1. #57961
    Herald of the Titans Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    The difference between Shadowlands and K'aresh is that people have wanted to go to K'aresh since TBC and the Ethereals are the most requested non-playable race.

    Meanwhile, no one cared about the Shadowlands until BfA started dropping heavy hints in 8.1 with the Vol'jin questline.

    Back in Legion, no one cared about Shadowlands (Helya wasn't associated to it back then, btw). Go back to the Legion forums and no one was talking about it, while you would probably come across many posts/threads asking for playable Ethereals.
    I surely cared more for the Shadowlands (which are actually awesome btw) than I do for boring K'aresh. I would rather get the propper realm of light and void than some random ruins.

  2. #57962
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    I surely cared more for the Shadowlands (which are actually awesome btw) than I do for boring K'aresh. I would rather get the propper realm of light and void than some random ruins.
    Of course you did, I had no doubt about it. Shadowlands are so awesooome batchest

  3. #57963
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    The difference between Shadowlands and K'aresh is that people have wanted to go to K'aresh since TBC and the Ethereals are the most requested non-playable race.

    Meanwhile, no one cared about the Shadowlands until BfA started dropping heavy hints in 8.1 with the Vol'jin questline.

    Back in Legion, no one cared about Shadowlands (Helya wasn't associated to it back then, btw). Go back to the Legion forums and no one was talking about it, while you would probably come across many posts/threads asking for playable Ethereals.
    Pretty sure players have talked about the Shadowlands ever since WotLK actually, so not really that far off from K'aresh.

    Besides, the problem with K'aresh and other cosmic expansions like that isn't really whether players want them or not but whether players engage with it when it's out, and this tends to require a good mix of elements they know alongside new stuff. Shadowlands had far too little focus on stuff we knew so it fell flat, and while you could have K'aresh as a interstellar roadtrip it's still more alien than even Argus, and that was just a single patch.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  4. #57964
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Pretty sure players have talked about the Shadowlands ever since WotLK actually, so not really that far off from K'aresh.
    Nope, I was very active on the Official forums back then in Legion and no one talked about it.

    Besides, back then, the Shadowlands were depicted as just a ghostly version of Azeroth and/or some endless dark forest.

    it's still more alien than even Argus
    People loved patch 7.3.

  5. #57965
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Nope, I was very active on the Official forums back then in Legion and no one talked about it.

    Besides, back then, the Shadowlands were depicted as just a ghostly version of Azeroth and/or some endless dark forest.



    People loved patch 7.3.
    Players loved parts of Argus, mostly I remember players disliked how you had two of the samey black and green zones everyone was already tired of.

    And beyond that I think players liked it because it was a patch. They didn't need to spend too much time there compared to Shadowlands where you spend two years growing progressively more bored of it.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  6. #57966
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    A revamp makes sense because you need somewhere to spend the expansion, and now that the Dragon Isles are used there isn't really anywhere obvious for the next expansion to take place. You would do the same things you do in s normal expansion, just with a world revamp instead of an entirely new continent conjured from the ether.
    They can do that with out a world revamp though. Just do a few zones for the expansion like with Cataclysm and not the full revamp. There is no reason to revamp zones outside of expansion leveling and end game. Everything is essentially conjured from the ether even a world revamp. Because they are creating the "threat" or story from nothing to justify whatever.

    A revamp or a new continent/zone is just the same thing.
    Last edited by rhorle; 2022-06-02 at 01:00 PM.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  7. #57967
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Is there anything wrong with a Light/Void/Space theme, btw?
    Huh? Light / Void / Space doesn't fit a world revamp narrative, that was my point. I understand the wish for a world revamp and I was totally on board, but anyone who thinks we're getting one - after Dragonflight doesn't revamp sh*t - is delusional, sorry. This was their last and most likely chance to do it. They don't. Give up the dream, another world revamp is never going to happen.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  8. #57968
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Huh? Light / Void / Space doesn't fit a world revamp narrative, that was my point.
    Why couldn't it? I think a cata style revamp will never happen but there is nothing saying that void, light, and space are themes that can't exist for an "end-game" revamp. The void could take over zones. The Light could take over zones. A cosmic/space threat could take over zones. For example we could have the Alt-Light take over some zones and we have to fight them off for the expansion. Or we could have Void Lords land on the planet and corrupt some zones.

    Any theme works with a revamp because that is the entire point of a revamp, right? To create something new. Not to mention Old Gods are void-related so we could just have yet another old god threat.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  9. #57969
    Over 9000! Lahis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Is there anything wrong with a Light/Void/Space theme, btw?

    It seems like a natural expansion setting that has been set up at least since 7.3, which, as a reminder, the community loved.

    Sargeras was terrified of the Void Lords.
    Alleria and Turalyon, who returned from Argus, now lead the Alliance.
    Locus-Walker, first met in Mac'aree, remains a major player aligned with Alleria's Ren'dorei. In Mac'aree, a band of evil Etherals worshippers of the Void is discovered.
    Xal'atath's whereabouts are still unknown.

    It seems like a natural setting for an expansion.
    Light/Void/Space expansion will come someday, but after shitty reception Shadowlands they are taking long break from cosmic anime escalation bullshit

  10. #57970
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Huh? Light / Void / Space doesn't fit a world revamp narrative, that was my point. I understand the wish for a world revamp and I was totally on board, but anyone who thinks we're getting one - after Dragonflight doesn't revamp sh*t - is delusional, sorry. This was their last and most likely chance to do it. They don't. Give up the dream, another world revamp is never going to happen.
    Obviously, I'm not saying World Revamp expansion would be the same as K'aresh expansion.

    I'm just saying that I am expecting the reception of a K'aresh expansion with playable Ethereal to be very good, much better than the reception that Shadowlands got for sure.

    The community loves the Void and Ethereals.

  11. #57971
    Herald of the Titans Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Obviously, I'm not saying World Revamp expansion would be the same as K'aresh expansion.

    I'm just saying that I am expecting the reception of a K'aresh expansion with playable Ethereal to be very good, much better than the reception that Shadowlands got for sure.

    The community loves the Void and Ethereals.
    Yeah sure, mummies that don't have any customization options will surely be loved. I think the community would rather get Brokers than Ethereals at this point, they are far cooler anyways.

    Also, after BfA no one wants another void expansion soon, and after Shadowlands people would rather get more azeroth stuff anyways.

  12. #57972
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    They can do that with out a world revamp though. Just do a few zones for the expansion like with Cataclysm and not the full revamp. There is no reason to revamp zones outside of expansion leveling and end game. Everything is essentially conjured from the ether even a world revamp. Because they are creating the "threat" or story from nothing to justify whatever.

    A revamp or a new continent/zone is just the same thing.
    You cannot realistically just create new zone that were always there to begin with unless you want to make them islands, at which point it becomes more of a South seas island exploration deal.

    Point is that even creating new zones is just a stalling tactic compared to just taking a preestablished continent, slapping a fresh new cost of paint, continuing the storylines that you already had, and then have the expansion in that revamped continent.

    Pirates will be just as relevant on Ogrezonia as they would be in Stranglethorn, and with the latter you have preestablished character and places players already enjoy like Zul'gurub. The only difference at that point is just whether you want the shiniest newest toy at all times, or whether you want practically new zones with some extra nostalgia sprinkled on top.

    And of course there are storylines that cannot really be done outside EK and Kalimdor that should be resolved. Cant for instance imagine a Gilneas reclamation storyline working that well from the Undermine, no matter how many Worgen settlers you place there.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    Yeah sure, mummies that don't have any customization options will surely be loved. I think the community would rather get Brokers than Ethereals at this point, they are far cooler anyways.

    Also, after BfA no one wants another void expansion soon, and after Shadowlands people would rather get more azeroth stuff anyways.
    Can we take this time to acknowledge how pointless it was to differentiate Brokers and Ethereals? They both do the same thing, and both seem fully capable of teleporting both into and out of the Shadowlands with no issue whatsoever. You could have had all Brokers in Shadowlands replaced with Ethereals and it would have meant squat in terms of flow.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  13. #57973
    The Lightbringer Nymrohd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Can we take this time to acknowledge how pointless it was to differentiate Brokers and Ethereals? They both do the same thing, and both seem fully capable of teleporting both into and out of the Shadowlands with no issue whatsoever. You could have had all Brokers in Shadowlands replaced with Ethereals and it would have meant squat in terms of flow.
    We'd also have avoided the tired culture trope of the middle eastern merchant.

  14. #57974
    Over 9000! Lahis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Can we take this time to acknowledge how pointless it was to differentiate Brokers and Ethereals? They both do the same thing, and both seem fully capable of teleporting both into and out of the Shadowlands with no issue whatsoever. You could have had all Brokers in Shadowlands replaced with Ethereals and it would have meant squat in terms of flow.
    When have Ethereals teleported into the Shadowlands?

  15. #57975
    Reforged Gone Wrong The Stormbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I think Monks have several unique animations? So maybe the races need to have those animations added first?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    Goblins and Lightforged should have them already I think - not so sure about Worgens tbh.
    I'm sure this has been addressed, but every playable race has Monk animations. The reason being, there are toys and potions that can transform you into other races.

  16. #57976
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    You cannot realistically just create new zone that were always there to begin with unless you want to make them islands, at which point it becomes more of a South seas island exploration deal.
    Twilight Highlands? Uldum? Mt. Hyjal? Slapping a fresh coat of paint on existing zones is the same thing as creating a new zone because you are creating a new zone. They don't need to revamp the world in order to zones for an expansion because we've already seen them do so for Darkshore, Arathi Highlands, and Vale of Eternal Blossoms. Where they revamp just what is needed for the story.

    There is no real story line to continue in existing zones.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  17. #57977
    Quote Originally Posted by Lahis View Post
    When have Ethereals teleported into the Shadowlands?
    Actually that is a good point, might have been imagining some stuff.

    Still, the only reason to have Brokers at all seemed to be that they wanted Ethereals that were unique to the Shadowlands, but we see quite clearly that they are fully capable of leaving without issue, so you could have just replaced them with Ethereals who travel into the Shadowlands and nothing changes.
    Would have even given some nice Ethereal lore when we get Ethereal themed Tazavesh.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  18. #57978
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    Yeah sure, mummies that don't have any customization options will surely be loved. I think the community would rather get Brokers than Ethereals at this point, they are far cooler anyways.

    Also, after BfA no one wants another void expansion soon, and after Shadowlands people would rather get more azeroth stuff anyways.
    I mean, just copy paste an image of Sylvanas on their mummy head and Blizzard's already got at least one guy who will main ethereal.

  19. #57979
    Scarab Lord Wangming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Stormbringer View Post
    I'm sure this has been addressed, but every playable race has Monk animations. The reason being, there are toys and potions that can transform you into other races.
    You can get inflicted by the worgen curse and transform temporarily in Duskwood. Does not stop you from using Monk animations.

  20. #57980
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Twilight Highlands? Uldum? Mt. Hyjal? Slapping a fresh coat of paint on existing zones is the same thing as creating a new zone because you are creating a new zone. They don't need to revamp the world in order to zones for an expansion because we've already seen them do so for Darkshore, Arathi Highlands, and Vale of Eternal Blossoms. Where they revamp just what is needed for the story.

    There is no real story line to continue in existing zones.
    Then you have to consider that disconnected zones never seem to work for WoW, so you combine the zones.

    And hey presto you have a world revamp. You go to a revamped version of Searing Gorge where you fight Dark Iron Dwarf rebels instead of just regular Dark Iron Dwarves and generally have a good time in zones you enjoy.

    Uldum and Hyjal, and to a lesser extent Twilight Highlands already existed on the map back in Vanilla, so you didn't have to stretch as far to say why you never visited these areas.
    Now there are not really any areas like that. You could have islands, but that is just again not really solving anything compared to reusing old zones, giving them the Darkshore or Arathi treatment, and then using them as practically new zones.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

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