Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Alexjimithing]

No, but if it exists in a technological time period equivalent to the late middle ages and early renaissance, and they live in a place with few if any texts, where knowing how to read offers little value in life, then it probably means they're illiterate. It's like you people aren't aware that literacy was below 50% until the fucking 1900s.

How do you have any idea how much value the Darkspear place on reading? Besides assuming based on their “shitty shacks”.

It’s like you aren’t aware Warcraft lore previously established the Darkspear AREN’T some illiterate society.

[Makabreska]

Also, seems like Dracthyr starting zone is either launch Max Level zone or one of the patch zones (Like broken shore was intro and then patch)

Was logical to make it max lvl zone with WQ's and campaign quests. You don't attach it to the main continent for nothing. So this means we basically get 5 zones at start of DF, since everyone counts Maw, Suramar and opposite faction land in BfA.

[Syegfryed]

You shouldn't participate in this conversation if you don't know anything about Troll lore, the literal inventers of civilization in Azeroth.

If you are not human or elf looking, or if you have a tribal lifestyle you obvious are uncivilized in wow, thats the rule. /s

[Shadochi]

But you can only chose to be a blood elf male or a human female

Tbh it would go a long way if they changed minor stuff a bit and made the visage halfelves.

But as it stands now while from a mechanical standpoint they are just belf and human with customization, they are in no way that in lore

[Ersula]

Because he learned it? Are you seriously arguing that all trolls have to be literate because one troll was?

It's described as "the brought the darkspear the human's clergy books" thus giving them the ability to be priests.

Seems like those wouldn't be very effective if his fellow trolls couldn't read them.

Yeah? You wanna go look up Mesopotamian literacy rates, chief?

Trolls are Rome in this situation, not Mesopotamia. You're going off just the aesthetics of ONE tribe who were forced to be nomadic because of the Alliance. And before you say "well that's zekhan" nomadic doesn't mean you lose the ability to read, either.

[Shadochi]

Was logical to make it max lvl zone with WQ's and campaign quests. You don't attach it to the main continent for nothing. So this means we basically get 5 zones at start of DF, since everyone counts Maw, Suramar and opposite faction land in BfA.

Yes if it is available from 10.0 and not in a patch like Broken Shore or Tanaan.

Also I don't see why we shouldn't count it as a zone if it will be in 10.0 available to everyone. Are there some people that count only leveling zones?

[Syegfryed]

Tbh it would go a long way if they changed minor stuff a bit and made the visage halfelves.

But as it stands now while from a mechanical standpoint they are just belf and human with customization, they are in no way that in lore

I don't know how "combining" the awful and forced choices would make any better, instead of simple allowing other options like dragons do

[Makabreska]

If you are not human or elf looking, or if you have a tribal lifestyle you obvious are uncivilized in wow, thats the rule. /s

Man, you are so insanely salty about whole Dracthyr ordeal, it's amazing. Once again taking lore and story of a video game way too serious and personal.

[Hitei]

How do you have any idea how much value the Darkspear place on reading? Besides assuming based on their “shitty shacks”.

It’s like you aren’t aware Warcraft lore previously established the Darkspear AREN’T some illiterate society.

Abundance of reading material? You know, the thing that directly correlates with the literacy of a society. The reason why you can directly trace jumps in literacy rate to innovations in the easy of producing reading material.

Like if you want to pretend that the Stormwind people who learn to fight in and around an abbey where many of the rooms are stuffed full of bookshelves, and the Echo Isles people who learn to fight in and around... maybe a few scrolls? are going to have similar levels of literacy in their two societies, be my guest. But that completely defies all logic.

Trolls are Rome in this situation, not Mesopotamia. You're going off just the aesthetics of ONE tribe who were forced to be nomadic because of the Alliance.

No, I'm going off their technological level and the importance placed on things in their society. Ancient Troll civilizations spent their time worshipping Loa, perfecting rituals, conquering and eating each other, and honing their abilities with voodoo, not stealing maths and sciences from a better, older civilization that had fallen on hard times and innovating infrastructure and political conventions.

I'll bite though. Do you want to look up the literacy rate for Rome?
Or Italy in the renaissance? Or England in the Industrial Revolution?

[Xilurm]

I really hope the Dark Ranger customizations are extensive and not just "now you get red eyes! its just like how night elves got black eyes!"

The what? I don't think that's confirmed though.

[rhorle]

Seems like those wouldn't be very effective if his fellow trolls couldn't read them.

Again. So a few trolls being able to read means all trolls can automatically read? Everyone still has to learn and it is possible for people not to learn something.

[Shadochi]

I don't know how "combining" the awful and forced choices would make any better, instead of simple allowing other options like dragons do

Because it would be a whole lot of work to fit new customizations to every race probably. And some of them might just look plain dumb with them.

As I said the forms don't represent a "belf with dragon stuff" in lore specifically, just a more mortal like humanoid form that holds aspects of the Dracthyr's true form.

Also Dracthyr aren't the same as dragons, so makes sense they cant do the same. Until we see a Dracthyr NPC of a specific race IMO it means they can't be too picky about their visage. Because while the current visages look like a blood elf, they can't actually be a belf like true dragons can

[Syegfryed]

Man, you are so insanely salty about whole Dracthyr ordeal, it's amazing. Once again taking lore and story of a video game way too serious.

If you didn't notice we are talking about trolls here.

People like to think just because they, tauren orcs, or other races who are not human-ish with their kingdoms and blablabla, are supposed to be uncivilized

The same biased and racist argument that make the authors of the book put an blood elf to teach a troll how to read and write his own language

Well, maybe the writers didn't even trolls have a unique language to begin with

If you are not pleased about my comments you are free to use the ignore function, instead of "stating" that all the time you know?

[Alexjimithing]

Abundance of reading material? You know, the thing that directly correlates with the literacy of a society. The reason why you can directly trace jumps in literacy rate to innovations in the easy of producing reading material.

Like if you want to pretend that the Stormwind people who learn to fight in and around an abbey where many of the rooms are stuffed full of bookshelves, and the Echo Isles people who learn to fight in and around... maybe a few scrolls? are going to have similar levels of literacy in their two societies, be my guest. But that completely defies all logic.

So in video games if a race’s home city isn’t surrounded by books you just assume illiteracy, regardless of pre-existing lore and the context of why the home city is the way it is.

Uh huh. Yeah. Sounds good.

[Makabreska]

If you didn't notice we are talking about trolls here.
If you are not pleased about my comments you are free to use the ignore function, instead of "stating" that all the time you know?

If you are not human or elf looking, or if you have a tribal lifestyle you obvious are uncivilized in wow, thats the rule. /s

But you can only chose to be a blood elf male or a human female
And they basically confirm no tuskarr allied race, lame, i expected that, if isn't an elf reskin isn't going to be ingame.

Talking about trolls intensifies. You as well could chill the fuck out and stop taking Blizz design choices so personal and act all insulted about them. Designing the game is all about the choice. Why DH's and not Wardens? Why Castle Nathria and not Drust raid? Blizz picks what they think fits, what they think they can do in given time and what they think is popular. And taking their decisions so damn personal is childish and reeks off entitlement.

[Syegfryed]

Because it would be a whole lot of work to fit new customizations to every race probably. And some of them might just look plain dumb with them.

If we are going into "not adding things because they look dumb" this race would not exist in the first place.

Maybe it would take a lot of less work if they didn't expend the budget making different pointless combinations of haircolors? either way, adding some painted scales and horns should not be a big of a deal since wow isn't an indie company.

And, they could simple allow the options without the customizations, people would be perfectly fine with that, or just add the options later as expansions go.

As I said the forms don't represent a "belf with dragon stuff" in lore specifically, just a more mortal like humanoid form that holds aspects of the Dracthyr's true form.

Assume the form of a humanoid for visage, thats the stuff, you can't represent "something that doesn't exist" that Coincidentally look like an elf or a human

Also Dracthyr aren't the same as dragons, so makes sense they cant do the same. Until we see a Dracthyr NPC of a specific race IMO it means they can't be too picky about their visage. Because while the current visages look like a blood elf, they can't actually be a belf like true dragons can

they have the power of all dragonflights, and can assume a mortal visage just like then, they even have the same ceremony, it makes no sense that, coincidentally, they can only assume one form, and coincidentally its an elf/human hybrid

- - - Updated - - -

Talking about trolls intensifies. You as well could chill the fuck out and stop taking Blizz design choices so personal and act all insulted about them.

right? two different posts talking about two different posts?


And how are you to say what i should or should not do? lol, now i have to consult you if i should talk about something.

[wowrefugee]

The what? I don't think that's confirmed though.

People in here interpreted Danuser's answer in the Spaces as being subtle confirmation of 9.2.5. dark ranger customizations.

[Raetary]

They should've used the interactions in the book to establish some cultural exchange between the characters.

Instead of portraying Zekhan like they did, they could've had him learn a bit of Thalassian instead and had him teach Lor'themar some Zandali words and phrases in turn.

[Hitei]

So in video games if a race’s home city isn’t surrounded by books you just assume illiteracy, regardless of pre-existing lore and the context of why the home city is the way it is.

Uh huh. Yeah. Sounds good.

If a video game takes place in a time period where reading and writing are the exception, not the norm, and a society appears to give absolutely no shit about texts, then yes. I assume illiteracy, why would you not? If you see a race's landlocked city that has no boats, and few if any fishing poles or nets, do you assume that everyone in that race is competent at fishing?

Go ahead and quote me the lore saying the average/majority of Darkspear trolls are literate. Or any race's citizens besides maybe gnomes, pandaren, dalaran humans, goblins, blood elves and dwarves.

How are these random farmers and fighters of yours finding time and teacher to learn to read and write and pick up terms like "erosion"?

[Makabreska]

And how are you to say what i should or should not do? lol, now i have to consult you if i should talk about something.

I mean, we have here Tinker fixated people, Void fixated people, world revamp fixated people and many more. I think we can fit an anti-elf fixated guy. If this is your idea of posting for the next few months, waiting for some more Dracthyr development and immediately jumping in, fuming about their visage race pick and acting like it personally insults you, then so be it. Just one more attraction of MMO-C speculation thread.