Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Skildar]

No, datamining is bad. How much datamining do you see of other major AAA games?

None.

We get trailers and maybe an occasional gameplay video which is very limited.

Its almost as if spoiling story and game environments isn't a good idea?

I'm pretty sure it happens for a lot of games using public testing environments. Now I'm not a big fan of datamining especially when it involves story bits or even whole campaigns...
But I see no harm in testing classes, mechanics, features, etc. It should mostly be carried by QA but on many businesses you will rely on canary deployment to ensure stability and quality of product.

[Chickat]

More like next month. They're gonna give LKC chance to be tested before everyone leaves to go test DF.

They cant afford to wait till next month. Unless you mean early July. If you mean this time next month, that's really bad.

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I mean this is kinda true. Raids, dungeons and open world zones are the bare minimum of content in every expansion and we get that. But besides that there is absolutely nothing in Dragonflight. There is no progression system, there is no additional type of content, there's just nothing. The last expansion that had this little stuff was WoD and we know how that ended.

People will be bored to death by reaching max level and having no further progression anymore besides getting a higher gear score. People will abandon Dragonflight faster than any expansion before by just how shallow and devoid of "new" types of content it is. I know some are praising the back to the roots approach and it's good for the game, but not when there is exactly zero progress anymore. I am sure people that welcome the less-is-more-approach now will hate it after 4 weeks of DF because of how incredibly boring the expansion will be when there's no progress at all.

I'm still amazed how they're trying to sh*t out this expansion within the next 5 months when there has been zero communication about it in the last two months. Why were they helding back information when they are so far ahead? Something's not right. For sure it helps that the talent trees are 99% copy and paste from what we have now and Dragonriding is just restricted flying with a nice coat, but 5 months from now on until launch? Good luck with that.

I honestly think they have no intention of releasing this year. The suits wanted pre-orders started and the devs will have to delay it to Q1 2023.

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WoD had nothing in it by later patches. Not at launch. Dragonflight is poised to set the base game up, which it should. Story, exploration, collector drive with Dragon Riding (Arguably this is the progression system since you need to train your dragon to reach new, higher areas in the zones). Dungeons and raiding to keep people busy. If the expansion patch is basic, they can push out the .X content patches faster, and we could always see new systems in those too.

Thats true.

WoD had garrisons and 1 daily fill the bar quest. Dungeons were worthless at launch. World content was light and useless. It was do garrison stuff or raid/pvp.

DF will have no bp like WoD, but will at least have M+ and world quests to help it along. There is virtually zero chance DF could be as bad as WoD.

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Yes and I already told you days and weeks ago. Instead of copying stuff like Dragonriding from other games they should rather copy their horizontal progression and improve that.

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What? WoD has exactly the same stuff going as Dragonflight: dungeons (with different difficulties), open world elite zones and raids. As of now Dragonflight offers exactly the same kind of content as WoD and nothing more. I didn't count Garrisons because they're trivial, but if you're counting Dragonriding as "content", so can we count Garrisons.

By the way, they never added a completely new progression system in a patch. They iterated on their previous expansion feature systems and improved / tweaked them, but they never went out and said "hey, here we have a completely new system for you that we kept away from the expansion feature list just because we could".

Nah, WoD had heroic dungeons and challenge mode dungeons. Neither were end game content. WoD had 1 daily fill the bar quest in an elite area and you were done. DF will at minimum still have World quests and Mythic+ dungeons, + not have the massive dev time drain that garrisons and new player models caused. DF has no chance of being as bad as WoD Like I said a sec ago.

[Bindanda]

Can't wait for November 22nd for DF to drop

Isnt that Thanksgiving week? When does that fall this year?

[Chickat]

I gave you one quite simple idea last week how they easily could keep progression going: you can still earn talent points at max level. It will take way more time and effort to get one, but you still can get them. So you can unlock more and more talents over time. Or you can earn things that add stacks to existing talents, e.g. giving talent A an additional stack so you can put two points into said talent. Now you work towards getting stacks for some (basic) talents and getting more skill points to unlock them. There you have an easy way to keep progression going on max level instead of earning nothing at all (besides new gear and new cosmetics). Because you can be sure that people will instantly complain about the lack of progression the minute they reach max level in Dragonflight.

They did mention the idea of that in an interview as well as sockets in the talent tree like the Relic slots on Artifact weapons. You could earn a boost relic to boost the power or effects of a talent. If Divine Storm is a talent, you could socket a relic in that gives it the wave effect where it shoots out in a cone dealing half damage again etc. No I'm not going to find where the info is from, I just remember it being mentioned in an interview. We will see if they end up doing something like that, but IMO its a good idea.

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I don't even consider it a full class at this point, it's a mini-class.
Two spec classes are mini classes, just because they get unique customizations / race options, doesn't change the fact that these are still classes that could've easily had a third spec.

Demon hunter isn't a class?

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Also, from the wotlk classic design:



Didn't we find datamining strings for a living world feature for retail? Maybe they are gonna add classic EK and Kalimdor to retail during Dragonflight if they follow the same design pillar? With WotlK classic serving as the initial testbed for it - maybe with a toggle for classic and wotlk Naxx?

NGL, I forgot about the living world thing. I wonder what that is? Some unannounced feature? Some kind of scenario world quest system where world quests lead into other world quests like in Gw2?

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Animation names are shared between all branches of WoW, Living World could just as well end up being a Classic thing (although I personally feel that's unlikely). On that note, there's also some new skinning specific animation names that showed up that haven't had a use either yet.

New feature. Aoe skinning. Twirl around like a ballerina skinning everything in your path.

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I think an example of what you mean is plaguefall. It exists but barely accessed for world content, so I'll give you that, you have a point there. But stuff like Freehold, Halls of Atonement and Upper mechagon? Packed with world content and visited almost daily, outside of the dungeon. And yes we do have less zones than we used to. They are also smaller in size. Especially Legion, where everything was cramped on top of that as well. Some empty space needs to exist. The worlds need to breathe. Not every m² needs to have mobs or a building or a chest.

Luickly for you blizzard agrees. The zones are larger and have more negative space in the world. You have this poi here and this poi over there with 500 yards in between them. In the negative space is a big lake that lots of animals come to drink from. No quests there, just for zone immersion, plus as a skinner areas like that are awesome. Players are rarely there, so its a skinners paradise. I love little places like that, that have niche uses.

[rhorle]

I honestly think they have no intention of releasing this year. The suits wanted pre-orders started and the devs will have to delay it to Q1 2023.

That is silly. They will release this year and the suits wouldn't have forced them to say an incorrect time just to get pre-orders. They could have done pre-orders with out giving a release time frame (or even date). It is crazy the conspiracies people invent.

[Chickat]

That is silly. They will release this year and the suits wouldn't have forced them to say an incorrect time just to get pre-orders. They could have done pre-orders with out giving a release time frame (or even date). It is crazy the conspiracies people invent.

We will see. In some counties you have to have a release date for them to be allowed to start pre-orders.

[rhorle]

We will see. In some counties you have to have a release date for them to be allowed to start pre-orders.

That date is meaningless though. In those countries Blizzard is obligated to give refunds if they don't deliver on or before December 31st, 2022. In countries that don't have that law the date is just a place holder for the point of sale systems. This was all brought up when Shadowlands was delayed and people thought Blizzard had a legal obligation to release it in 2020 because of that place holder date.

It is, and always will be, silly to think Blizzard did something just because corporate told them and have no intention of following through.

[Revamp Man]

That date is meaningless though. In those countries Blizzard is obligated to give refunds if they don't deliver on or before December 31st, 2022. In countries that don't have that law the date is just a place holder for the point of sale systems. This was all brought up when Shadowlands was delayed and people thought Blizzard had a legal obligation to release it in 2020 because of that place holder date.

It is, and always will be, silly to think Blizzard did something just because corporate told them and have no intention of following through.

if the leaks are to be believed its mid november
considering bfa short testing cycle it might be possible

[Kiivar86]

No, datamining is bad. How much datamining do you see of other major AAA games?

None.

We get trailers and maybe an occasional gameplay video which is very limited.

Its almost as if spoiling story and game environments isn't a good idea?

Are you kidding? There's a metric ton fo datamining of AAA games.

People dig into the files of everything. Like, hell, people dug into the recent Sonic Origins stuff and found info for the upcoming Sonic game. People tear into any little release of Pokemon. There's more datamining of Elden Ring and other Fromsoft games than you can shake a stick at. And so on.

[Dracullus]

Isnt that Thanksgiving week? When does that fall this year?

2 (3 if we count Monday as release day) before Thanksgiving, just like Shadowlands release.

If (optimist scenario, I know) seting 2022 is not some rushed or forced decision, probably they avoid this week and release even earlier. In SL they picked literally latest possible date, they had to delay but still for sure there was pressure to release in 2020.

[Raetary]

So the last 1000 pages have been talking about it? That doesn't validate your initial point lol

My point is that people are talking more about news than begging for alpha access.

Talking about alpha development is not, in fact, the same as begging for access.

[Lady Atia]

My point is that people are talking more about news than begging for alpha access.

Talking about alpha development is not, in fact, the same as begging for access.

Yeah, the initial round of datamining containing the new models, mounts, pets and transmogs is 1000000 times more interesting than the alpha playing itself. I would be more than happy if they just decrypt an early build but say invites will come out next month tbh.

[micwini]

Luickly for you blizzard agrees. The zones are larger and have more negative space in the world. You have this poi here and this poi over there with 500 yards in between them. In the negative space is a big lake that lots of animals come to drink from. No quests there, just for zone immersion, plus as a skinner areas like that are awesome. Players are rarely there, so its a skinners paradise. I love little places like that, that have niche uses.

Yes they did mention larger zones with more empty stuff in between, so that is something I'm looking forward to. That is the thing that gave charm to the older zones and has lacked often with the newer ones


I also look forward to alpha/beta just because of the news. I won't get access anyway lol. Just very curious to see more talent trees/professions/dragonriding, etc.

[Hitei]

Yes they did mention larger zones with more empty stuff in between, so that is something I'm looking forward to. That is the thing that gave charm to the older zones and has lacked often with the newer ones


I also look forward to alpha/beta just because of the news. I won't get access anyway lol. Just very curious to see more talent trees/professions/dragonriding, etc.

I'd just like to see Thaldraszus and Forbidden Reach more. Hard to really get a read on what those two zones feel like from what was shown, they're both fairly vertical and the screenshots and video previews are angled more towards bits of the terrain and less towards the full view.

[Nymrohd]

I'd just like to see Thaldraszus and Forbidden Reach more. Hard to really get a read on what those two zones feel like from what was shown, they're both fairly vertical and the screenshots and video previews are angled more towards bits of the terrain and less towards the full view.

Honestly one of my favourite parts with alpha builds is getting on a sandbox and exploring the terrain.

[Nyel]

I honestly think they have no intention of releasing this year. The suits wanted pre-orders started and the devs will have to delay it to Q1 2023.

I don't know, delaying the second expansion in a row isn't showing some good project planning oder scheduling skills. I just think Dragonflight itself will be so reduced that they - more or less - can pull off a release this year without major problems. If that's what the game needs is another question though.

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They did mention the idea of that in an interview as well as sockets in the talent tree like the Relic slots on Artifact weapons. You could earn a boost relic to boost the power or effects of a talent. If Divine Storm is a talent, you could socket a relic in that gives it the wave effect where it shoots out in a cone dealing half damage again etc. No I'm not going to find where the info is from, I just remember it being mentioned in an interview. We will see if they end up doing something like that, but IMO its a good idea.

Anything that continues your progression after hitting max level is a good idea. It doesn't have to be what I suggested, but they must give us something. Putting the last talent point you'll earn at max level in your talent tree and then two years of nothing would be a massive problem.

[ExiHext]

Putting the last talent point you'll earn at max level in your talent tree and then two years of nothing would be a massive problem FOR ME.

Fixed that for you. I have absolutely no problem with gear progression being the only max level progression.
That said, I'm sure we haven't seen everything that the devs have planned for maxlevel so f...ing calm your tits finally.

[Makorus]

The problem with gear progression is that it's boring.

Artifacts were cool because what you got was exciting, even when it was tiny nodes.

Azerite Armour was cool because most of them had cool effects.

Corruption was cool because of that.

Conduits were interesting as well because quite a few really changed how the spec plays.

People who were bitching about "borrowed power" will be in for a rude awakening.

[Nymrohd]

The problem with gear progression is that it's boring.

Artifacts were cool because what you got was exciting, even when it was tiny nodes.

Azerite Armour was cool because most of them had cool effects.

Corruption was cool because of that.

Conduits were interesting as well because quite a few really changed how the spec plays.

People who were bitching about "borrowed power" will be in for a rude awakening.

I think talent points will let the gameplay involve enough to make it interesting at release but we will need tier and trinkets to actually be transformative. I want SoO and HFC level of trinkets and tier sets.

[Lady Atia]

The problem with gear progression is that it's boring.

Artifacts were cool because what you got was exciting, even when it was tiny nodes.

Azerite Armour was cool because most of them had cool effects.

Corruption was cool because of that.

Conduits were interesting as well because quite a few really changed how the spec plays.

People who were bitching about "borrowed power" will be in for a rude awakening.

Artifacts were cool because of the cosmetics, not because of the annoying AP grind. Everyone hated that. They got fun right at the end with the free concordance though.

Azerite Armour was boring and they had to do essences to make the whole thing interesting. Which got removed 2 patches later.

Corruption was fun I give you that, but I hated the vendor because it forced you to go with boring stat % increase corruptions. They should have done more "Twillight Devastations" and none of the stat corruptions imo.

Conduits are boring cookie cutter stuff that were annoying to farm until they added catch up items.

People who were bitching about borrowed power were right? I wanna play my alts without having to farm some bullshit that I don't even care about just to be min maxed.