Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Syegfryed]

Actually we have tons of lose ends. Which is why the whole end 20 years of story just stinks. Azshara is running amok somewhere. The Nathrezim store the sword we have Deanathrius in and we don't know how that went. We have yet to see what Nathanos has been up to since he arrived in the Shadowlands. Xal'atath fucked up somewhere to do gods know what.

yeah i just mentioned azshara and cosmic bullshit in my list, so it all ends confirming my point on we don't have much loose ends big enough to make an entire expansions out of it

Nathanos is in the maw and sylvanus will be searching for him until 13.0 or something.

The biggest hint is the datamined emerald drake. And yes, that could point towards dragons. Buuut it could also point towards to the Emerald Dragons and by extension Elune. She's been getting more and more involved since....well, Legion, really. And it does make you think that 9.2.5 has Tirisfall restored, but nothing yet, for Darnassus. The future of the Night Elves might be something that will be explored in 10.0. Aaaand also since she IS a former Night Elf, two birds could be killed with one stone and have Azshara show up in the Elune pack.

We have more hints towards dragons than that, just saying.

Yes, it could be elune and more elf bullshit, but this doesn't have enough juice to fill up an expansion, more likely this would be explored in a sidequest about the green dragonflight in the dragon expansion.

An emerald dream expansion is possible, with elune for sure, but just after shadowlands? i doubt it. it would need one or two expansions before going for another plane/dimension like that.

[therumblings]

I know this is a pretty unpopular opinion but I actually have no problem with the Shadowlands doorway remaining open. It's a fairly unique (I can't think of another serious fantasy setting) idea that the afterlife and reality are connected in such a way and it actually makes perfect sense: we saved one death god (Primus) and helped instate another (Pelagos) who we are canonically acquaintances/friends with (leveling and ZM campaign). We also saved the cycle of life and death in Ardenweald though that is more on Tyrande.

Azeroth mortals are responsible for a serious restructuring of the afterlife, it would honestly be shitty writing if we were booted out entirely and never heard from them again JUST because people on the forums don't like the expansion lore. Blizzard can do some really cool stuff with the SL races appearing sparingly over time, especially if the Scourge continues to be a threat which looks to be the case (as they may be the only ones who can help us eradicate them).

I hope the removed quest was removed because its spoilers and not because Blizz walked back on any ideas to continue the lore of Shadowlands due to SL being unpopular.

They should keep it open, but probably gatekeep it heavily who is allowed in.

[PhillyCheese]

Also, seeing the Emerald Drake as a "lol Elune/Lifelands" thing is missing the point I think. Emerald Drakes are heavily tied to Vanilla/Classic and their themes are way more broad than "Elune". Could be a green drake included because they are the closest thing to Anti-Cataclysm (rebirth/healing) which is what the theme of 10.0 may be.

[therumblings]

Also, seeing the Emerald Drake as a "lol Elune/Lifelands" thing is missing the point I think. Emerald Drakes are heavily tied to Vanilla/Classic and their themes are way more broad than "Elune". Could be a green drake included because they are the closest thing to Anti-Cataclysm (rebirth/healing) which is what the theme of 10.0 may be.

Agreed. I don't think 10.0 will be cosmic like an Elune expansion.

[PhillyCheese]

Agreed. I don't think 10.0 will be cosmic like an Elune expansion.

Cosmic themes can be included... just like they were in literally every expansion.

People are just fearmongering that we are going to get Shadowlands 2 3 4 and 5 and never go back to Azeroth because le epic trolling and ragecrafting from people who no longer believe Blizz can make something they want. While ignoring the multitude of dev comments saying they are going for something "grounded" (already sick of the word) as well as stuff like HD human houses that very likely are not part of the Garden of Life.

[Wangming]

I am still absolutely convinced that next expansion will be Cataclysm 2.0, but based on rebuilding and change. Along with a full world revamp, new zones on top such as Dragon Isles, Undermine, Tel'Abim etc. A new class, that being one of the three: Tinker, Bard, Dragonknight and new races/allied races.

I like your enthusiasm, but this might be too much to expect. Unless of course they scrap a raid tier again. I can only provide screenshots of screenshots to the post where I compared how much content each expansion shipped with, but what you are suggesting is basically all the features of Cataclysm and all the features of MoP all in one.

[PhillyCheese]

I like your enthusiasm, but this might be too much to expect. Unless of course they scrap a raid tier again. I can only provide screenshots of screenshots to the post where I compared how much content each expansion shipped with, but what you are suggesting is basically all the features of Cataclysm and all the features of MoP all in one.

Cata failed because the revamp was done in a single development cycle. Meanwhile Cata 2 would do much better because not only have they updated models/zones during WoD, Legion, BFA and SL, but they also planned/changed a shorter expansion before 10.0 so they have even MORE dev time for 10.0. Last time this happened was the biggest feature-laden expansion (Legion).

Also very likely that Cata 2 would not have the extensive, dev-time-wasting geography changes of Cata because there won't be a dragon fucking things up.

Stuff like the Tirisfal thing, HD human houses, Azeroth racial plot continuations in 9.2.5 is more than speculation because it doesn't look heavily connected to Dragon Isles.

[Ielenia]

Yeah, two sea faring races who we have never seen together, and who just happen to be the main focus of the following expansion………

Yeah, two seafaring races who we have never seen together, put together in a location known for shipwrecks of all races that sail through the oceans. Man, it's almost as if it's super-rare for people with similar interests but different backgrounds meet in locations heavily related to their interests or something.... (/s)

People misreading the tea leaves doesn’t negate the fact that Blizzard is clearly dropping hints for future content.

I'm highly amused by how apropos it feels seeing you make an analogy to a method that it's confirmed to be fake. And only that, but also apparently completely unaware how your analogy is backing up my arguments.

And just like "reading tea leaves" is fake, so is all claims of "hints" in the game. It's all confirmation bias. Wishful thinking.

[Wangming]

Yes, it could be elune and more elf bullshit, but this doesn't have enough juice to fill up an expansion, more likely this would be explored in a sidequest about the green dragonflight in the dragon expansion.

An emerald dream expansion is possible, with elune for sure, but just after shadowlands? i doubt it. it would need one or two expansions before going for another plane/dimension like that.

You might be right, but you are way more focused on what would make sense, rather than what Blizzard would do.
Most people were already sick of all the damned orc focus after Siege of Orgrimmar. The end result was Warlords of Draenor. People were begging to be rid of Sylvanas halfway into BfA...and it was followed by Shadowlands. They don't know when to stop, and also make illogical choices regarding what is expansion sized and what is patch sized.

Ehh who knows, maybe I'm just salty. I mean I shouldn't be, WoW will not ruin my fun. But still I just don't think a footnote of a location featuring the most overrated fantasy race is enough to mend all the damage of the past four years.

[Polybius]

Yes, and a Million people incorrectly predicted that the next expansion after Legion would be the return of Yogg because of the Legion pre-expansion quest.
People incorrectly predicted that the expansion after Legion would be about the return of C'thun based on the Silithus quests
People incorrectly predicted that the expansion after BfA would be an Old God-themed one because of all the unique Black Empire assets they've created for one content patch.
People incorrectly predicted Shadowlands to actually be about Dragon Isles.

Yes, he was right in hindsight. At that point in time, two random NPCs showing up absolutely doesn't indicate an expansion in any way, especially because even back then, the Broken Isles did sit between Zandalar and Kul Tiras.

The point you are trying to make is completely irrelevant. It doesn't matter if you think NPC X or Object Y is a hint towards the next expansion, because we don't know whether it's not just a hint or an easter egg until it actually gets revealed.

There weren’t any hints on Yogg. But they most definitely drop hints towards the next xpac, MoP did it with the timewalking tabard on a jade -cursed pandaren and time travel was predicted correctly. You can say it’s in hindsight but players have always had strong predictions, for 10+ years now.

You just have to practice looking at foreshadowing more.

[Ersula]

Cosmic themes can be included... just like they were in literally every expansion.

People are just fearmongering that we are going to get Shadowlands 2 3 4 and 5 and never go back to Azeroth because le epic trolling and ragecrafting from people who no longer believe Blizz can make something they want. While ignoring the multitude of dev comments saying they are going for something "grounded" (already sick of the word) as well as stuff like HD human houses that very likely are not part of the Garden of Life.

Yes and no. They specifically say they alternate between analog & cosmic expansions, but those qualifiers refer to the "vibe" of the expansion. MoP is considered cosmic because its focused on spirituality & emotions. WoD is considered analog & not cosmic because while it takes place on another planet, its focus was on classic RPG, and more or less classic Warcraft motifs of survival, wildlife & building settlements. Etc.

That's why I think a possible "analog" theme for 10.0 could be classic tabletop gaming in general. Dragons & Dungeons - DnD's popularity has exploded lately & they've marketed a theme like that before with Kobolds & Katacombs in Hearthstone:

Light & Void plot but it won't be evident at the start of the expansion. And not Light vs. Void, but Light & Void team up to take over Azeroth, using Turalyon & Alleria as their avatars. But they sell the expansion as an old-school RPG set up:
*Classic Tabletop inspired content. Dragon Hordes, Kobold Caves, Etc.
*Modular make-your-own dungeon feature. Players make their own non-canon D&D inspired instances, like in EQ2 or Neverwinter. Under the guise of players sitting at a tabletop game within WoW, like the homage in Boralus.
*New Bard Class

[PhillyCheese]

You might be right, but you are way more focused on what would make sense, rather than what Blizzard would do.
Most people were already sick of all the damned orc focus after Siege of Orgrimmar. The end result was Warlords of Draenor. People were begging to be rid of Sylvanas halfway into BfA...and it was followed by Shadowlands. They don't know when to stop, and also make illogical choices regarding what is expansion sized and what is patch sized.

Ehh who knows, maybe I'm just salty. I mean I shouldn't be, WoW will not ruin my fun. But still I just don't think a footnote of a location featuring the most overrated fantasy race is enough to mend all the damage of the past four years.

Sylvanas stuff lead to Shadowlands. Siege lead to orcs. Blizz will not change expansion plans extensively due to fan feedback: note how SL ending leads to absolutely nothing, meaning the plot is now a clean slate/they are free to follow up on the NON-Sylvanas stuff from BFA which was heavily about rebooting the status quo of Alliance and Horde.

If it was Lifelands we would have much more Elunewank this patch instead of Tyrande appearing in a single cutscene that isn't even a fancy one.

[Syegfryed]

You might be right, but you are way more focused on what would make sense, rather than what Blizzard would do.
Most people were already sick of all the damned orc focus after Siege of Orgrimmar. The end result was Warlords of Draenor. People were begging to be rid of Sylvanas halfway into BfA...and it was followed by Shadowlands. They don't know when to stop, and also make illogical choices regarding what is expansion sized and what is patch sized.

Blizzard would go for the easy route, we already peaky inside danuser's mind and the current writers, they are not as bright as they think they are, they can't make a twist like MOP out of an april's fool joke.

WoD was going to be a fine expansion if it was not by cut content, the expansion didn't just had orcs with all the draenor stuff. And yes sylvanus being a key character is danuser fault and we all knew about the redemption, i and others "theorized" the end of this shitshow in 9.0 already.

Putting all dots together and knowing how work there, the safe bet is dragon stuff.

Ehh who knows, maybe I'm just salty. I mean I shouldn't be, WoW will not ruin my fun. But still I just don't think a footnote of a location featuring the most overrated fantasy race is enough to mend all the damage of the past four years

Ah, for sure nothing will mend this game, unless they fire a lot of people and completely change the way they amke things.

[Ersula]

Sylvanas stuff lead to Shadowlands. Siege lead to orcs. Blizz will not change expansion plans extensively due to fan feedback: note how SL ending leads to absolutely nothing, meaning the plot is now a clean slate/they are free to follow up on the NON-Sylvanas stuff from BFA which was heavily about rebooting the status quo of Alliance and Horde.

I think you're confusing "Foreshadowing" & "Continuing a story thread." Clearly Shadowlands was a continuation of BFA's story but nothing in it directly foreshadowed the Shadowlands. The Shadowlands teaser was pretty shocking & everyone saying Sylvanas was going to be the next lich king was something people were saying since Wrath & the teaser was a direct subversion of that.

[Varx]

So to change the topic away from the assured chance of Tinkers, something that I would love added would be a multi class system.

Ive been playing a paladin since TBC and never mained anything else. I don't have the time to play alts and only ever leveled an alt to max once in MoP.

How nice would it be to have a multi class system where you're able to pick an additional class. You'd be able to switch between classes using the class trainers, giving them purpose again.

It'd be completely a volunteer system and gives you no player power.

[PhillyCheese]

I think you're confusing "Foreshadowing" & "Continuing a story thread." Clearly Shadowlands was a continuation of BFA's story but nothing in it directly foreshadowed the Shadowlands. The Shadowlands teaser was pretty shocking & everyone saying Sylvanas was going to be the next lich king was something people were saying since Wrath & the teaser was a direct subversion of that.

What are you talking about? The end of BFA was famously referred to on here as "Death and Dragons" because Dragons and Death were both being foreshadowed through the expansion. Drustvar and Thros, Nazmir, Naz'jatar's ghosts, the focus on Bwonsamdi in Battle for Dazar'alor, Vol'jin's plot, Sylvanas being confirmed to have a power boost for some magical reason... many many people expected a death expansion, though they didn't think it would be the Shadowlands themselves considering they had virtually no lore at the time.

[Polybius]

I think you're confusing "Foreshadowing" & "Continuing a story thread." Clearly Shadowlands was a continuation of BFA's story but nothing in it directly foreshadowed the Shadowlands. The Shadowlands teaser was pretty shocking & everyone saying Sylvanas was going to be the next lich king was something people were saying since Wrath & the teaser was a direct subversion of that.

… Drustvar, Isle Expeditions, Helya, the ‘veil’ that would be pierced? The new animations from the necro totems?

[Ersula]

… Drustvar, Isle Expeditions, Helya, the ‘veil’ that would be pierced? The new animations from the necro totems?

You describing BFA or Legion? Or Wrath? Hey, Cata included a lot of Dragons & a Scholomance dungeon revamp: That must have been intentional foreshadowing for 6 expansions later. /s

What are you talking about? The end of BFA was famously referred to on here as "Death and Dragons" because Dragons and Death were both being foreshadowed through the expansion. Drustvar and Thros, Nazmir, Naz'jatar's ghosts, the focus on Bwonsamdi in Battle for Dazar'alor, Vol'jin's plot, Sylvanas being confirmed to have a power boost for some magical reason... many many people expected a death expansion, though they didn't think it would be the Shadowlands themselves considering they had virtually no lore at the time.

There's 2 dragons in Shadowlands. And Death is a big theme in every expansion. And every expansion includes Dragons. If that's your requirement for foreshadowing, everything is foreshadowing even if it wasn't intentional. The Drust & Dragons were also in Legion. By this logic anything foreshadowed could just as easily be themes in 11.0, making it totally irrelevant to this conversation.

Unless you're saying a reference two expansions in a row is something that's absolutely going to happen. Because that means we're getting Bards & I'm totally on board.

[Polybius]

There's 2 dragons in BFA. And Death is a big theme in every expansion. And every expansion includes Dragons. If that's your requirement for foreshadowing, everything is foreshadowing even if it wasn't intentional. The Drust & Dragons were also in Legion. By this logic anything foreshadowed could just as easily be themes in 11.0, making it totally irrelevant to this conversation.

You said it wasn’t foreshadowing and now it is. Those mentions are simply references, it’s written there for worldbuilding. When the hints, assets, and story set ups stack up it’s foreshadowing. There’s a pretty good reason folks are mentioning Scarlet Crusade for 11.0, it’s being set up but unlikely to be the focus of 10.0.

- - - Updated - - -

You describing BFA or Legion? Or Wrath? Hey, Cata included a lot of Dragons & a Scholomance dungeon revamp: That must have been intentional foreshadowing for 6 expansions later. /s
There's 2 dragons in Shadowlands. And Death is a big theme in every expansion. And every expansion includes Dragons. If that's your requirement for foreshadowing, everything is foreshadowing even if it wasn't intentional. The Drust & Dragons were also in Legion. By this logic anything foreshadowed could just as easily be themes in 11.0, making it totally irrelevant to this conversation.

Nevermind, not worth. You don’t pay attention to the nuance.

It’s Wrath of the Bolvar obviously.

[Ersula]

You said it wasn’t foreshadowing and now it is. Those mentions are simply references, it’s written there for worldbuilding. When the hints, assets, and story set ups stack up it’s foreshadowing. There’s a pretty good reason folks are mentioning Scarlet Crusade for 11.0, it’s being set up but unlikely to be the focus of 10.0.

What's your criteria here? What exactly is the difference? The Scarlet Crusade reformation storyline in the Priest Order hall in Legion is a reference; The Scarlet Brotherhood storyline in BFA is a reference; but a SHEILD is foreshadowing?