation.

Nevermind, not worth. You don’t pay attention to the nuance.

It’s Wrath of the Bolvar obviously.

[Ersula]

You said it wasn’t foreshadowing and now it is. Those mentions are simply references, it’s written there for worldbuilding. When the hints, assets, and story set ups stack up it’s foreshadowing. There’s a pretty good reason folks are mentioning Scarlet Crusade for 11.0, it’s being set up but unlikely to be the focus of 10.0.

What's your criteria here? What exactly is the difference? The Scarlet Crusade reformation storyline in the Priest Order hall in Legion is a reference; The Scarlet Brotherhood storyline in BFA is a reference; but a SHEILD is foreshadowing?

[Catastrophy349]

I can’t help but to hear the song Hurt by Johnny Cash being played during an episode of Rick and Morty as I read through these forum posts. What is wrong with everyone? We’re literally attacking each other over a VIDEO GAME?! Speculation is fun, it shouldn’t be toxic and degrading towards others.

[Alanar]

shadowlands allied race is pre-patch material, if they don't have any bullets to sell the next expansion(like no new races or new class)



taunka and not tuskar

gilgoblins for horde and mogu for alliance from bfa

jinuy and andkoan is basically the same shit don't need to waste a slot for it

I would pass on gilgoblins, goblins are already niche and we also already had vulpera, another reskin on a not very popular model while alliance get mogu, wouldnt be good. No one cares about goblins with fins.Taunka and gil goblins are either goblin and tauren cosmetic options or not at all imo.

Besides, Tuskar is a much popular choice and feels more unique, I would say Vrykul and Tuskar wotlk option.

Jinju and ankoan could be brought together as single option
Change some idle animations and some animations and your golden. Seen alot of request for these as well.

[Raetary]

I'd sell my left kidney to play a Botani.

[Ersula]

Taunka and gil goblins are either goblin and tauren cosmetic options or not at all.

I would agree but the idea that they would revamp character customization but NOT include these tells me they're keeping their options open. The Wildhammer customization & High Elf customization options were nails in that allied race coffin.

[PhillyCheese]

What's your criteria here? What exactly is the difference? The Scarlet Crusade reformation storyline in the Priest Order hall in Legion is a reference; The Scarlet Brotherhood storyline in BFA is a reference; but a SHEILD is foreshadowing?

A currently unused shield is more of a hint towards future content than anything, considering it is utterly pointless to exist otherwise.

We will be seeing NPCs using Lordaeron and Scarlet Crusade shields in the future or it was cut content, one or the other. And 9.2.5 finally featuring Scarlets (if the dark ranger quest is in) and Calia being in Lordaeron mean that will likely happen.

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I would agree but the idea that they would revamp character customization but NOT include these tells me they're keeping their options open. The Wildhammer customization & High Elf customization options were nails in that allied race coffin.

No matter how much fans tried to spin it, Wildhammer/Helf didn't have enough culture and unique identity to count as a new race with new racials, drastically different appearance, etc. Especially when one is identified by tattoos and the other by a single shade of skin color. The closest thing is Mag'har which come with a multiple unique aesthetics and cultures.

Gilgoblins and Taunka can't blend in as a normal goblin/tauren and have very distinct cultural identities.

[Polybius]

Also, seeing the Emerald Drake as a "lol Elune/Lifelands" thing is missing the point I think. Emerald Drakes are heavily tied to Vanilla/Classic and their themes are way more broad than "Elune". Could be a green drake included because they are the closest thing to Anti-Cataclysm (rebirth/healing) which is what the theme of 10.0 may be.

Can see that happening, fertility and nurture. We know the Black dragonflight is near extinct. I’m hoping for Elune to be more supplemental than in-your-face with cosmic influence.

Sapphire skyblazer makes me think the DI could be in the skies, symbolically close to the sun and moon.

[Syegfryed]

I would pass on gilgoblins, goblins are already niche and we also already had vulpera, another reskin on a not very popular model while alliance get mogu, wouldnt be good. No one cares about goblins with fins.Taunka and gil goblins are either goblin and tauren cosmetic options or not at all imo.

Besides, Tuskar is a much popular choice and feels more unique, I would say Vrykul and Tuskar wotlk option.

Jinju and ankoan could be brought together as single option
Change some idle animations and some animations and your golden. Seen alot of request for these as well.

giglgoblins are fine, just like mechagnomes, we can afford one niche race here and there. if highmountain tauren is allied race, taunka will not be a costmetic, gilgoblins are completely different either and would a entire new set of racials based around being able to breath underwater.

Tuskar is a nonsense race to be add, they are not humanoid enough, this already kill their chances, like the turtle people

[Alanar]

I would agree but the idea that they would revamp character customization but NOT include these tells me they're keeping their options open. The Wildhammer customization & High Elf customization options were nails in that allied race coffin.

Its kinda weird as some other options such as mag har orcs and lightforged dreanei are in the same position.

For trolls they also made sandtrolls as a cosmetic option as well. Gil goblins and taunka just fit right in that street.

So hopefully the next batch of playable races would feel slightly more unique such as zandalari.

[Fahrad Wagner]

It's not even copium, just people unable to acknowledge history is in the past and bringing up the same topics over and over.

I'm pretty sure half the posts from the last few pages are straight up trolling, trying to get a last word in or baiting people that tend to be endlessly baitable. Thread has really gone to shit with this useless and very hostile back and forth, not a lot of speculation/discussion about future things being done with people only focusing on what already happened in the past.

I went through some of the older hype threads and the interesting post compared to arguing ratio was much better. Remember, it's perfectly fine not to post anything that doesn't actually add to the discussion. Get it together, hype thread.

You've summed up in a few sentences the reason why I'm not participating in the thread as much as I used to anymore.

A post that doesn't get a lot of traction doesn't make it a bad/worthless post. If anything it actually adds something vs. the useless back and forth (which isn't speculation at all regardless of what some try to frame it as; it's arguing).

--

Meanwhile, Blizzard has put the last patch of the expansion on the PTR with a lot of new hints/unexplained things that are actually deserving of speculation/analysis.

What's happening in Tirisfal? Why is Calia involved? There's a LOT of VO and things encrypted there.

Is the way between SL <-> Azeroth canonically wide open now? Khadgar popped up as well as a (now removed) quest where we give a tour of Stormwind to creatures from the Shadowlands.

Why is there another encrypted Anduin model?

What's the encrypted item set for?

Why are there still two encrypted achievements from 9.2? Are those for next reset's content?

I can go on, but hopefully it's some food for thought that looks towards the future instead of the past.

The more I look at it, the more I think we are in for a Lordaeron/Northern EK expansion. I'd be excited for it tbh! And I think that Lordaeron shield dropping from Mal'Ganis is more than an Easter Egg, it's this expansion's Suramar Cloak / Zandalari Shaman / Naga Hunter sets.

I'd sell my left kidney to play a Botani.

God I'd love that. They could really go crazy with the customisations and bring some fresh interesting lore! I wish they'd revisit previous expansions for new AR with some patches. Like, giving us Taunka and Ice Dwarves, Tuskarrs, Furbolgs, Tortollans, Hozen and Jinyu... so many cool races which deserve to be playable!

[Alanar]

giglgoblins are fine, just like mechagnomes, we can afford one niche race here and there. if highmountain tauren is allied race, taunka will not be a costmetic, gilgoblins are completely different either and would a entire new set of racials based around being able to breath underwater.

Tuskar is a nonsense race to be add, they are not humanoid enough, this already kill their chances, like the turtle people

We already have mechagnomes, gnomes, goblins and vulpera as these niche races. Gil goblins are fine when they would be part of excisting goblins race. Make it a short recruitement quest and be done with it. An actual slot when they are just greener with fins is a wasted slot.

I already explained why, lf and hm are lazy options and should not be repeated again. So no thank you, its boring.

Tuskar is perfectly fine and much better option and more diverse then another flavor of goblins.. which are not even popular.