1. #58201
    Fluffy Parrot Marlamin's Avatar
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    Also, a note in general, with influencers still repeatedly talking about stuff without giving or bothering to figure out any context and making statements that can be interpreted in many ways (e.g. "many new skin files added"), don't let that kind of stuff hit the "hype centers" of the brain.

    Do your due diligence before talking about it/spreading it, and if you don't know how to, wait for others to do so before generating/spreading hype around something you don't actually understand. Would save quite a few people from getting hyped up over nothing, which happens far too often in here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    Mhm weird. Is that change for all levels of graphics or just for lower ones? Like, have they ever nerfed graphics before??
    This is an extremely common thing that happens pretty much every time they touch a model that doesn't have these files/level of detail levels generated yet (like these models which haven't been touched since they were added in 8.1). Not something that really affects anything in the end unless they messed with the original model, calling it "nerfed graphics" is vastly misinterpreting what happened.

  2. #58202
    Scarab Lord TriHard's Avatar
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    I'm not caught up but is something cool happening or are people just discussing random stuff now?

  3. #58203
    Pre-order Evoker would be my pipe dream, but I know I've said (Maybe in this thread as well) I can't see it happening with a playerbase so obsessed with the meta and blizzard trying so hard to push M+ seasons as an Esport, a new class into the mix, much less one thrown in as a hail mary with no public testing, would be too much of a shakeup and cause too much chaos.
    Last edited by Veluren; 2022-06-07 at 12:32 AM.

  4. #58204
    Yeah, they're 10.0 at the earliest it seems, which I suppose is 6-10 months away?

  5. #58205
    Quote Originally Posted by Veluren View Post
    Pre-order Evoker would be my pipe dream, but I know I've said (Maybe in this thread as well) I can't see it happening with a playerbase so obsessed with the meta and blizzard trying so hard to push M+ seasons as an Esport, a new class into the mix, much less one thrown in as a hail mary with no public testing, would be too much of a shakeup and cause too much chaos.
    They would need to design talents for them which wouldn't be worth it since they would only be used for around 4-6 months, assuming they came out in Season 4. The time to design those talents, figuring out the scaling and tier sets, just for season 4, would be better spent developing them for Dragonflight.

  6. #58206
    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    Is it though? There are a lot of raid fights where you certainly dont need interrupts on everyone.
    But don't you remember all the interrupts and CC on shriekwing

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Arafal View Post
    Sure gonna be fun to run a keystone with people who didn't pick their interrupt.
    If people don't have the interrupt they either
    1. Forgot to swap talent builds
    OR
    2. Should get kicked

    - - - Updated - - -

    We will get evoker in 10.0 as part of pre-order bonus
    Even that won't happen for another 6 months minimum

  7. #58207
    There is no way that Evoker or Dracthyr are coming before 10.0. They will most likely sell it as a preorder bonus, dressed up as ‘Early Access to Dracthyr *when 10.0 hits’. Remember just because they will go live with 10.0, doesn’t mean everyone gets access to them, you still have to buy Dragonflight, so prepatch will give early access to those who preorder before the release date.

    This was the same case with Demon Hunters in Legion and I see no reason why they would change that for Evokers.

    Besides the obvious fact that it is entirely pointless for them to work on a temporary talent system which will be changed anyway.

    When preorders do go live, I highly expect the only ‘features’ we get are some transmog, a mount and maybe a cool hearthstone effect, just like we had for Shadowlands.

    I think this time around, season 4 is meant to give us the extra ‘fun bit of content’ to tide us over to 10.0.

    I would expect we get a release date reveal in August around Gamescom and then preorders go live along with the start of season 4.

    I reckon in these coming weeks around the typical ‘E3 time’ is when we will see Alpha. But first we need to see the new talents for each class. Was hoping to see two more yesterday but they don’t usually post ‘news’ on a Monday. So I expect to see more talents this week and once they are all out, we get alpha.

    But also this is all speculation, so who knows what they might do.

  8. #58208
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    We aren't losing anything from not having a full world revamp.
    We're losing Azeroth world-building, lore development behind most playable races, the usability of those places when it fits current expansion lore, all the stuff that happened in books and on ingame texts since Cataclysm, possible new battlegrounds, new incursions from old enemies, new NPC factions, new cities/villages, old enemy factions like Scarlet Crusade/Scourge/Twilight Hammer/Bloodsail Buccaneers/Grimtotem/ and even the Burning Legion.

    You fail to see how good would be to see smalls hubs of every playable race spread across Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms, Vulpera caravans in the Barrens to Tanaris, Gadgetzan revamped into a neutral city, Nightborne settlement in Azshara, Mag'har Iron Horde machinery, Gilneas as a city, a new World Tree for Night Elves, Lordaeron city as the main hub for the Forsaken, Quel'thalas restored, Exodar rebuilt as a proper Draenei city, Draenei/Lightforged machinery, Alterac Mountain and its kingdom rebuilt as a new hostile zone, Plaguelands cleansed, new Zandalari harbors in Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms, Drust incursions in Duskwood, feral Worgen in Kalimdor, Pandaren farms in Westfall and the Barrens, Void Elf hubs replacing the old High Elf ones, Kul'tirans taking control of Southshore/Menethil Harbor, Highmountain settlements in Stonetalon Peak/Mount Hyjal, Gnomeragan restored with the help of Mechagnomes, Arakkoa/Ethereals in Azeroth.

    The list goes on, it's a shame that instead of a World Revamp we'll keep going to alien places such as Zerethi Mortis, while a vast and majestic world rots with the lack of creativity from Blizzard.

    Not to mention that everything I suggested above already has assets ready to use from recent expansions, unlike a new expansion where they need to make nearly everything from scratch.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    The moment they do a revamp all of your problems start building again because they can't do one every expansion.
    The problem will not start again anytime soon if they make an evergreen revamp, bringing the world back to Vanilla standards with local threats and lore about the zone instead of a major threat destroying everything. Not to mention the graphical revamp. WoW hasn't changed much graphically speaking since Mists of Pandaria (2012). Look at this comparison:







    A revamp now, graphically speaking, would last until the game's shutdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Not to mention all of the things you list as problems didn't even get addressed with Cataclysm the last time they did a revamp and you want them to do even more while still providing enough content for end-game.
    This time around they need to make the revamped zones the end-game zones and only add new raids and dungeons on top of it, Cataclysm failed because Blizzard revamped thousands of quests, many old zones, and on top of that, five completely new zones with hundreds of new quests.
    Back to Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms!

  9. #58209
    We still didn't hear about improved legos in season 4. I guess that is at least one thing that's in those ptr patches.

  10. #58210
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    The list goes on, it's a shame that instead of a World Revamp we'll keep going to alien places such as Zerethi Mortis, while a vast and majestic world rots with the lack of creativity from Blizzard.
    So you haven't heard about the next expansion taking place on the Dragon Isles I take it? What you want unrealistic for any game and proven to be unrealistic for Blizzard. They can't keep updating old zones to make them "living" that keep up with the story and stuff. At some point it would go back to the way it is now post-cataclysm revamp. You again ignore how a world revamp is wasted resources when we have Chromie time that doesn't even require players to visit those zones. Making the revamped zones end-game zones won't be a full world revamp. It is impossible to do what you want in just one expansion of end-game zones. If you tackle it in multiple expansions then all of the problems you say exists now start all over again.

    It is also silly to think that a full world revamp wouldn't require new assets to be created. Even more so when it is the focus of end-game zones. You can't just copy and paste the last few expansions assets and get what you claim you want. Lol.

    As for graphical quality. MoP required a 2004(minimum) and a 2007 (recommended) . Shadowlands requires a 2013 (minimum) and a 2016 (recommended). You can compare landscape shots all you want but the graphical quality has improved over the years just by the change in system specifications for graphics cards. It also indicates that any graphical revamp wouldn't last until the game shuts down. Because only a fool thinks it will shut down any time soon.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  11. #58211
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    The World that you want revamped isn't even the default starting experience for new players.
    And the only reason behind it is because Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms, are terribly outdated graphically speaking.

    And NO, it has nothing to do with lore continuity, as new players will be directed to Zandalar/Kul'tiras in Dragonflight and then to Dragon Isles, without even stepping in Shadowlands.
    Back to Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms!

  12. #58212
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    And the only reason behind it is because Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms, are terribly outdated graphically speaking.
    Wrong. Blizzard has said that it has nothing to do with graphics but with the mechanics and quest design. They want new players to have a modern experience that reflects how the latest expansion will play when those players get to level cap. It doesn't matter anyways because no matter the reasons it is pointless to do a cata style revamp for optional zones.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  13. #58213
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    As for graphical quality. MoP required a 2004(minimum) and a 2007 (recommended) . Shadowlands requires a 2013 (minimum) and a 2016 (recommended). You can compare landscape shots all you want but the graphical quality has improved over the years just by the change in system specifications for graphics cards. It also indicates that any graphical revamp wouldn't last until the game shuts down. Because only a fool thinks it will shut down any time soon.
    Okay, now you're posting in bad faith, my point isn't that we hadn't graphical updates since Mists of Pandaria, but the fact that they're less noticeable nowadays because WoW is reaching the graphical limit of its engine.

    For instance one of the new Dragonflight zones (10.0) looks pretty close to Gorgrond (6.0), two zones that are nearly ten years apart from each other.



    But let's compare Alterac Mountains, a place that had a texture resolution uplift in Cataclysm, with Kun-lai and Drustvar:



    2012 VS 2018 VS 2004 (2010 Remaster)

    There's a HUGE gap between Alterac compared with the other two.
    Back to Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms!

  14. #58214
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    Okay, now you're posting in bad faith, my point isn't that we hadn't graphical updates since Mists of Pandaria, but the fact that they're less noticeable nowadays because WoW is reaching the graphical limit of its engine.
    It isn't reaching any limit of its engine. Blizzard has overhauled it over the years and can do so again when needed. I'm not arguing in bad faith just because I don't agree with your claims.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  15. #58215
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Blizzard has said that it has nothing to do with graphics but with the mechanics and quest design.
    Sure...

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    They want new players to have a modern experience
    Obviously a "modern experience" doesn't include better graphics.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    It isn't reaching any limit of its engine. Blizzard has overhauled it over the years and can do so again when needed. I'm not arguing in bad faith just because I don't agree with your claims.
    You're not even reading my posts. I'm giving graphical comparisons that you refuse to acknowledge.
    Back to Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms!

  16. #58216
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    Obviously a "modern experience" doesn't include better graphics.
    Better graphics are included by default because of it being a recent expansion. For one that keeps doing comparison I didn't think that was something that had to be pointed out.

    You're not even reading my posts. I'm giving graphical comparisons that you refuse to acknowledge.
    Which have nothing to do with the graphical limitations of the engine or WoW nearing its maximum lifetime quality. I've read your posts. I don't need to line by line address everything to know that your comparisons don't mean what you think they mean.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  17. #58217
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Better graphics are included by default because of it being a recent expansion. For one that keeps doing comparison I didn't think that was something that had to be pointed out.
    Yeah, I wonder why they didn't keep the 2004 graphics until now, since the new player doesn't care about it. I mean, people never asked for player character models revamp or anything. It's really weird.

    Btw, talking about player models there's an interesting line from Chris Robinson about the "limitless" WoW engine, at 10:53 of the WOD Art panel.



    Anyway, I'm not going to derail this thread further, other people will see these comments and they can judge by themselves what they wanna believe in.
    Last edited by Luck4; 2022-06-07 at 07:00 AM.
    Back to Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms!

  18. #58218
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    Yeah, I wonder why they didn't keep the 2004 graphics until now, since the new player doesn't care about it. I mean, people never asked for player character models revamp or anything. It's really weird.
    Did I ever say that new players don't care about graphics? Or that people haven't asked for better graphics? Stop arguing in bad faith. Your own video proves that Blizzard has upgraded the engine over the years because the Pandaren model is no longer the limit to what they can do. Drac'Thyr wouldn't have been possible in the 2013 engine Chris Robinson is speaking about. Lmao.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  19. #58219
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Did I ever say that new players don't care about graphics? Or that people haven't asked for better graphics? Stop arguing in bad faith. Your own video proves that Blizzard has upgraded the engine over the years because the Pandaren model is no longer the limit to what they can do. Drac'Thyr wouldn't have been possible in the 2013 engine Chris Robinson is speaking about.
    Dracthyr humanoid forms are literally just male elves and human females from 2015...
    Back to Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms!

  20. #58220
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luck4 View Post
    Dracthyr humanoid forms are literally just male elves and human females from 2015...
    I'm going to point out the obvious that I wasn't talking just about their humanoid forms. However the customization options were not possible in the 2013 engine you again point out how the engine has been updated over time to better handle graphics among other things. So it again reinforces that your claim that WoW has a limit to lifetime graphical upgrades is bogus.

    As long as Blizzard wants to update the engine they will continue to do so. Their ambition is the only limit.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

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