1. #66321
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    Honestly, I think both should be using WoWpedia as a resource.
    Wowpedia has a lot of flaws rather they be info left out or people adding there own fanfic.

    I’d dread to think that blizzard doesn’t have a more accurate data base.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  2. #66322
    Stood in the Fire Berkilak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    Wowpedia has a lot of flaws rather they be info left out or people adding there own fanfic.

    I’d dread to think that blizzard doesn’t have a more accurate data base.
    At the very least, it is annotated so you can actually check on the validity of stuff. Much like Wikipedia, it's a great starting point. I doubt they have anything in-house. Or we wouldn't wind up with stuff like the Dragonmaw Clan showing up to a meeting that happened before the Orcs ever actually encountered dragons.

  3. #66323
    Herald of the Titans Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    At the very least, it is annotated so you can actually check on the validity of stuff. Much like Wikipedia, it's a great starting point. I doubt they have anything in-house. Or we wouldn't wind up with stuff like the Dragonmaw Clan showing up to a meeting that happened before the Orcs ever actually encountered dragons.
    The dragonmaw are named after rylaks, not Azeroth's dragons.

  4. #66324
    Stood in the Fire Berkilak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    The dragonmaw are named after rylaks, not Azeroth's dragons.
    Rylaks didn't even exist until WoD. And the Dragonmaw Clan didn't even exist in the alternate Draenor. That is simply a clumsy retcon that was made because of these slip ups. Originally, the Dragonmaw Clan was put together by the Blackrock Clan as an elite force of the Horde's top shamans, dedicated to overseeing the new dragon-taming initiative. It did not exist until the Second War. No matter how many "Nelghor-Shomashs" you throw at it.

  5. #66325
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    At the very least, it is annotated so you can actually check on the validity of stuff. Much like Wikipedia, it's a great starting point. I doubt they have anything in-house. Or we wouldn't wind up with stuff like the Dragonmaw Clan showing up to a meeting that happened before the Orcs ever actually encountered dragons.
    The problem with wowpedia though is that you pretty much have to check every line of text for validity, nothing can be taken at face value because people will add random incorrect stuff in with canon stuff that you wouldn’t know is wrong if you didn’t check the sources your self and the citations are often really vague.

    One example that comes to mind is the Cenarion Circle where it says that they are outside of the command of Tyranda and ruled by a council which includes Cenarius and has a link to a short story as a source. But if you read through the short story all it actually says is that they are outside the command of Tyranda and it never mentions any council let alone the fact that Cenarius is notable not part of the circle telling malfurion in Curse of the worgen that he will not join and will not lead and that it was up to malfurion and the others to make there own choices.

    Some one randomly added the line about Cenarius being a leader and if you didn’t read the random worgen comic you wouldn’t even know it was wrong as his roll in the circle never comes up any where else and wowpedia likely has hundreds of things like that.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  6. #66326
    Stood in the Fire Berkilak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    The problem with wowpedia though is that you pretty much have to check every line of text for validity, nothing can be taken at face value because people will add random incorrect stuff in with canon stuff that you wouldn’t know is wrong if you didn’t check the sources your self and the citations are often really vague.

    One example that comes to mind is the Cenarion Circle where it says that they are outside of the command of Tyranda and ruled by a council which includes Cenarius and has a link to a short story as a source. But if you read through the short story all it actually says is that they are outside the command of Tyranda and it never mentions any council let alone the fact that Cenarius is notable not part of the circle telling malfurion in Curse of the worgen that he will not join and will not lead and that it was up to malfurion and the others to make there own choices.

    Some one randomly added the line about Cenarius being a leader and if you didn’t read the random worgen comic you wouldn’t even know it was wrong as his roll in the circle never comes up any where else and wowpedia likely has hundreds of things like that.
    I don't disagree that it's problematic. But it is better than not checking anything at all.

  7. #66327
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    I don't disagree that it's problematic. But it is better than not checking anything at all.
    Well ya but those aren’t the only two options blizzard should have copy’s of all The work they have published so even if they don’t have a build data base they would be better off just going through relevant works instead of going through wowpedia where they are gonna get a lot of incorrect info and then have to go through all the same works any way and pick out what parts were added by fans.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  8. #66328
    Is new alpha build today?

  9. #66329
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    So what are you guys hoping to see in tonight's Alpha build?

    - Surprise, Survival now has dual-wield!
    Oh man, I'd kill for dual-wield Survival. Love the spec, but I dislike that most (all?) melee hunter NPC's like Rexxar/Nathanos/Tyrande dual wield and I can't emulate that on my character.

  10. #66330
    Stood in the Fire Berkilak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    Well ya but those aren’t the only two options blizzard should have copy’s of all The work they have published so even if they don’t have a build data base they would be better off just going through relevant works instead of going through wowpedia where they are gonna get a lot of incorrect info and then have to go through all the same works any way and pick out what parts were added by fans.
    At the very least, you know what parts to consult. It really feels like some of the modern output was created without even knowing that some of the older stuff exists at all. And to be fair, this has always been an issue.

  11. #66331
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    At the very least, you know what parts to consult. It really feels like some of the modern output was created without even knowing that some of the older stuff exists at all. And to be fair, this has always been an issue.
    It could be used for “these story’s exist” even if they aren't represented correctly that’s true.

    Though I’d blizzard doesn’t even have a in house reading list man that would be bad.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  12. #66332
    Stood in the Fire Berkilak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    It could be used for “these story’s exist” even if they aren't represented correctly that’s true.

    Though I’d blizzard doesn’t even have a in house reading list man that would be bad.
    I won't name names, as I find that to be in poor taste, but they do indeed have a "Head of Lore" position at Blizzard with "historians" as staff. Perhaps I overstated my argument when I said this stuff doesn't exist. I'm sure it does. I just wonder how closely it matches the actual product delivered, and how accurate it is overall.

  13. #66333
    Over 9000! Lahis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    That's so weird. I remember being there when they had the legion cafe .... without blizzard I wouldn't have got tickets for gamescom in the first place.
    Only reason they were there back then was because they needed to announce Legion and waiting till Blizzcon was too long.

  14. #66334
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    I won't name names, as I find that to be in poor taste, but they do indeed have a "Head of Lore" position at Blizzard with "historians" as staff. Perhaps I overstated my argument when I said this stuff doesn't exist. I'm sure it does. I just wonder how closely it matches the actual product delivered, and how accurate it is overall.
    Totally forgot that they had a “historian”, though I wouldn’t actually be surprised if they did there job really well and they did have a great data base but then people higher then them just don’t check it, or do check it and just don’t care.

    A lot of shadowlands feels like it’s stuff they couldn’t have possibly missed so instead they just ignored it.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  15. #66335
    Quote Originally Posted by Worldshaper View Post
    So what are you guys hoping to see in tonight's Alpha build?

    Here's the obvious, I guess:

    - Demon Hunter talents.
    - Final two dungeons.
    - Raid testing.
    - Any remaining professions specializations.
    - Additions to the HUD update.

    Here's what I'm hoping for on top of that:

    - MUSIC!
    - Surprise, Survival now has dual-wield!
    - Alpha is now Beta, get a key as a Twitch drop.
    1.) People shutting up about lore, claiming they know more than Blizzard will ever will
    2.) DH talents/skills
    3.) Beta announcement (I don't see that happening though)
    4.) Some form of end game testing so we know what to expect (will it be more like ZM, or more like the covenant zones with boring WQ's)

  16. #66336
    Stood in the Fire Berkilak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    Totally forgot that they had a “historian”, though I wouldn’t actually be surprised if they did there job really well and they did have a great data base but then people higher then them just don’t check it, or do check it and just don’t care.

    A lot of shadowlands feels like it’s stuff they couldn’t have possibly missed so instead they just ignored it.
    I can definitely relate to that a little too well.

  17. #66337
    Scarab Lord Nymrohd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkilak View Post
    I won't name names, as I find that to be in poor taste, but they do indeed have a "Head of Lore" position at Blizzard with "historians" as staff. Perhaps I overstated my argument when I said this stuff doesn't exist. I'm sure it does. I just wonder how closely it matches the actual product delivered, and how accurate it is overall.
    I think these are two different departments. They do have an archival department with "historians" that archives the history of the company and handles material related to it. They were a very busy department for Blizzcon. Besides that, they did have a head of lore. Did they actually listen to them? Doubt it. Elder scrolls has a head of lore and you can see how busy they are.

  18. #66338
    Quote Originally Posted by kiruz View Post
    Is new alpha build today?
    Not today I've heard.

  19. #66339
    Quote Originally Posted by stormgust View Post
    Not today I've heard.
    Who did you hear it from? Last week wasn't the case simply because of delays. This week should be different no?

  20. #66340
    The Lightbringer Valysar's Avatar
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    Realms are still online so, seems to not be today

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