1. #37781
    Expansion leveling without new talent rows has felt hollow. Aside from the math to space out the new endgame gear from the old I'm not sure the purpose at this point. If they did as you speculated I wouldn't mind a bit.

  2. #37782
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadochi View Post
    I have trouble understanding how no leveling would work regarding player gear, as currently the leveling makes previous tier irrelevant and brings everyone to a similar ilvl
    The only thing I can think of that would make sense is to have expansion related gear. Meaning that as soon you step into the content of next expansion with your previous expansion gear, your items bring you less benefit (think timewalking). I'm not sure the feeling would be great as the transition won't be smoothed as they've manage to do it with shadowlands.

  3. #37783
    Immortal Shadochi's Avatar
    7+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    The Shit Throne
    Posts
    7,803
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Tbh a stat squish could do that by itself. It would have to be quite severe.
    Quote Originally Posted by Snorlax View Post
    Just set all gear to a baseline of like 50 ilvl and then scale from there. Mix that with something like an artifact weapon so there is at least one piece that you have to actively work at and you're golden.
    Quote Originally Posted by SniperCT View Post
    Having an alternate advancement system would work. in ESO you get champion points. Not only are they account wide(if you have 500 cp on your main, all your alts of any level have CP, but you have to be at level cap to earn additional CP I think as it replaces regular XP), but you allocate them to improve your character. One can balance both gear and content around a certain champion level. A dungeon requiring 200 champion points for example, or hitting a certain CP milestone to equip gear.
    To answer all. Changing the ilvl to a baseline or squishing it wouldn't work as raiding is still done in prepatch so the gear would need to be relevant.

    For the last one you, would higher ilvl gear be gathered through earning CP or while you quest for CP levels?

    Since the point of leveling is to:

    Introduce expansion plotlines and characters.
    Give out gear while completing stuff so that everyone is on the same playing field by the end

    (IIRC I usually start getting upgrades for my mythic gear in around lvl x6 (so 116, 56,...). For this to work we would need some way to end up getting like ilvl 305 gear replace mythic level gear for all players that have it (usually iirc the max level quest gear ends up being around 20-30 ilvl higher)
    #1 Hype-Thread Shitposter - Overlord of the Hypethread

  4. #37784
    Knight of the Astral Star Local Ardenweald Faerie's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2022
    Location
    Tìrna Rionnagan
    Posts
    442
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    I had a thought this morning, and I'm curious what others think.

    What IF instead of adding 10 more levels in Dragonflight for current max level players to do (60), they:
    1). Just had a campaign (story) that we had to follow through in each of the new zones in order to get to the end-game similar to how the linear story worked in Shadowlands. Sure, in Shadowlands we had 50-60; however, we also had to complete the campaign in order to unlock Covenants.
    2). Alternatively, they could add Shadowlands to Chromie time (10-50), players can choose whatever version of WoW they wish to play through to go 50-60, then in Dragonflight, you would level 50-60 (current max level). In short, quests would give experience in Dragonflight for 50-60 players while level 60 players would just focus on the campaign. Doing so would allow players to skip Shadowlands 50-60 (if they wish), and level however they want 10-50 so that they could jump into Dragonflight with everyone else.

    I'm not saying I like this, nor am I saying that I want this. I simply thought of this and figured I would bring up for discussion. Feel free to take this part, add additional context, or provide your perspective for how something like this could work.
    I know we already know you're a Blizzard employee but I like how this is so obviously worded like a community manager or developer asking for feedback.

    Adding Shadowlands to Chromie Time would be pretty cool, and making Dragonflight the new 50-60 experience. That's actually pretty unique. Though, what would be the quest rewards for people already at 60? As in questing gear and what not. Seems like there'd be a problem of every zone set having the same stats so you just have rewards upon rewards of useless items.

  5. #37785
    Warchief Catastrophy349's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    What Sword? That Sword!
    Posts
    2,162
    For staying max level in Dragonflight and getting better gear while going through the new zones:

    -Just make the story linear again
    -Add higher and higher item level as you progress the story in each zone (zone to zone)

    Look at the item level gear in 9.1 and 9.2 from quests. We were max level (60) and obtained gear from quests doing the new campaign that lined up with the item level of current/near current content.

  6. #37786
    Knight of the Astral Star Local Ardenweald Faerie's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2022
    Location
    Tìrna Rionnagan
    Posts
    442
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    For staying max level in Dragonflight and getting better gear while going through the new zones:

    -Just make the story linear again
    -Add higher and higher item level as you progress the story in each zone (zone to zone)

    Look at the item level gear in 9.1 and 9.2 from quests. We were max level (60) and obtained gear from quests doing the new campaign that lined up with the item level of current/near current content.
    Very true, but the thing is, 9.1-9.2 was patch content progression. The ilvl curve for max level story questing would have to be weird. The gear would have to be better than current (9.2) gear, but how far would you propose the item levels would go?

    English isn't my first language so I'm sorry if I worded that a bit confusingly.

  7. #37787
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Orgrimmar
    Posts
    20,724
    Quote Originally Posted by Vynestra View Post
    If dragonflight doesn't have housing I imagine it'd be in 11.0, while it's something people have been asking for, for a while, it definitely feels like it's been asked for -a lot- only more recently, which doesn't give blizzard the time to react. They're pretty slow with major features, see: cross-faction instances.

    It usually takes them a few years to add it to the pipeline, and if they only added it to the pipeline in shadowlands, it will not be ready for 10.0. It takes so long for them to design major features.
    Thats true. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see the world revamp not happen till 11 or 12.0 tbh. I 100% think it will happen at some point, but its been gaining traction only the last year or two. 11.0 might not be on Azeroth, so it might be 12.0. Im still hoping though.

  8. #37788
    Immortal Shadochi's Avatar
    7+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    The Shit Throne
    Posts
    7,803
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    For staying max level in Dragonflight and getting better gear while going through the new zones:

    -Just make the story linear again
    -Add higher and higher item level as you progress the story in each zone (zone to zone)

    Look at the item level gear in 9.1 and 9.2 from quests. We were max level (60) and obtained gear from quests doing the new campaign that lined up with the item level of current/near current content.
    Yeah but campaign chapters on max level vs leveling are much shorter and different. Also the fact that that would remove the joy of leveling marathon on expansion launch and IMO I tend to procrastinate on non levelng campaigns vs leveling.

    What do you mean by make it linear again? SL was linear leveling story
    #1 Hype-Thread Shitposter - Overlord of the Hypethread

  9. #37789
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    I had a thought this morning, and I'm curious what others think.

    What IF instead of adding 10 more levels in Dragonflight for current max level players to do (60), they:
    1). Just had a campaign (story) that we had to follow through in each of the new zones in order to get to the end-game similar to how the linear story worked in Shadowlands. Sure, in Shadowlands we had 50-60; however, we also had to complete the campaign in order to unlock Covenants.
    2). Alternatively, they could add Shadowlands to Chromie time (10-50), players can choose whatever version of WoW they wish to play through to go 50-60, then in Dragonflight, you would level 50-60 (current max level). In short, quests would give experience in Dragonflight for 50-60 players while level 60 players would just focus on the campaign. Doing so would allow players to skip Shadowlands 50-60 (if they wish), and level however they want 10-50 so that they could jump into Dragonflight with everyone else.

    I'm not saying I like this, nor am I saying that I want this. I simply thought of this and figured I would bring up for discussion. Feel free to take this part, add additional context, or provide your perspective for how something like this could work.

    1) That would be great, as long as once you complete it your alts can skip that whole process. Also though, let us level 50-60 in any expansion. So expand chromie time up to 60, then do this option.

    2) I would frankly love this as well.

    I have 12 level 50 alts that I do not want to touch shadowlands on ever, so .... yeah.

  10. #37790
    Warchief Catastrophy349's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    What Sword? That Sword!
    Posts
    2,162
    Quote Originally Posted by Local Ardenweald Faerie View Post
    Very true, but the thing is, 9.1-9.2 was patch content progression. The ilvl curve for max level story questing would have to be weird. The gear would have to be better than current (9.2) gear, but how far would you propose the item levels would go?

    English isn't my first language so I'm sorry if I worded that a bit confusingly.
    I understand your confusion and question plainly. There would obviously need to be an internal system in play that would be able to adjust the item level of gear as you progress through the story (campaign) at various points. This is why we would need another linear story versus "choose your own adventure". With a linear story, Blizzard could adjust quests with appropriate item level gear at different points in the story. For example, item level 280 gear for introduction quests, item level 285 gear for middle of Zone 1 quests, and item level 290 gear for end of Zone 1 quests (or something like that).

    Then, when you go to Zone 2, there is another jump in item level. Personally, the item level jump should be small from beginning of zone, to middle, to end. Then, small again to the next zone, and so on. By the time you finish the final zone (can't say how many new zones), you would be at an appropriate item level to enter the Normal Dungeons (max level dungeons).

  11. #37791
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Orgrimmar
    Posts
    20,724
    Quote Originally Posted by Vynestra View Post
    I doubt 10.0 launches until the usual 4-6 weeks before the xpac, season 4 isn't coming with 10, it's clearly coming with 9.2.5 ptr.
    Well I think 9.2.5 will launch long before season 4 does. It will probably launch in like June. Season 4 not until August or September.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ercarp View Post
    Sorry if I'm late, but did anyone catch this in the recent blog post?



    The future is coming, huh? Sounds like Infinite dragonflight shenanigans to me.

    I'm only being semi-serious because there isn't anything else to do besides overanalyze the wording in a blog post.
    Future sounds like it could even be a timeskip. Doesnt have to be that it happened during Shadowlands. It could be that there is a few years of peace in between expansions.

  12. #37792
    Warchief Catastrophy349's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    What Sword? That Sword!
    Posts
    2,162
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadochi View Post
    Yeah but campaign chapters on max level vs leveling are much shorter and different. Also the fact that that would remove the joy of leveling marathon on expansion launch and IMO I tend to procrastinate on non levelng campaigns vs leveling.

    What do you mean by make it linear again? SL was linear leveling story
    Shadowlands was linear. I am saying that Dragonflight should be linear...again. As in, for a second time in a row; unlike Legion and BFA.

  13. #37793
    Knight of the Astral Star Local Ardenweald Faerie's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2022
    Location
    Tìrna Rionnagan
    Posts
    442
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    I understand your confusion and question plainly. There would obviously need to be an internal system in play that would be able to adjust the item level of gear as you progress through the story (campaign) at various points. This is why we would need another linear story versus "choose your own adventure". With a linear story, Blizzard could adjust quests with appropriate item level gear at different points in the story. For example, item level 280 gear for introduction quests, item level 285 gear for middle of Zone 1 quests, and item level 290 gear for end of Zone 1 quests (or something like that).

    Then, when you go to Zone 2, there is another jump in item level. Personally, the item level jump should be small from beginning of zone, to middle, to end. Then, small again to the next zone, and so on. By the time you finish the final zone (can't say how many new zones), you would be at an appropriate item level to enter the Normal Dungeons (max level dungeons).
    That makes a ton of sense and should've been something I thought of. I was thinking the increase of item levels would've been large but small, incremental jumps make a ton more sense.

    That raises another question; it should be easy to track if the zones were not linear, right? Lets say we have four zones to level in. Whatever zone I pick would then be labeled as "Zone 1" using your terminology, and should give me gear up to level 290 by the end of it.

    Then I pick another zone, then its labeled Zone 2. The intro gives me 295 gear. And so on and so forth.

    With the level scaling already in the game, it shouldn't be hard to keep track of something like that, at least in my thoughts.

  14. #37794
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Orgrimmar
    Posts
    20,724
    Quote Originally Posted by Das Momo View Post
    I think people are picturing the Dragon Isles as too cohesive, like a big continent of primarily just dragons (whereas not even Pandaria was just Pandaren). Look at how diverse the Broken Isles were, let alone the Shadowlands. Dragonkin will of course likely be the the most populated species on the Dragon Isles, but we'll likely meet a lot of new humanoid species we've never seen before, and likely some new civilizations made up of races we have seen before (think Broken Isles Vrykul and Tauren, Kul Tiran Quilboar, etc). The Dragon Isles will look a lot different than we're likely picturing, unless it's just one zone in which case yeah probably just dragons.
    Yeah DI will be the MoP but for dragons. MoP was mostly pandas, but plenty other stuff going on as well.

  15. #37795
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Orgrimmar
    Posts
    20,724
    Quote Originally Posted by Gifdwarf View Post
    That being said, as much as I loved finally exploring the Broken Isles and BFA zones, I'd love for an expansion on the other side of Azeroth with a bunch of new continents that were not known before, like Pandaria. It could give us literal years worth of expansions and new lore and zones to explore.
    Technically couldn't the known landmasses be just 1/4 to 1/3 of the total globe?

  16. #37796
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadochi View Post
    I have trouble understanding how no leveling would work regarding player gear, as currently the leveling makes previous tier irrelevant and brings everyone to a similar ilvl
    They could easily replace it with a system similar to renown.

    Lets say instead of hitting 61 and you ilvl increases by 13, instead you just need to hit level 5 renown (or whatever they want to call it)

  17. #37797
    The Unstoppable Force Chickat's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Orgrimmar
    Posts
    20,724
    Quote Originally Posted by Totally Not Dragons View Post
    interesting thing im not sure many have noticed but the neck from xymox taht teleports you has story implications

    for example cartel Xy had a ship on draenor before it became outland at least if you go by the wrecked ship and assume it was there before the big boom

    then theres also the broker chick that we find early in haven when her beloved is talking to her she was a member of cartel Ai but apparently left/ it was wiped out i dont remember if it was touched upon

    now if we knew the hierarchy of these cartels we could figure out how important xymox was and their planet was destroyed so we might be able to assume based on their portal tech that they are from the same planet as the ethereals
    That wouldn't actually be cool. Maybe its kinda like the Ethereals were Homo-sapiens, and the Brokers were Homo-erectus. 2 species very similar, but opposed.

  18. #37798
    Warchief Catastrophy349's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    What Sword? That Sword!
    Posts
    2,162
    Quote Originally Posted by Local Ardenweald Faerie View Post
    That makes a ton of sense and should've been something I thought of. I was thinking the increase of item levels would've been large but small, incremental jumps make a ton more sense.

    That raises another question; it should be easy to track if the zones were not linear, right? Lets say we have four zones to level in. Whatever zone I pick would then be labeled as "Zone 1" using your terminology, and should give me gear up to level 290 by the end of it.

    Then I pick another zone, then its labeled Zone 2. The intro gives me 295 gear. And so on and so forth.

    With the level scaling already in the game, it shouldn't be hard to keep track of something like that, at least in my thoughts.
    The technology should be there, correct. However, while the "free choice" leveling in both Legion and BFA was refreshing and "new", I do think that linear story progression is the best. I remember the good ol' days of searching in /who to see what level everyone was during an expansion launch. In doing so, you would also see where that player was leveling (zone). With "free choice" leveling, you wouldn't be able to associate the level of a player with their zone as easily. For example, Netherstorm would assume Level 67-70. In Legion, for example, you could be any level 100-110 and in any zone.

  19. #37799
    Quote Originally Posted by Snorlax View Post
    Linear with threads of fate is the best way to go. I lowkey hated that Legion and BFA dont have a canon story order or at least not an option to playthrough that way.
    It was obvious to me that the original Legion order was clockwise starting in Azsuna. Just from the way certain narrative elements went (such as the quest with the Sylvanas location intel leading to genn's attack on her ship)

  20. #37800
    Knight of the Astral Star Local Ardenweald Faerie's Avatar
    1+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2022
    Location
    Tìrna Rionnagan
    Posts
    442
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    The technology should be there, correct. However, while the "free choice" leveling in both Legion and BFA was refreshing and "new", I do think that linear story progression is the best. I remember the good ol' days of searching in /who to see what level everyone was during an expansion launch. In doing so, you would also see where that player was leveling (zone). With "free choice" leveling, you wouldn't be able to associate the level of a player with their zone as easily. For example, Netherstorm would assume Level 67-70. In Legion, for example, you could be any level 100-110 and in any zone.
    Makes sense, yeah.

    While I liked having the choice, I always felt like Legion at least had an intended linear story path before the selection mechanic came in. Legion's story only really flowed cohesively if you went Azsuna > Val'sharah > Highmoutain > Stormheim. BFA was a little bit more ambiguous, but you get my point.

    No matter if Dragonflight is 60-70, 50-60 with SL put into Chromie Time, or just plain level 60 content, sticking to linearity might be for the best.


    ... As long as each questing set looks awesome and has aesthetics tied to each flight.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •