Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Izalla]

Then they should just play a different class. If they dont want to tank or heal then they can roll a class that has that option. If I want to tank or heal I dont do it on my hunter so it's really no different from how pure dps are now.

I mean, yeah, if you don't want to deal with such things you would obviously pick a different class. But why the heck would Blizzard want to devote a TON of resources (permanently) for something that lots of people will avoid and will otherwise cause issues for those who decide not to avoid it?

[Ersula]

AKA you avoid toxic players? sounds great. Nobody wants to be grouped with people THAT stringent that the new class can't join. Anybody who makes you change specs isn't worth playing with.

Yeah I love doing dungeons with my friends: 2 dps and three healers /s

[Buliwyf the Omen]

Do people that have played this game the past couple years seriously think that Microclasses, and even worse, one spec healer/tank classes are a good idea?

Imagine if something like Feral or pre-9.2 Survival is a one-spec Class. I dont think you have to say much more.

I have played DH since its introduction of Legion, primarily as DPS, but if that Class had no tank spec to dodge on I would have deleted my DH long time ago. All the people playing Paladin or Priest solely for the DPS component are just as limited and that is terrible.

You need to get rid of your entire character if the spec is not performing decently if even above average.

Maybe the extremely casual playerbase does not care enough about its issues but Microclasses are definitely not the way to go.

[Dragon ANX]

Yeah, let me know how that works out for you when you spend hours getting declined from trying to join a M+ group because there's a pervasive community stigma towards your class and plenty of other options to pick from.

I've been playing fire mage when it was at the very bottom of dps spec in M+ and i still did it, it took more time to find a group, but that was a fact that me as a player that wanted to keep my Fire Mage fantasy up accepted.

I mean, yeah, if you don't want to deal with such things you would obviously pick a different class. But why the heck would Blizzard want to devote a TON of resources (permanently) for something that lots of people will avoid and will otherwise cause issues for those who decide not to avoid it?

For the same reason why mechagnomes and goblins exist, there is someone out there that want it. Not everything needs or should be popular.

You can't be kicked from the group if you're the party leader.

I would simply run my own keys instead of getting carried

Exactly.

[Izalla]

I don't do mythics or pug raids or even really play with friends these days, AND I'm the kind of crazy altoholic who has at least one character for each spec for nearly all classes. So as far as my gameplay goes, microclasses wouldn't really affect me except in the sense that if I get a tinker and it only has one spec when it had the class fantasy of a full 3 spec class I would be very cranky. I would be that person slogging to max level as a janky healer and switching to a different character if I want to play a different role.

But I'm not the majority and most people don't play like me. I just really cannot see how they would benefit the game overall as whole rather than pulling resources from other things (could gave had a few new heritage style sets but they needed to make 4 separate tier sets for the handful of people who chose the micro classes!) or what possible argument one could make to Blizz to convince them it wouldn't be a terrible idea.

And personally I would rather just have gradual, fully fledged new classes with multiple specs, and NOT only once every 6 or 7 years.

[Raetary]

Guess I'd just.. reconsider my goals? It's that easy.

Any dungeons M+ offers are available in Normal or Heroic, eventually if not immediately. If I do all 8 of Shadowlands dungeons on Heroic, am I really getting NEW content if I up the difficulty? or am I just retreading where I've been.

Letting "a pervasive community stigma" dictate your life and fun is about the worst thing you could do. Look at the last 2 years of IRL and see why.

Are you serious?
Your solution is... basically abandoning everything post normal dungeons?

[Raxacorico]

Well then they'd just have to make them work??? Like, they obviously don't have to make survival work because there are 2 better specs. But godspeed to them if they want to make 1spec classes work.

And nobody said they can't add more specs along the expansion just to boost the numbers because people will obviously want to try them in the middle of expansion.

Todd: It just works

[Alanar]

I mean the Harbinger of Tentacles.

Never heard of it.

[Izalla]

For the same reason why mechagnomes and goblins exist, there is someone out there that want it. Not everything needs or should be popular.

Mechagnomes already existed as models and were just based on gnomes anyway, and a new race is nothing compared to a new class in terms of resources, especially an allied race that reuses a previous NPC or playable model.

[Sondrelk]

I've been playing fire mage when it was at the very bottom of dps spec in M+ and i still did it, it took more time to find a group, but that was a fact that me as a player that wanted to keep my Fire Mage fantasy up accepted.

There is still a case where someone didnt enjoy playing an underperforming spec, or didnt enjoy how Fire played in general, and then had the option to choose between changing spec or class. Changing spec obviously being far less difficult to do.

A micro-class would always end up making a new character instead, hich means that for players who like changing playstyles often they are a complete no-go unless they also enjoy keeping up with several alts at once.

[Ersula]

The development of microclasses have two major hurdles:

1.) Adding a normal class would be easier, more fun for the players

2.) Adding no class would be easier, more fun for the players. Because microclasses are stupid & not fun.

And fast forward to when they add elective specs & and all the pro-microclasses people are like "see how fun microclasses are?" even though that's not what microclasses are. So we might as well just abandon this website entirely because like class skins, its a cancer that will never be removed.

[Wildmoon]

Microclasses are too much work. 3-4 separate art sets are too much. Not to mention future upkeep. 4 tier sets for example. 1 full class is far easier to implement.

[manypillars]

after looking at the elf slapfight on the official forums I've decided to craft my own leak to please them. It's an impossible task, and they are sure to be even more angry at me for posting this, so let's get started: Today I Choose Violence

WoW 10.0 Dragonflight
-High Elves are now a full Alliance race, AND they can be all classes.
-Void Elves are no longer playable and all existing player characters have been made High Elves.
-Blood Elves are no longer playable and all existing player characters have been transferred to the Alliance as High Elves.
-Vulpera are no longer playable.
-Story centers on Alleria and her quest to return Quel'thalas to its rightful home in the Alliance.
-To address faction balance issues, the Horde is no longer playable.
-Dwarves are no longer playable.
-Undercity will be renewed as the reborn kingdom of Lorderon.
-Undead are no longer playable.
-Vulpera players are banned. UwU
-The Mag'har have fled Azeroth because they'd prefer to take their chances with Yrel and the Lightbound than deal with the oncoming elf onslaught.
-The Sunwell explodes because Alleria didn't quite get the memo last time, leading to a light vs void patch wrapping up the final raid.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

Are you serious?
Your solution is... basically abandoning everything post normal dungeons?

Don't be silly and imply that a 1 Spec DPS class couldn't fit into a 20 man Normal Raid.

In my experience, decent people expect you to peform "Well" in a raid. Be useful, help with mechanics that you've learned, and output enough damage to compare to another class.

If Blizzard designs a class that CAN'T do those 3 things in a Raid, that's not the player's fault for choosing the awesome new gameplay flavor, it's on Blizzard.

Of course, that won't happen and you're just asking these things for the sake of it.

Like, they obviously don't have to make survival work because there are 2 better specs.

Which is a shame. I mained Survival in Legion and loved it more than any Hunter spec before, but Blizz caved on their melee vision for that Spec, and now it's a shoddy ranged pet spammer again. Lame.

[Raetary]

Never heard of it.

The one guy that keeps talking about a certain purple elf that looks sorta similar like Sylvanas.

[Sondrelk]

The development of microclasses have two major hurdles:

1.) Adding a normal class would be easier, more fun for the players

2.) Adding no class would be easier, more fun for the players. Because microclasses are stupid & not fun.

Also: Adding 4 new microclasses means either a 33% increase in class identity stuff, as well as making future class specific stuff difficult to implement fairly.
OR
Not giving the microclasses much attention that is expected of other classes.

Either option is pretty bad.

[Alanar]

The one guy that keeps talking about a certain purple elf that looks sorta similar like Sylvanas.

I though that was the forbidden one. Hsrbringer of tentacles sounds way to cool for him.

- - - Updated - - -

after looking at the elf slapfight on the official forums I've decided to craft my own leak to please them. It's an impossible task, and they are sure to be even more angry at me for posting this, so let's get started: Today I Choose Violence

You will just get some REN'DOREI fans crying how amazing this sounds!

Ita REN'DOREI btw.. not sure if I mentioned that, no no no void elves, but REN'DOREI.

[Izalla]

Also: Adding 4 new microclasses means either a 33% increase in class identity stuff, as well as making future class specific stuff difficult to implement fairly.
OR
Not giving the microclasses much attention that is expected of other classes.

Either option is pretty bad.

Exactly. Like it's not a stupid thing to want a bunch of new options to play as. It's just... this implementation would cause way more problems for Blizzard and the community at large than it would solve for the people like me who like having a shit load of single spec focused characters. I cannot fathom Blizzard seeing 4 microclasses (let alone more future ones) as being worth the amount of work they would require to make and then maintain, especially for the pay off of only a tiny fraction of the playerbase ever treating them as anything other than something for an alt at best.

[Raetary]

Healers and tanks are highly limited spots in raids and dungeons.

If you are playing with a friend, who is also a healer/tank microclass, you are flat out barred from ever playing again with them.
If your guildmates are forming a dungeon group but already got a healer/tank, yet you are a healer/tank microclass, there is no 'i'll just swap to another spec', you are just flat out barred from playing with them.

And while pure dps classes exist, dps have 3 times (literally) as many group spots in all forms of content.
2 dps players can form a group on their own, 2 healers or 2 tanks can't.
There'll always be room for more dps players, whereas this doesn't apply for healers/tanks.

[Dragon ANX]

Mechagnomes already existed as models and were just based on gnomes anyway, and a new race is nothing compared to a new class in terms of resources, especially an allied race that reuses a previous NPC or playable model.

Yep, an NPC is way more easy than the commitment of new animations for every class, armor and etc every new content patch.

There is still a case where someone didnt enjoy playing an underperforming spec, or didnt enjoy how Fire played in general, and then had the option to choose between changing spec or class. Changing spec obviously being far less difficult to do.

A micro-class would always end up making a new character instead, hich means that for players who like changing playstyles often they are a complete no-go unless they also enjoy keeping up with several alts at once.

Yep i do agree with you that the option of changing spec is more confortable for other people, but there are people like me or @Fahrad Wagner that only play one spec and there are also people that came or still play other mmos where classes dont have extra spec thefore they already know the negatives of playing a tank/healer only class or playing a weak dps class.
I also play BDO and there i main a SHAI a class that is the only true support class of the game, but because i play Shai i cant do 1v1 pvp because the class was designed to be horrible in solo PvP, so i accepted that every time that someone tries do PK me i'll either have to give up my grinding spot or call some friend or guildmate to help.