Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Revamp Man]

I don't think Restless Crew is going to be that problematic as you guys think. Not all classes benefit from having a lower major CD due to desync, and it's not like people were stacking more Priests just for Fae Guardians.

I'm wondering if it would be more useful for healers
I mean a lot of burn phases come during high damage as well so you could get like 30s of tranq just from hero

I like the possibilities but I also don't have to math it

[Catastrophy349]

I think the return of Xalatath, maybe as the secret main villain, would be really cool. That she's seeking something in those Old God temples or facilities or whatever. Would be a good interlude to a Void expansion, too.

Very true. While Shadowlands’ story was wonky, that shouldn’t be reason enough to completely stop the cosmic story they started building up (heck, it’s been there since the beginning of WoW if you look close enough). However, it needs to be told “right” and in small chunks so that it makes sense. If they want to address the remaining forces, slowly build them up in Dragonflight, 11.0, etc. We do not need to leave Dragonflight for another intergalactic battle.

[Revamp Man]

Nostalgia is a hell of a drug and many players are likely wrath babies so Ulduar is the first 'quality' raid they ever experienced.

The hard modes allowed for flexibility in your runs
Legendary mace kept it relevant
Was the best raid lock out design during Wrath
Was huge
Had a variety of environments in it

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Very true. While Shadowlands’ story was wonky, that shouldn’t be reason enough to completely stop the cosmic story they started building up (heck, it’s been there since the beginning of WoW if you look close enough). However, it needs to be told “right” and in small chunks so that it makes sense. If they want to address the remaining forces, slowly build them up in Dragonflight, 11.0, etc. We do not need to leave Dragonflight for another intergalactic battle.

Tinfoil time

Xal is the final OG depicted in chronicles (border had things from all the known old gods plus one more)
She isn't threatened by a titan equivalent being like elune
With her brothers dead she makes her move and the goal is on the dragon isles

[Nyel]

Imagine Xalatath riding Chromatus or Galakrond in battle.

[Grimmy17]

I'm wondering if it would be more useful for healers
I mean a lot of burn phases come during high damage as well so you could get like 30s of tranq just from hero

I like the possibilities but I also don't have to math it

It's usually not. This is part of the reason the Restoration Shaman tier set was changed so heavily - Between 4-5 healers in a raid you usually have more than enough CDs to cover each point of mechanic damage, enforcing CDR into the mix just encourages dropping more healers (which is something blizz really don't like to do - and as a healer myself, I don't like it either)

[Catastrophy349]

There’s certainly a lot that they can do with Dragonflight lore wise. People hated BFA (I didn’t but I understand their reasons); however, while they shoved too many stories into one expansion, it did open up a lot of possibilities for future expansions (in other words, expansions post BFA (SL, DF, etc.)). So, I’m curious to see more Old God stuff, Azshara, Xal, maybe Pantheon (Illidan and Sargeras, too) eventually, and of course, the remnants of Dragon lore (Wrathion story, Kalec story, Ysera’s “daughter’s” story, Nozdormu——>Murozond story, and Alexstrasza story).

[Hitei]

I do think there is a valid concern in that we are seeing a lot of potentially exceptional utility BUT that utility takes many forms. Mark of the Wild vs PI vs Restless Crew is problematic. You only need 1 druid for Mark. You need an outlaw rogue per group for Restless Crew and people who are stuck in groups without the outlaw rogue will feel like crap (and potentially would want a different build depending on if they'll have the buff or not). As for PI we already know what problems PI creates. I love the utility but I'd rather have utility that doesn't cause social issues.

Again, it's just Door of Shadows.

Sure, in some hypothetical that only really exists in a top 150 guild, you will have DPS changing their talent setup dependent on whether or not a rogue is in their party, in the unlikely event that the amount of time shaved off that particular ONE offensive ability for their spec and class is enough time difference to optimize some other slightly different talent spec more focused on that singular ability--putting aside that it would require that one ability to become more DPS contributive from that probably ~<15-20% CDR than whatever existing ability setup is mandating your not-Restless talent setup AND ignoring that in all likelihood, if it is a major contributive spell, you're already built around it anyone so all that CDR doesn't do anything but allow you to hit it a few more times in an encounter.

But that does not reflect the actual reality of group dynamics, anymore than every tank in the game is respeccing each time they join a group to compensate for the significantly different toolkits and healing styles of various healers, or vice versa. Just like no one is trying to optimized skip a trash pack by carefully teleporting every 60 seconds in a M+

You are not going to feel like crap not being in that rogue group, because that rogue could be spending 5CP every five seconds, and at the end of a 10 minute encounter you might have hit a 1.5min CD one time less, or a 45 min CD ~3 times less in that 10 minute fight than someone in that party. You know what the people in that part also have to deal with? That CD getting progressively skewed away from their normal combat rhythm because every time a rogue finishing moves it slides it farther from where the CD would normally land. If anything I think you'd feel worse being in that party than having a few ability uses or maybe one CD use less. Because now their 45s CD and 1.5min CD aren't lining up every other time, because the 45s CD is effectively ~37 seconds and will literally never, ever line up again even assuming the rogue somehow kept a perfectly constant rate of CP usage the entire fight.

But it doesn't actually matter, because in all likelihood, while those group members are awkwardly playing their fucked up rotation to get those extra couple presses in, you have, for example, a shaman in your group whose new iteration windfury totem is bumping your DPS by nearly as much as you'd get from that CDR anyway, or are being time-echoed by an Evoker in your group to sometimes duplicate attacks such that you're out DPSing that CDR, because who knows what is actually going to be of value on the trees in terms of group comp until all the trees are there.

The overwhelming issue with Power Infusion is not that it's so brokenly OP that every group in existence is compelled to ignore all other classes and field 20% of the group as priests, it's that priests feel shitty using it because its nature means that optimization involves you frequently using a fun CD that you'd really like to use for your DPS on someone else who is doing slightly higher damage instead. A problem the talent trees are clearly trying to side-step by making those sorts of effects duplicate on you.

[Kiria]

We need a visage blog to show how we can customize our visage when out of combat, this is highly important and needed to be reviewed!

[Nyel]

There’s certainly a lot that they can do with Dragonflight lore wise. People hated BFA (I didn’t but I understand their reasons); however, while they shoved too many stories into one expansion, it did open up a lot of possibilities for future expansions (in other words, expansions post BFA (SL, DF, etc.)). So, I’m curious to see more Old God stuff, Azshara, Xal, maybe Pantheon (Illidan and Sargeras, too) eventually, and of course, the remnants of Dragon lore (Wrathion story, Kalec story, Ysera’s “daughter’s” story, Nozdormu——>Murozond story, and Alexstrasza story).

Azshara being part of Dragonflight would be another fantastic thing.

[Catastrophy349]

Azshara being part of Dragonflight would be another fantastic thing.

She is searching for a seat of power, no? Dragon Isles could be VERY crucial to furthering the plot.

[Grimmy17]

Azshara being part of Dragonflight would be another fantastic thing.

I'd like to keep her out of it - save her for the underground expansion... She did spend all that time under the surface

[Catastrophy349]

I really want to see a “WotLK” format for raid tiers, too. Keep the patch cycle and raid tiers ON the Dragon Isles, please. Let the Dragon Isles be important for more than just the 10.0 launch. Wrath did this so well. I feel like Dragon Isles can be perfect, too, due to the nature of elevation from starting to end leveling zones as well as the Dragon Aspect theme.

[Nebron]

I think the return of Xalatath, maybe as the secret main villain, would be really cool. That she's seeking something in those Old God temples or facilities or whatever. Would be a good interlude to a Void expansion, too.

Xalatath? Sure, why not. But no more secret villians please
I'd be good with Murozond as a main boss for that xpac with us exploring this plotlines since the very first experience with Bronze Dragonflights in DF (Inifnite Dragonflight involved).

Although, wouldn't be surprised to see A LOT of Xalatath/ Old Goids vs. Wrathion and Black Dragonflight's genetic tendency to be messed up by whispers and chaotic forces.

Also, we get Primal Incarnates as a first main villian for that expansion so I'd expect to see a lot of lore around that, and Elemental Lords who infused them with power. By the way, it's so fantasy-like plot, I do love that idea. Now it's all about execution

[Grimmy17]

Xalatath? Sure, why not. But no more secret villians please
I'd be good with Murozond as a main boss for that xpac with us exploring this plotlines since the very first experience with Bronze Dragonflights in DF (Inifnite Dragonflight involved).

Although, wouldn't be surprised to see A LOT of Xalatath/ Old Goids vs. Wrathion and Black Dragonflight's genetic tendency to be messed up by whispers and chaotic forces.

Also, we get Primal Incarnates as a first main villian for that expansion so I'd expect to see a lot of lore around that, and Elemental Lords who infused them with power. By the way, it's so fantasy-like plot, I do love that idea. Now it's all about execution

Plus they look amazing!

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/wo...20220419181248

[Catastrophy349]

Here is my BIGGEST problem with Shadowlands lore (before anyone tries to bite my head off, this is not the ONLY problem I had, this is just one of the most concerning (IMO)):

We went through 4 leveling zones, established connections to each from Oribos, and learned some pretty interesting stories. However, for raids we got:

1). Castle Nathria (Revendreth)
2). Sanctum (The Maw)
3). Sepulcher (Zereth Mortis)

So, what’s wrong with this picture? The first raid was perfect. It made sense. The whole build up with the Anima drought, Sire Denathrius working with the Jailer (so we think), Revendreth as the final zone; all of this made sense for the first raid to take place at the end of the story campaign/final leveling zone.

Then, we got Sanctum. In the Maw. A place where the Jailer has been locked up forever and was supposed to be a pretty significant place in the realm of Death. Why? Whyyyyy?

We just abandoned Maldraxxus, Ardenweald, and Bastion? And cherry on top, the last raid tier was in another NEW zone (Sepulcher). Again, I ask why?

I understand that there are rumors for cut content (a possible Drust/Ardenweald raid); however, let’s live in reality for a second. We had 3 other leveling zones and this is where the raids went??

Now, look at Wrath. Wrath used Borean Tundra (Malygos), Dragonblight (Naxxramas, OS, AND Ruby Sanctum), Ulduar (Storm Peaks), TotGC (IceCrown), VoA (Wintergrasp), and ICC (IceCrown). Look how spread out that is? We didn’t need to add new zones because we had the story grounded already in these.

Please, let the Dragon Isles be more than a single patch!!

[Khaza-R]

I would expect 10.0 and 10.1 to take place in the Dragon Isles with a hypothetical 10.2 and 10.3 being in new or re-used areas.

Pretty much every modern expansion has followed this format except WoD. Even with Shadowlands, the Maw technically was the Shadowlands equivalent to Suramar.

[Catastrophy349]

I would expect 10.0 and 10.1 to take place in the Dragon Isles with a hypothetical 10.2 and 10.3 being in new or re-used areas.

Pretty much every modern expansion has followed this format except WoD. Even with Shadowlands, the Maw technically was the Shadowlands equivalent to Suramar.

100%. My argument wasn’t meant to be “Keep ALL patches and raids on these 4 zones ONLY”. I was more so asking for them not to neglect the zones as much as they did in SL. Also, it would be cool if they added zones TO the Dragon Isles (think MoP Timeless Isle and Isle of Thunder) instead of adding zones that aren’t even remotely close to the Dragon Isles.

[MightyWarrior]

Servers might go up tonight, datamining begins, and alpha starts on Thursday?

[Nyel]

Xalatath? Sure, why not. But no more secret villians please
I'd be good with Murozond as a main boss for that xpac with us exploring this plotlines since the very first experience with Bronze Dragonflights in DF (Inifnite Dragonflight involved).

Although, wouldn't be surprised to see A LOT of Xalatath/ Old Goids vs. Wrathion and Black Dragonflight's genetic tendency to be messed up by whispers and chaotic forces.

Also, we get Primal Incarnates as a first main villian for that expansion so I'd expect to see a lot of lore around that, and Elemental Lords who infused them with power. By the way, it's so fantasy-like plot, I do love that idea. Now it's all about execution

I mean... we do have a "secret" villain because we don't have a box villain like we had in previous expansions (up until MoP and then again in WoD and Legion). I think if it really would be Murozond, we'd know about that already because it's the most likely outcome. I mean Murzond as final boss would be as much a surprise as N'zoth in BfA...

[Catastrophy349]

Servers might go up tonight, datamining begins, and alpha starts on Thursday?

Tin foil hat time:

-NDA Alpha is today/tomorrow
-Viewer Alpha is Thursday
-More blog posts/talents between now and then
-Datamining at some point, too (of course)

Now, what IF we got to see a preview/sneak peak of the NDA Alpha stuff? Not sure why, how, what, or when, but wouldn’t that be epic!

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I mean... we do have a "secret" villain because we don't have a box villain like we had in previous expansions (up until MoP and then again in WoD and Legion). I think if it really would be Murozond, we'd know about that already because it's the most likely outcome. I mean Murzond as final boss would be as much a surprise as N'zoth in BfA...

So far, I’m very happy with the parallels between Dragonflight and MoP. Exactly what we need after SL.