1. #59421
    Honestly I could see them keeping Kultiras/Zandalar as the new player experience, it summarizes and encapsulates a lot about the two factions, Dragon Isles not so much. Unless they really really want to put the factions on the backburner going forward, which I can't see them doing even with cross faction being a thing.

    Shadowlands however will never ever be part of the new player experience, it makes no sense at all for the first thing you do after landing in Stormwind or Orgrimmar is go to the afterlife.
    Last edited by Gifdwarf; 2022-06-19 at 06:18 AM.

  2. #59422
    I'm not entirely sure, but wasn't it already confirmed by the devs that BfA stays the new player experience? Or am I mixing things up?

  3. #59423
    Quote Originally Posted by ExiHext View Post
    I'm not entirely sure, but wasn't it already confirmed by the devs that BfA stays the new player experience? Or am I mixing things up?
    BfA is staying the NPE for Dragonflight, that doesn't mean it will continue to be forever. The farther we get from BfA the more its Horde vs Alliance setting doesn't mesh great with whatever comes after.

  4. #59424
    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Man View Post
    So I just looked up the leveling route in DF for new players.
    SL was a filler expansion in every way and so many people denied that
    The only thing the expansion has done is finish the hunt for Sylvanas
    By this logic, every expansion except BFA was apparently filler.

  5. #59425
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Robes are tied to character model, so nobody is using the original anymore. That went away when old models did. They can't change it to much or old robes won't draw right, though.
    Of course they can, It's just texture applied using markers. You have robes and pants using the exact same texture in the game.
    The developers most likely don't have any real new coat/robe model because of clipping issues and placement issues for the many different positions your character can do (sitting, mounted, lying, etc.)

  6. #59426
    Quote Originally Posted by Skildar View Post
    sure the expansion redefining the cosmos balance is filler
    It didn’t do any of that because pretty much everything can be ignored and doesn’t matter for Dragonflight (as of now). And I’m pretty sure it will be kept as this and pretty much nothing so lore-heavy to change the Warcraft cosmos that was established in Shadowlands will be used later on. Shadowlands is lore-wise WoD territory, completely neglectable for the ongoing future. Shadowlands lore mattered for Shadowlands and pretty much just that.
    Last edited by Nyel; 2022-06-19 at 08:51 AM.
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  7. #59427
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngerFork View Post
    You forgot a couple of big ones here: the World Quest system & Mythic+ Dungeons, both of which have been fairly large additions to WoW since inception. Not that I disagree with your overall point, DF looks to be anything but sparse. But with those two items added on to what you already have for Legion, I'd argue Legion was bigger overall than what DF looks to be.
    Yeah, its too early to tell, but my initial reaction would put Dragonflight behind legion in terms of content, but above everything else. MoP and BFA close behind. BFA had a lot of content, its just a lot of it wasn't any good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    I mean given that if you don't enjoy Evoker you have no other way to play Dracthyr, it is very limited as a race.
    Did the devs not say that the race could be opened up to more classes in the future? If that were to happen, we could put it on the level of 1 new race id say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    pretty sure they said the prof changes were meant to be built upon like the new talent system not just thrown away like the legion changes (wouldn’t call it a revamp), as far as dragon flight goes ya it’s only going to be part of the dragon isle for now but they have been looking to change flying for a while so it’s incredibly likely to be a new base thing, also trying to say it shouldn’t count because it doesn’t apply to old flying zones would be like saying Mythic+ doesn’t count because it’s only legion dungeons onwards.

    Invasions would count as being something legion add I suppose, so assuming they don’t throw away the dragon flight systems theh would both be at 3 new base systems, assuming they don’t add any thing yet to be announced
    Invasions are really just world quest and scenario tech combined. I don't think there's anything entirely new there, but sure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I think Legion and BfA already proved that they really don't care about it being Summer or not when it fits their schedule. For Dragonflight a Q3 release just makes no sense though.

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    Diablo IV will not launch in Q2, let's be realistic here. That's their optimistic and naive take to appease the fanbase, but for sure they'll delay it until at least Q3, rather Q4 though to "give players the best experience" or [insert bs PR talk]. Dragonflight can easily fit into Q1 and if not there it will be early Q2. No issues whatsoever.
    Yeah, I have a feeling it will end up being early Q2 for DF.

    April 2023-DF
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    Either way its going to be a massive year for blizzard.

  8. #59428
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    It didn’t do any of that because pretty much everything can be ignored and doesn’t matter for Dragonflight (as of now). And I’m pretty sure it will be kept as this and pretty much nothing so lore-heavy to change the Warcraft cosmos that was established in Shadowlands will be used later on. Shadowlands is lore-wise WoD territory, completely neglectable for the ongoing future. Shadowlands lore mattered for Shadowlands and pretty much just that.
    What an idiotic statement.

    TBCs lore mattered for nothing but TBC. The only thing that were acknowledged after the expansion was the races and Garrosh.

    Wrath didn't matter for anything. The only thing of consequence happening in that expansion was the Wrathgate. Even Arthas dying was irrelevant because there always needs to be a Lich King

  9. #59429
    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    What an idiotic statement.

    TBCs lore mattered for nothing but TBC. The only thing that were acknowledged after the expansion was the races and Garrosh.

    Wrath didn't matter for anything. The only thing of consequence happening in that expansion was the Wrathgate. Even Arthas dying was irrelevant because there always needs to be a Lich King
    Idiotic are your examples, to use your words and tone.

    WotLK finished the plot started in the RTS and so did TBC. Everything that lead to Shadowlands was a hated side-plot in BfA that got its own expansion. If you remove Shadowlands from Warcraft's timeline, nothing before or after would change - the same can be said about 99% of WoD. The same cannot be said about TBC, WotLK or any other expansion.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  10. #59430
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Idiotic are your examples, to use your words and tone.

    WotLK finished the plot started in the RTS and so did TBC. Everything that lead to Shadowlands was a hated side-plot in BfA that got its own expansion. If you remove Shadowlands from Warcraft's timeline, nothing before or after would change - the same can be said about 99% of WoD. The same cannot be said about TBC, WotLK or any other expansion.
    If you remove Wrath from Warcraft's timeline, nothing would change either.

    The Scourge is still running rampant, there is still a Lich King, the Forsaken are still Forsaken. The only thing that really happened is that Arthas died, which at the end of the day is irrelevant because there is still a Lich King anyway. It doesn't lead into Cataclysm. Bolvar LK and Arthas LK are fundamentally the same characters as well (until SL, really).

  11. #59431
    Over 9000! Lahis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Except that they had to go to Maldraxxus to get help about the Plague, No SL wouldn't have that
    There was no reason they couldn't have written any Azerothian solution to the problem.

    Let's say the Apothecaries swallowed their pride once they couldn't figure the solution by themselves and ask Cenarion Circle for help. Both organizations dislike each other, but realize that getting rid of the Blight is the better outcome for the world. Hell, CC could add in some help from Green/Red Dragons to tie whole thing towards Dragonflight. Together these parties figure out solution to clean up Lordareon.

    There, no need for SL to clean Undercity.

  12. #59432
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Idiotic are your examples, to use your words and tone.
    Nah, that would be yours. Just because it doesn't directly impact the immediately following episode does not make an episode filler. The concept doesn't apply to games anyway.

  13. #59433
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Shadowlands is lore-wise WoD territory, completely neglectable for the ongoing future. Shadowlands lore mattered for Shadowlands and pretty much just that.
    Yea, sure. First Ones existing is absolutely neglectable for the future of the game.

  14. #59434
    Quote Originally Posted by Lahis View Post
    There was no reason they couldn't have written any Azerothian solution to the problem.

    Let's say the Apothecaries swallowed their pride once they couldn't figure the solution by themselves and ask Cenarion Circle for help. Both organizations dislike each other, but realize that getting rid of the Blight is the better outcome for the world. Hell, CC could add in some help from Green/Red Dragons to tie whole thing towards Dragonflight. Together these parties figure out solution to clean up Lordareon.

    There, no need for SL to clean Undercity.
    Honestly paladins, druids and shaman have been cleaning the blight since Cataclysm with multiple parts of the Plaguelands completely cleaned by now.

  15. #59435
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Honestly paladins, druids and shaman have been cleaning the blight since Cataclysm with multiple parts of the Plaguelands completely cleaned by now.
    And nothing has changed so...... yeah not much changed. SL is not filler.
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  16. #59436
    Cutting Shadowlands from the new player experience is the right choice. Most of Sylvanas's story in BfA is locked behind max level content a new player never sees. For Alliance players I think there's almost zero interaction with her since they removed the Battle for Lordaeron.

    Irrespective of that, the SLs leveling experience is going to be unsatisfactory once they probably remove conduits and class abilities in the pre-patch.

  17. #59437
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    It didn’t do any of that because pretty much everything can be ignored and doesn’t matter for Dragonflight (as of now). And I’m pretty sure it will be kept as this and pretty much nothing so lore-heavy to change the Warcraft cosmos that was established in Shadowlands will be used later on. Shadowlands is lore-wise WoD territory, completely neglectable for the ongoing future. Shadowlands lore mattered for Shadowlands and pretty much just that.
    Pretty much every expansion is neglectable for the ongoing future. So again it is silly to use definitions for filler that make it apply to every expansion. Most expansions are self contained with only a few things carrying forward to the next expansion. It is always a random chance if things get used for the next expansion and since Cataclysm Blizzard has only used small things to lead into the next expansion. That has stopped with Shadowlands as there is no clear lore hook bridging the expansions though the jailers attack does seem to have had some impact.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  18. #59438
    Quote Originally Posted by Khaza-R View Post
    Cutting Shadowlands from the new player experience is the right choice. Most of Sylvanas's story in BfA is locked behind max level content a new player never sees. For Alliance players I think there's almost zero interaction with her since they removed the Battle for Lordaeron.

    Irrespective of that, the SLs leveling experience is going to be unsatisfactory once they probably remove conduits and class abilities in the pre-patch.
    They'll likely handle it the same way as the Heart. They already talked about what happens if you have an ability from both Covenants and DF talents.

  19. #59439
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahis View Post
    There was no reason they couldn't have written any Azerothian solution to the problem.
    Sure they could have done something differently. But they didn't. There can always be a different story written for everything in WoW that still doesn't change what they did use.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  20. #59440
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Pretty much every expansion is neglectable for the ongoing future. So again it is silly to use definitions for filler that make it apply to every expansion. Most expansions are self contained with only a few things carrying forward to the next expansion. It is always a random chance if things get used for the next expansion and since Cataclysm Blizzard has only used small things to lead into the next expansion. That has stopped with Shadowlands as there is no clear lore hook bridging the expansions though the jailers attack does seem to have had some impact.
    The thing is - and that matters in this case - that they clearly planned another path for Shadowlands by all the pathos the Shadowlands expansion was oozing pathos. The Jailer, the ultimate baddie, the First Ones, the better Titans, all of this cosmic bullsh*t they wove into the Shadowlands lore just to use nothing of it eventually and leave no further impression on the franchise or Azeroth whatsoever.

    Shadowlands was orchestrated to be this climax of the franchise, but in the end has less impact than even f* WoD, which is just hilarious. That's why I said this expansion is so far left and right of the core franchise that we can easily remove it from the timeline and its abscence won't even be recognized by how irrelevant all of it was. That the Shadowlands are its own realm even adds to this, as we leave them and everything is as it was right before we stepped into it. It feels like a Warcraft spinoff with some of its main characters but plot wise completely detached from the "main" franchise.
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