Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[tumbleweed010]

As always I do think the fact they communicated so confidently that this expansion was further along than usual it is pretty hilarious to see the actual timeframes completely differ.

And they probably aren't lying when they said that. Which means how far they're normally along when they announce an expansion is quite telling about internal standards for the product and why the last few expansions have turned out how they did.

Also, more m+ rewards. Seriously, for a mode that is pushed so hard by blizz, it has zero cool things to get. The mounts are fine until they just release it 5x over and over again.

Easiest win is aligning M+ rewards similar to PvP, where Valor can buy you gear with higher ratings allowing you to buy/receive recolored tier with specific stats.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Did you really just fall for that? I thought that "in February new scandal" was a dead giveaway.

I sensed something was wrong with the statement but I couldn't tell for sure. Besides people be cray cray.

[manypillars]

The PTR is now giving the Shadowlands introductory quests to accounts without the expansion, which is mildly interesting.
If this has already been mentioned, sorry! Haven't kept up enough with the thread or looked at the PTR recently.

[Dracullus]

The PTR is now giving the Shadowlands introductory quests to accounts without the expansion, which is mildly interesting.
If this has already been mentioned, sorry! Haven't kept up enough with the thread or looked at the PTR recently.

Wait a minute, in the past you had to buy expansion to test current patches on PTR?

[manypillars]

Wait a minute, in the past you had to buy expansion to test current patches on PTR?

I logged in using a character that had been on the PTR for a few months and was offered the quest in a pop up. If the quest had been previously offered, it should have just already been in the log. My memory is shoddy because I don't look at the PTR often, but I do not remember getting the Shadowlands intro quest before.

I think the characters were there to look at the new barber shop and customization options.

[Skildar]

This is why its so lame they pretty much abandoned the heritage armors in SLs. Custom fitting armor is one of the only ways we can get really unique armor without extensive clipping and other weirdness.

If anything I hope we move beyond just having 1 set per race. Their should be multiple with heritage sets.

The game is still working with the same robe model since its debut... It's been a while that the gear visuals are bad because of this. They've been fiddling with new armor models since wod (where we've seen gear using game physx) but nothing major ever since... a real disgrace

They're probably fighting with their engine upgrades so that we get good retrocompatibility when mixing new and old gear but honestly... nobody would have cried if we got the original long kul tiran cloak.

And with every new expansion reveal I'm expecting a change that will most likely never come T.T

[Revamp Man]

So I just looked up the leveling route in DF for new players.
SL was a filler expansion in every way and so many people denied that
The only thing the expansion has done is finish the hunt for Sylvanas

[rhorle]

So I just looked up the leveling route in DF for new players.
SL was a filler expansion in every way and so many people denied that
The only thing the expansion has done is finish the hunt for Sylvanas

Filler is only ever brought up because people just want to be negative about an expansion. It is silly. All expansions can be filler and boiled down to "only for X". It is silly. Shadowlands wasn't filler and we've already seen impacts beyond just Sylvanas. The cleansing of Lordaeron for example. A new seed being kept by the heir to the green flight. An aspect bound to a new location.

There are plenty of things from Shadowlands that can continue forward if Blizzard decides to pull on those threads. Just like any other expansion. Just because Blizzard puts new players into BfA over Shadowlands doesn't mean it was filler. If you think about it there are some clear reasons why it might not work out so well given how integral covenants are. Then there is Torghast. It could be way to easy to level and not a great experience for truly new players. Leveling in the post-60 zones might not work out to well if there isn't anyone else around to group for rares for example.

[Revamp Man]

Filler is only ever brought up because people just want to be negative about an expansion. It is silly. All expansions can be filler and boiled down to "only for X". It is silly. Shadowlands wasn't filler and we've already seen impacts beyond just Sylvanas. The cleansing of Lordaeron for example. A new seed being kept by the heir to the green flight. An aspect bound to a new location.

There are plenty of things from Shadowlands that can continue forward if Blizzard decides to pull on those threads. Just like any other expansion. Just because Blizzard puts new players into BfA over Shadowlands doesn't mean it was filler. If you think about it there are some clear reasons why it might not work out so well given how integral covenants are. Then there is Torghast. It could be way to easy to level and not a great experience for truly new players. Leveling in the post-60 zones might not work out to well if there isn't anyone else around to group for rares for example.

You can level without covenants and I know this because you do now
The cleansing of lordaeron is more connected to BfA stories than SL
No SL just means explaining what happened to Sylvanas
We got no new allies
We technically got the LK back

[Skildar]

So I just looked up the leveling route in DF for new players.
SL was a filler expansion in every way and so many people denied that
The only thing the expansion has done is finish the hunt for Sylvanas

sure the expansion redefining the cosmos balance is filler

[Aeluron Lightsong]

We technically got the LK back

Not really, we have Bolvar Fordragon back but he isn't the Lich King anymore.

We got no new allies

This is not a good reason to call SL Filler

No SL just means explaining what happened to Sylvanas

...Just what is even is this argument, also how are you going to explain the weird magic Sylvanas used to kill Saurfang just leave it there for no reason? Like come on

The cleansing of lordaeron is more connected to BfA stories than SL

Except that they had to go to Maldraxxus to get help about the Plague, No SL wouldn't have that.

You can level without covenants and I know this because you do now

Again not really a reason to call SL filler.


Im so far away from being convinced SL is filler, like you didn't even try.

[rhorle]

You can level without covenants and I know this because you do now

Chromie time makes a person level through the entire expansion which includes the post-60 stuff. So a new player would need to join a covenant at some point. The cleansing of Lordaeron involves the Shadowlands. Shadowlands does more then just explain what happened to Sylvanas. We did get new allies. The eternal ones, the covenants, and the brokers. We didn't get the Lich King back as the helm of domination is gone. A new helm was forged but it doesn't control the scourge. Vol'jin is also a Loa/wild-god which could play into future events as he is a famous/popular lore figure.

There are plenty of hooks for Blizzard to draw on. It is no more filler then any previous expansion that didn't see much of their story or features carry forwards. Like I said filler is just a way to attack the game/Blizzard with out needing to have much of an argument. It is and always will be a silly label.

For example Cataclysm was filler because it existed for a reason the mists dropped around Pandaria and the Zandalari looked for the Thunder King. Mists was filler because it was used to power up the time artifact to enable WoD. WoD was filler because it enabled Alt-Gul'dan to summon the Legion. Legion was filler because it caused Azerite to appear. BfA was filler because it created the story to get to Shadowlands. And now Shadowlands is apparently filler as well. It is a silly term to use.

[huth]

The game is still working with the same robe model since its debut... It's been a while that the gear visuals are bad because of this. They've been fiddling with new armor models since wod (where we've seen gear using game physx) but nothing major ever since... a real disgrace

Robes are tied to character model, so nobody is using the original anymore. That went away when old models did. They can't change it to much or old robes won't draw right, though.

[Hitei]

So I just looked up the leveling route in DF for new players.

BfA is the new player route because BfA is a modern expansion that requires zero explanation to go straight into. You show up in Stormwind/Org from Exile's Reach, the leaders are talking about being at war with the opposite faction and you get sent to go recruit a navy to help in the ongoing war. Everything on Zandalar or Kul Tiras is explained ON Zandalar or Kul Tiras, and it is a fairly "normal" questing experience, fighting pirates, trolls, beasts etc.

It wasn't changed to Shadowlands because SL is an expansion that is entirely about finishing up long running stories. To even understand the basic into for Shadowlands, you have to already know about the 4th war, and who Sylvanas is and what she's done, and then you have to know who Bolvar and the Knights of the Ebon Blade is, and the significance of the helm of domination, and what the Shadowlands even are. Then you have to understand who Jaina, Anduin, Baine and Thrall , as well as who Helya is for the Maw intro to be cohesive. Along the questing you meet a bunch of people who only hold value if you understand who they already are (Uther, Vashj, Draka, Alexandros, etc.) including some elements requiring you to have already palyed through entire zones in other expansions, like Ysera's whole thing with being corrupted by the Nightmare and then attacking the temple of Elune and being killed.

If you drop a new player into Shadowlands they go from being shipwrecked on an island to being a soldier on a suicide mission into the world of the dead surrounded by characters they don't know talking about events they don't know, fighting for a high fantasy soul substance to rescue people they've never met before.

So it makes zero sense for it to be the new player route.

After Dragonflight, and feel free to screenshot this post. They will make the NPE: Exile's Reach -> Dragonflight -> Any new expansion. Because Dragonflight is true filler, disconnected from major ongoing plot points, a very traditional high fantasy expansion without any need for previous knowledge (because the whole thing is about learning about a place no ones been in 10,000 years rather than about an ongoing story). It meshes perfectly with being a new recruit: You did well on that island with those ogres, how would you like to help escort this team of researchers scouting some ancient land. It has the player fighting regular beasts and low end threats while still exploring cool ancient places (and will feature the more ZM style things to find and figure out design approach).

SL is one of the least filler expansions to date. Even putting aside its major impacts on lore (how dying works, how the cosmos was created and is organized) It's all about resolutions and finishing the faction war conflict that has been playing out since Wrath, and is direct story progression for a ton of characters.

[therumblings]

Honestly I could see them keeping Kultiras/Zandalar as the new player experience, it summarizes and encapsulates a lot about the two factions, Dragon Isles not so much. Unless they really really want to put the factions on the backburner going forward, which I can't see them doing even with cross faction being a thing.

Shadowlands however will never ever be part of the new player experience, it makes no sense at all for the first thing you do after landing in Stormwind or Orgrimmar is go to the afterlife.

[ExiHext]

I'm not entirely sure, but wasn't it already confirmed by the devs that BfA stays the new player experience? Or am I mixing things up?

[Hitei]

I'm not entirely sure, but wasn't it already confirmed by the devs that BfA stays the new player experience? Or am I mixing things up?

BfA is staying the NPE for Dragonflight, that doesn't mean it will continue to be forever. The farther we get from BfA the more its Horde vs Alliance setting doesn't mesh great with whatever comes after.

[Ersula]

So I just looked up the leveling route in DF for new players.
SL was a filler expansion in every way and so many people denied that
The only thing the expansion has done is finish the hunt for Sylvanas

By this logic, every expansion except BFA was apparently filler.

[Skildar]

Robes are tied to character model, so nobody is using the original anymore. That went away when old models did. They can't change it to much or old robes won't draw right, though.

Of course they can, It's just texture applied using markers. You have robes and pants using the exact same texture in the game.
The developers most likely don't have any real new coat/robe model because of clipping issues and placement issues for the many different positions your character can do (sitting, mounted, lying, etc.)

[Nyel]

sure the expansion redefining the cosmos balance is filler

It didn’t do any of that because pretty much everything can be ignored and doesn’t matter for Dragonflight (as of now). And I’m pretty sure it will be kept as this and pretty much nothing so lore-heavy to change the Warcraft cosmos that was established in Shadowlands will be used later on. Shadowlands is lore-wise WoD territory, completely neglectable for the ongoing future. Shadowlands lore mattered for Shadowlands and pretty much just that.