Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Ersula]

4 Zones is still less than 5 though. No matter how you spin it. Makes you wonder, doesn't it? Considering the fact this is the least amount of zones, we've ever received in an expansion.

I think people pointed out they showed a little bit of a desert (bronze) zone in the preview, that isn't the 4 zones (or the Drakthyr starter zone) so that looks like a future zone, ala Tanaan or Korthia.

Other question is why did they design an entire zone just for the Dracthyr to level up 2 levels? Wouldn't it have made more sense to to do the introduction sequence in a phased version of the other zones?

[rhorle]

Honestly, they've been on a steady reduction of content and shipping less and less product to the consumer. Soo, I don't really believe much in the 4 Zones identity nor that the sizes will outshine the concept of more zones than a zone with several biomes and paletes in 4 megazones.

Yet that has nothing to do with the number of zones and just the quality of work. More zones doesn't mean you will get a higher quality and more biomes and palettes. Just as 4 zones doesn't mean just one biome and palette.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

Yet that has nothing to do with the number of zones and just the quality of work. More zones doesn't mean you will get a higher quality and more biomes and palettes. Just as 4 zones doesn't mean just one biome and palette.

Well, the quality of work has declined and reducing zones by stating they are megazones is an easy way to reduce content available to the consumer going forward.

[rhorle]

I think people pointed out they showed a little bit of a desert (bronze) zone in the preview, that isn't the 4 zones (or the Drakthyr starter zone) so that looks like a future zone, ala Tanaan or Korthia.

The Bronze HQ is in Thaldraszus the zone that holds the capital city according to the small zone blurb on the expansion website.

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Well, the quality of work has declined and reducing zones by stating they are megazones is an easy way to reduce content available to the consumer going forward.

You are talking about two different things though. If they increased zones that doesn't mean they won't be reducing content as well. There is no need to blame reduction in zone when it has nothing to do with quality or amount delivered.

[Ersula]

So you didn't whine about there not being enough content or that there wasn't enough presented for us.

'kay. This is pointless. At least everyone is aware you have no value in your voice.

A lot of people pointed out Dragonflight seems like a smaller expansion, but I was pointing it out as a reason for the expansion to come out faster.

My primary complaint has been the weird "Welcome to our home" PR coming from them as a company: A kind of false intimacy that corporate culture likes to tout. And how that "We're dying to show you more!" when that's factually untrue. They're time-gating information for the sake of hype and you shouldn't need to do that if there's real quality in your product.

The Bronze HQ is in Thaldraszus the zone that holds the capital city according to the small zone blurb on the expansion website.

Even then. The Desert biome shown & the Thaldraszus preview doesn't match up, so it seems like there will be a 6th physical zone at launch, unpopulated until a future tier. Like Tanaan or the Broken Shore was.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

You are talking about two different things though. If they increased zones that doesn't mean they won't be reducing content as well. There is no need to blame reduction in zone when it has nothing to do with quality or amount delivered.

More Zones at least means quantifiable that there are more zones in the game even if the work put into these zones is limited due to budgeting. Megazones seem like an easy way to reduce content going forward due to their massive sizes.

Again it is going to end up being like Open World Games where it just feels empty. Who would've guessed it?

Dragonriding also means that every player won't even really feel the massive scale of emptiness in the zones which means art team can do less work and not focus too much on making sure everything is of high standards beyond the WQ node locations.

Again, I'm sceptical about this.

Obviously I like Megazones and have always felt the Art Team have made zones too claustrophobic lately. So, there's that. But yeah, I just worry that Blizzard has ulterior motives as per usual rather than just making Megazones because people want bigger zones. Blizzard never does anything out of the kindness of their heart. There's always something negative tied to a good decision.

[Makabreska]

Again it is going to end up being like Open World Games where it just feels empty. Who would've guessed it?

Dragonriding also means that every player won't even really feel the massive scale of emptiness in the zones which means art team can do less work and not focus too much on making sure everything is of high standards beyond the WQ node locations.

Again, I'm sceptical about this.

Pure guesswork. You have no way of knowing any of this. We don't know how packed the zones are going to be and we don't know how exactly fast Dragonriding is going to be, especially when you start slower and have to acquire upgrades for it over time. This is not skepticism, this is pessimism. You instantly assume negative outcome, just like you did all those months in this thread.

[rhorle]

Even then. The Desert biome shown & the Thaldraszus preview doesn't match up, so it seems like there will be a 6th physical zone at launch, unpopulated until a future tier. Like Tanaan or the Broken Shore was.

Do you have a link to that biome? Because I'm not seeing it in a brief glimpse (5 second fast forwards) of the reveal video or their press kit.

[therumblings]

I think the Dracthyr starting zone will be used like the Broken Shore was for a later patch.

[rhorle]

More Zones at least means quantifiable that there are more zones in the game even if the work put into these zones is limited due to budgeting..

More zones doesn't mean quality though which is what you stated is the core issue in earlier posts. So why are you now saying that seeing a 6 instead of a 4 automatically means more quality and more content? It is quite easy to deliver less content even though zone number is higher if they reuse assets, right? You just have a whole bunch of issues you are trying to cram into one box labeled "Zone count" rather then letting those issues exist on their own.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

More zones doesn't mean quality though which is what you stated is the core issue in earlier posts. So why are you now saying that seeing a 6 instead of a 4 automatically means more quality and more content? It is quite easy to deliver less content even though zone number is higher if they reuse assets, right? You just have a whole bunch of issues you are trying to cram into one box labeled "Zone count" rather then letting those issues exist on their own.

Either way, I don't like the Zone Count of Dragonflight. It is worrying as WoW is a precedent based game and low Zone counts could lead to same Zone counts going forward. Megazones are cool if they are putting the budget and art team at full effort. But, again it could be cost saving measure and a precedent of low/reduction of zone count going forward.

Whether my worries are correct or not remains to be seen, what I do think is that it is silly to ascertain that 4 Zones is normal even if they are Megazones. Yes, we may get two more Major Patch Content Islands too. But, that's up in the air.

I like Megazones, I just hope that it won't mean that we are reducing zone count solely due to Megazones being a concept that now exists in the franchise going forward.

[rhorle]

Either way, I don't like the Zone Count of Dragonflight. It is worrying as WoW is a precedent based game and low Zone counts could lead to same Zone counts going forward. Megazones are cool if they are putting the budget and art team at full effort. But, again it could be cost saving measure and a precedent of low/reduction of zone count going forward.

Yet you would automatically be fine if the same Megazone was split into smaller zones. You don't see the absurdity of that? A megazone means they are not going to put the full budge and effort into the zone but it being 4 smaller zones means they will. Zone count is just a number. It is meaningless to any content of the zones or quality of the zones.

[wowrefugee]

For most ppl here it’s maybe a good advice to read the Galakrond/Apsects novell

https://www.amazon.com/World-Warcraf...009036&sr=8-16

Thanks for this. Currently listening to Sylvanas audiobook, I'll try this one next.

edit: lmao @ this discussion going on.

Yes, small numbers bad, big numbers good.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

Yet you would automatically be fine if the same Megazone was split into smaller zones. You don't see the absurdity of that? A megazone means they are not going to put the full budge and effort into the zone but it being 4 smaller zones means they will. Zone count is just a number. It is meaningless to any content of the zones or quality of the zones.

I don't get why we're getting into the topic of basic math. If you chopped the zones up into more zones that would mean more zones, yes. Chopping up a Megazone that has themed biomes into more zones would mean more zones.

The point here is the precedent it sets. WoW is already suffering from extreme reduction in content to the player and as such Zone count going to an alarming number of 4 for a continent is extremely alarming as this will set precedent for the next expansions going forward.

The issue here is the principle idea that them telling us that a selling point of the expansion is 4 Megazones is alarming as it means they might intend to keep this trend of zone design in which they say "Hang on, you wanted Megazones. Well, our compromise is that we only create continents with 4 Megazones going forward and nothing more.".

[wowrefugee]

I don't get why we're getting into the topic of basic math. If you chopped the zones up into more zones that would mean more zones, yes. Chopping up a Megazone that has themed biomes into more zones would mean more zones.

The point here is the precedent it sets. WoW is already suffering from extreme reduction in content to the player and as such Zone count going to an alarming number of 4 for a continent is extremely alarming as this will set precedent for the next expansions going forward.

The issue here is the principle idea that them telling us that a selling point of the expansion is 4 Megazones is alarming as it means they might intend to keep this trend of zone design in which they say "Hang on, you wanted Megazones. Well, our compromise is that we only create continents with 4 Megazones going forward and nothing more.".

What if megazones are better and have more content than tiny clustered zones we have now

The reason basic math is brought up is because thats what your argument hinges on: "5 is better than 4" irregardless of any other factors

[rhorle]

I don't get why we're getting into the topic of basic math. If you chopped the zones up into more zones that would mean more zones, yes. Chopping up a Megazone that has themed biomes into more zones would mean more zones.

Because you were using math as a reason to complain? Legion only have 5 zones at launch. Shadowlands had only 5 at launch. There is no precedent being set here. You can be alarmed about quality of work but don't try to use math and the number of zone as the reason. Because it is irrelevant.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

What if megazones are better and have more content than tiny clustered zones we have now

The reason basic math is brought up is because thats what your argument hinges on: "5 is better than 4" irregardless of any other factors

I mean my argument basis is that WoW is a precedent based game. Design that lingers for a decade exists based on stupid shit like this argument. 4 Zones being showcased as enough for the base product could lead to 4 zones being the new normal for the base product going forward which is troubling.

Normalizing 4 Zones as the maximum in the base product is the problem at play here.

The problem is we're seeing the argument for this worry basically being destroyed by the argument that the zones are bigger in which I think its' rather silly cause we have no idea on the content of the zones or what is in the zone. Whether they will be anything more than just WQ node blitzing at max level and whether the utilization of the zones during levelling will be good or not.

[Alanar]

Oh, it's fascinating how they are absolutely fuming over DF, mainly because of Drakebois.

Not directly about the poster or what ever, but I see some repetitive things that made more sense around legion and before, but this time around after their second try, (Sl) the forums were heated with skepticism. Now that we are here in time.. we suddenly forgot the past and we should just have full faith in them? According to some, the skepticism doesn't seem justified It feels like.. we are back to square one and a repeat of: oo it's only alpha...oo it's only beta, wait for your judgement etc etc.
At this point, there is no wait and see anymore. Ofc things can still be not ready, but they even told us they are far along. So not showing much and the weird reveal they did this year makes it feel off. That being said..I do understand the criticism in general.

edit: 5 zones, isn't that with the new strating zone for Dracthyr included? so for any non evokers it's 4?

[wowrefugee]

The problem is we're seeing the argument for this worry basically being destroyed by the argument that the zones are bigger in which I think its' rather silly cause we have no idea on the content of the zones or what is in the zone. Whether they will be anything more than just WQ node blitzing at max level.

why is the opposing argument silly, but you dont consider your argument silly?

you have no idea about the zones either! lmao

[rhorle]

Normalizing 4 Zones as the maximum in the base product is the problem at play here.

Even if those 4 zones are equal to the 10 zones of Northrend? It also ignores how 5 zones more often the the normal with Northrend being an outlier. So your fear of a decade long precedent is over 1 less zone then the normal. Again you are using math instead of simply talking about quality.

Quality zones will always be better then more zones of less quality. Just as quality zones will always be better then less zones of lesser quality. The number of zones is irrelevant to your concerns yet you keep making it all about the number of zones.