Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[rhorle]

In the end it is about player engagement, and not about to bore them to death.

So why are people engaged in Normal, Heroic, and Mythic and not LFR when it is the same type of mechanics? LFR is just watered down to make it easier. Remember you also argued that choreographed mechanics are bad as well. So we are supposed to increase the difficulty with out different mechanics while also making it engaging. Well tank and spank fights boring which is why those types of things are rare.

You also say random match making means people don't care about their group members while also advocating for random match making for M+. So won't your suggestion for M+ just cause the same problems that exist in LFR? Strange how you contradict your own arguments.

[Lahis]

Oooooh Question!

Will I be able to Fly in my Drake form in older content like Worgens can use their form as a ground mount?

Dragon form can't fly. On Dragon Isles it has access to basic version of Dragonriding, elsewhere it is just a glider like DH wings.

[Alexjimithing]

Are we back to ad hominem again?

It's not ad hominem, it's your arguments and examples not lining up with what it's actually like to play XIV or WoW when raiding.

[rhorle]

No, simply about designing the raids based on personal skill rather than group skills. Something blizzard never understood and obviously never will.

It is a group activity. You can't design it around personal skill because it is not a solo experience. Lol.

I do not contradict anything as my idea was to base challenges in a solo queue on personal accountability from start. You just ignore it again.

But you just got done saying personal accountability doesn't exist in LFR because of the random match making. Lol.

[huth]

Are we back to ad hominem again?

Please learn what that actually is, first.

[Alexjimithing]

I do not contradict anything as my idea was to base challenges in a solo queue on personal accountability from start. You just ignore it again.

WoW does this to a greater extent than XIV. That's what's confusing me here. WoW's raids, even in LFR, rely on each person not fucking up more than XIV.

It's much easier in WoW in LFR for one person to wipe a raid than in XIV.

[Syegfryed]

Dragon form can't fly. On Dragon Isles it has access to basic version of Dragonriding, elsewhere it is just a glider like DH wings.

This can't be serious, their big ass wings are just for show?

This race/class keeps getting dumber and dumber, confirming its just DH 2.0 sold as race

[wowrefugee]

Agree that not being able to use Dracthyr wings to fly outside of Dragon Isles is stupid. How does that sell the dragon fantasy theyre going for

[rhorle]

A solo queue is a matchmade group experience, yet it cannot be about choreography as the group is random. So the gameplay should be different. I do not really wonder you cannot see a distinction here.

So how will the game play be different if it isn't about doing mechanics of fights? You are asking for the fundamental core of combat to change for all of WoW yet offer no actual examples of what it should be. Tank and spank, DPS/Heal checks, resist gear checks are not fun or engaging. Those are things that would have to be brought back if "choreography" is not a part of encounters.

You cannot even see a difference between premade group play and matchmade group play. So how can you even think about being able to judge about that?

So match making causes LFR to be bad yet magically will make M+ better. Yet I am the one that can't understand something? Why is it that instead of explaining things you keep attacking me? It just shows that you are using accountability as a scapegoat with out having any actual depth to the argument.

[Alexjimithing]

That is simply not true. WoW is way more focused on choreography than any other MMORPG.

You do know what choreography is, right?

If one person fucks up the routine, it ruins the whole performance.

By the word you're using, 'choreography', it shows personal responsibility IS more present in WoW than in other MMOs. If a fight isn't 'choreographed' then what each person is doing individually doesn't matter as much, which is true in XIV. You can fuck up repeatedly in an Alliance raid at base level without much fear of wiping the raid- that LOWERS the personal responsibility of each individual player. If what you do doesn't substantially change what happens to everyone else, who cares?

WoW demands 'higher personal responsibility', even in LFR, because of the lack of battle rez and the increased liklihood your personal failure will result in the raid as a whole being wiped.

I do not talk about personal accountablity for the group, but for your own fate. Means, if you die in a puddle of ooze, you simply will not be rewarded. Rather than having a group effort, the focus should be on your personal performance whichs failure would result in your own disqualification from receiving rewards.

This is fucking insane and completely antithetical to what an 'MMO' is. XIV also does not do anything remotely like this either so I'm unsure why you brought it up as some positive comparison compared to WoW.

[rhorle]

I do not talk about personal accountablity for the group, but for your own fate. Means, if you die in a puddle of ooze, you simply will not be rewarded. Rather than having a group effort, the focus should be on your personal performance whichs failure would result in your own disqualification from receiving rewards.

How would that work in a M+ when you need ever group member to perform in order to get rewards? Why join a group if you just want solo content in the first place? lol.

[Ersula]

You should have been awake in school when they taught you to read charts. Alleria is on the second to last place there.

I do get the logic of looking at how Alleria is the only character introduced as recently as Legion, to show how popular she's become since appearing for the first time in WoW, but oops who's that right above her? Flynn: A character introduced even more recently. Or that if you look more closely, how Alleria's appearence in Fanfiction is only a minor role in Sylvanas fics.

I'm sure Alleria would become more popular if she recieved more focus & she will have more focus eventually, but we aren't there yet.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Agree that not being able to use Dracthyr wings to fly outside of Dragon Isles is stupid. How does that sell the dragon fantasy theyre going for

I sorta understand that but we've only seen so much of the Dragon riding so its hard to tell what their reasoning is. Might be cause how Dragonriding works might clash with past zones and such. Don't take it as fact though,

[Skayth]

So if drac'thyr can "fly" will they finally give dhs the ability to fly? Since its exactly the same mechanic copy pasted

[Hugnomo]

I didn't get the impression that we wouldn't be able to use the basic dragonriding that's inherent to the dracthyr, outside of the dragon isles.
As far as I know, they can. It's just that it's not upgradable like the dragon mount you use on the dragon isles. It's a basic version, that they referred to as demonhunter's glide plus.

[Varodoc]

You should have been awake in school when they taught you to read charts. Alleria is on the second to last place there.

You should have been awake in school when they taught you to critically read English because that has nothing to do with my point in any way, shape, or form.

[Lahis]

Again. It can be harder but the player base doesn't want it to be. When it is to hard they complain and it takes way to long to do. Blizzard doesn't need any lessons to do LFR right. You are trying to change every system into what you want instead of you just taking the initiative to do content higher then LFR.

LFR is already way harder than Normal because half of the group there is braindead, quarter is AFK and the remaining few must carry everyone else.

[rhorle]

You still have no understood what i talk about. I talk about changing the gameplay for matchmade groups only, not for premade groups, and about moving away from group goals to personal goals in matchmade gameplay.

You can't do that though because the rewards are the same. You are asking them to make two copies of everything and allow for solo play as a group. That is silly. It already is up to the individual player to survive an encounter. Removing the need for tanks and healers in M+ is a fundamental change to how the combat in the game works. Why join a group and change group play if what you really are looking for is a 100% solo experience?

You already have to care about not standing in fire. You are already supposed to care about doing the mechanics of the encounters. This sounds like a you problem. You don't care so it has to be the system that is wrong rather then you being wrong. You lack the personal accountability you want the game to force upon you. Lol.

No, a bad implementation does that, where choreographed gameplay is watered down to nothing.

Right. Because the players over the years did not want a normal difficulty LFR. So it was made easier to accomplish because people don't want to play it the way you think they do.

[Alexjimithing]

You still have not understood what i talk about. It is really hard to talk to someone who is both fanatic and incapable to comprehend the most easy statements. I talk about changing the gameplay for matchmade groups only, not for premade groups, and about moving away from group goals to personal goals in matchmade gameplay. Means, it is up to you to survive an encounter rather than to healers and tanks, and the design would ask you for caring about not standing in puddles of oozes, it would be about you caring for enough engagement in gameplay to actually give you credit for the kill of the encounter rather than taking the overall performance of everyone and whiping the raid if too many people are AFK.

Rather than mechanics that engage the tank only, i would add mechanics that would engage everyone to play their part rather than to bore everyone to death.

The simple consequence of people doing nothing in LFR would be they would receive nothing. And die if they never move to anywhere, while the difficulty would be scaled down to the size of the still alive players by actually rewarding them if they manage to kill the encounter at the end. And yes, if it is only 3 character left, only they would receive the reward. Get better by avoiding the puddles. And retry.

This immediately falls apart because members of a raid rely on each other- it's a group activity, that's the whole point.

Who's to say someone didn't die because a healer faltered in their healing or because a tank fucked up aggro?

[Lahis]

This can't be serious, their big ass wings are just for show?

This race/class keeps getting dumber and dumber, confirming its just DH 2.0 sold as race

Precicely this.

They don't get full extent of Dragonriding mechanics, because then they would ignore the dragon mount and all of its customization and content.

And since Dragonriding is not regular flying (floating in place without regards to physics and moving at static speed), they can't fly outside of Dragon Isles, just glide.