Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Jastall]

Now that you say that, I have a sneaking suspicion that she's going to be the final boss or at least final boss adjacent. Then we're going to, in the end, have the fully revamped / reconstituted flights to help us with the next expansion with new leaders for every single one. (Murozond is still totally going to be a boss, so. Chromie leader of the Bronze?)

Na, I don't think so personally. Nozdormu turning into Murozond (which I take for absolute granted at this point) is already one Aspect going off the deep end for the sake of looting his purples. Alex hasn't had much in terms of setup to go bad and drastic action is not in her character at all. The expansion can already have the likes of Chromatus or Galakrond as extra raid bosses, plus whatever new characters Blizz conjures up. They don't need Alex to go bad.

[Revamp Man]

Except the new information we got from Tyr's correspondence says the Titan's bodies are made at Zereth Ordos. Just like the Eternal's bodies were made at Zereth Mortis. There is a world soul inside them. So contrary to what it seemed, Azeroth one day turning into a titan isn't something that just happens. This makes the war over Azeroth's soul seem drastically more self-interested.

Well if we go by what Argus had memories of in the valeera story then we know they exist then find a sun and planets form around them.

I still think that the world souls we know of aren't Titans but two first ones that are in their own cycle of rebirth

The Titans want to ensure they are reborn in an orderly fashion
Death wanted their souls
Void wants to corrupt them
Disorder wants to destroy them

If you think of Azeroth as the higher being and a symbol of the balance then you'll see that all the forces are simply trying to tip the scale and Azeroth can't be a titan of order because as odyn points out mortals are chaotic.

What force would Azeroth be a titan of?? Time?? Nature?? No but she is of creation and what is orderly about creation?? Let's also look at Argus who is literally the unmaker and despite the first ones being equivalent to Titans his soul broke the being created specifically to sort souls

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We need new long term villains. Chromatus was actually presented as intelligent. I could absolutely see the creche that went rogue becoming a faction with Chromatus at its head. Powerlevel wise he has what it takes to be a world ending threat after all.

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He is just in stasis
We do see the twilight hammer return
He fought multiple aspects at once
He has the powers of all flights

We need him to be a villain simply for that sense of "here's a guy that was defeated but not killed by the strongest beings that we still can't match"

[Ersula]

No it doesn't. It doesn't say that at all.

Page five of Odyn's Edicts states "the makers granted us great wonders" at Zareth Ordos. This is exactly the same way the Eternals described the first ones & Zereth Mortis before we find out (to our own horror) that they were literally built there.

You should assume its the exact same situation. Especially considering The Titans are even more robotic than the Eternals.

What force would Azeroth be a titan of?? Time?? Nature?? No but she is of creation and what is orderly about creation?? Let's also look at Argus who is literally the unmaker and despite the first ones being equivalent to Titans his soul broke the being created specifically to sort souls

They're whatever they're stuck into. We know they have a unique soul but their style & abilities are whatever the First Ones designed for them, as demonstrated by the Prototype Pantheon fight.

The Titans are of order because that's what the first ones designed for them. The Eternals are of Death because that's what the First Ones designed for them.

At this point we should be fighting to keep Azeroth a planet because that's the one thing that doesn't require cosmic intervention.

[Sondrelk]

Well that's a hot take. Almost everyone I've talked to considered both the Azshara and the Jaina shorts from BfA to be exceptional. Even the Sylvanas one was good, it's just the lore it came with that was crap but it absolutely made its point well.

Will be interesting to see which of the three shorts is the best. We always seem to get one really standout short that has it all, like the Gul'dan, Jaina, and Uther one.

[Revamp Man]

Page five of Odyn's Edicts states "the makers granted us great wonders" at Zareth Ordos. This is exactly the same way the Eternals described the first ones & Zereth Mortis before we find out (to our own horror) that they were literally built there.

You should assume its the exact same situation. Especially considering The Titans are even more robotic than the Eternals.They're whatever they're stuck into. We know they have a unique soul but their style & abilities are whatever the First Ones designed for them, as demonstrated by the Prototype Pantheon fight.

The Titans are of order because that's what the first ones designed for them. The Eternals are of Death because that's what the First Ones designed for them.

At this point we should be fighting to keep Azeroth a planet because that's the one thing that doesn't require cosmic intervention.

I guess I'm the only one that finds it weird that EVERY COSMIC FORCE wants something from Azeroth

Let's also keep in mind she saw into the future or Argus did I'm a bit iffy on that part of the quest line

The light wants to force the children of Azeroth to follow it
The void wants to corrupt
The Titans want to order it
Jailer wanted to drain it (even though the eternal ones are stronger)
Life wanted to overgrow it

[Cheezits]

I guess I'm the only one that finds it weird that EVERY COSMIC FORCE wants something from Azeroth

Let's also keep in mind she saw into the future or Argus did I'm a bit iffy on that part of the quest line

The light wants to force the children of Azeroth to follow it
The void wants to corrupt
The Titans want to order it
Jailer wanted to drain it (even though the eternal ones are stronger)
Life wanted to overgrow it

The Light and Void want to convert/corrupt everything. Life also seems to just want to flourish, even if it leads to bad results (Draenor).

I think the biggest hint that Azeroth is special is that the Jailer specifically needed Azeroth to use the machine to link the Zereths (see: Firim's report) and end existence. He needed Azeroth so badly that he spent ages hyperfocused on it. But why? Why would a world soul allow access to the machine? If any old First One creation could do it he could've just used Denathrius or another Eternal One.

[Nymrohd]

What force would Azeroth be a titan of?? Time?? Nature?? No but she is of creation and what is orderly about creation?? Let's also look at Argus who is literally the unmaker and despite the first ones being equivalent to Titans his soul broke the being created specifically to sort souls

But Argus is not the unmaker. He was MADE the unmaker in a deeply unnatural way. There is nothing telling us that the Titans had specific aspects naturally. Perhaps they visited Zereth Ordos and each gained a specific insight into a facet of the cosmos. Perhaps they are just cosmically powerful creatures and each of them had a preference for some type of magic and studied something more extensively than the rest.

[Ersula]

I guess I'm the only one that finds it weird that EVERY COSMIC FORCE wants something from Azeroth

Let's also keep in mind she saw into the future or Argus did I'm a bit iffy on that part of the quest line

The light wants to force the children of Azeroth to follow it
The void wants to corrupt
The Titans want to order it
Jailer wanted to drain it (even though the eternal ones are stronger)
Life wanted to overgrow it

Obviously. This is like in Transformers Beast Wars where the robots themselves can't reproduce; all they can do is hope they randomly find a embryonic soul baby & stop everyone else from getting it.

[Hyrja]

Prepatch background download now available! (build 10.0.0.46181)

[Koollan]

Na, I don't think so personally. Nozdormu turning into Murozond (which I take for absolute granted at this point) is already one Aspect going off the deep end for the sake of looting his purples. Alex hasn't had much in terms of setup to go bad and drastic action is not in her character at all. The expansion can already have the likes of Chromatus or Galakrond as extra raid bosses, plus whatever new characters Blizz conjures up. They don't need Alex to go bad.

Fair enough. I also don't have the highest hopes that they could pull it off with grace. Though, given that there are many many hints of Old Gods being a major contributing factor to the story of DF going forward, who could we speculate the Old Gods turning besides Murozond? Would he be the only one, or would other major characters succumb? Perhaps Ebonhorn, Sabellian, Wrathion? Then again, we already fought Wrathion once, so... maybe not.

[Sondrelk]

Fair enough. I also don't have the highest hopes that they could pull it off with grace. Though, given that there are many many hints of Old Gods being a major contributing factor to the story of DF going forward, who could we speculate the Old Gods turning besides Murozond? Would he be the only one, or would other major characters succumb? Perhaps Ebonhorn, Sabellian, Wrathion? Then again, we already fought Wrathion once, so... maybe not.

Given the recent lore tidbits from Odyn it might be possible that Nozdormu will turn into Murozond without the intervention of the Old Gods. Really he could learn any number of things about the origins of Dragons and Galakrond that would make him decide to prevent himself from succeeding.

[Nymrohd]

Given the recent lore tidbits from Odyn it might be possible that Nozdormu will turn into Murozond without the intervention of the Old Gods. Really he could learn any number of things about the origins of Dragons and Galakrond that would make him decide to prevent himself from succeeding.

I honestly would rather Nozdormu went Murozond for something grounded and simple. E.g. to save Soridormi. Fuck antediluvian lizard gods having existential crisis, give me something relatable.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I honestly would rather Nozdormu went Murozond for something grounded and simple. E.g. to save Soridormi. Fuck antediluvian lizard gods having existential crisis, give me something relatable.

It doesn't need to be. Being screwed over by "life" is pretty messed up and understandable. Whining about Soridormi wouldn't work as well without much build up.

[Nymrohd]

It doesn't need to be. Being screwed over by "life" is pretty messed up and understandable. Whining about Soridormi wouldn't work as well without much build up.

There is nothing relatable about an immortal whining about the consequences of immortality. But having spent most of your immortality with someone you love and knowing they will be taken from you seems more understandable to me.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

There is nothing relatable about an immortal whining about the consequences of immortality. But having spent most of your immortality with someone you love and knowing they will be taken from you seems more understandable to me.

That isn't what I meant or what I got from the short/Nozdormu's fate.

[Revamp Man]

The Light and Void want to convert/corrupt everything. Life also seems to just want to flourish, even if it leads to bad results (Draenor).

I think the biggest hint that Azeroth is special is that the Jailer specifically needed Azeroth to use the machine to link the Zereths (see: Firim's report) and end existence. He needed Azeroth so badly that he spent ages hyperfocused on it. But why? Why would a world soul allow access to the machine? If any old First One creation could do it he could've just used Denathrius or another Eternal One.

We are told the void wants that
We were also told that the Titans created everything

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Given the recent lore tidbits from Odyn it might be possible that Nozdormu will turn into Murozond without the intervention of the Old Gods. Really he could learn any number of things about the origins of Dragons and Galakrond that would make him decide to prevent himself from succeeding.

Moruzond wants to allow galakrond to succeed so we go to stop him in the past
We succeed and Moruzond goes into the future of the hour of twilight

[Sondrelk]

There is nothing relatable about an immortal whining about the consequences of immortality. But having spent most of your immortality with someone you love and knowing they will be taken from you seems more understandable to me.

It's not really an immortal getting salty he is immortal though. Nozdormu would likely learn something or other that convinces him that the Titans plan is bogus, spurring him to attempt subverting it, likely dragging other dragons along with him who also think the Titans are not as great as they might have seemed.

Honestly, something as simple as learning the truth about Galakrond as a Titan experiment could set him off.

[Revamp Man]

But Argus is not the unmaker. He was MADE the unmaker in a deeply unnatural way. There is nothing telling us that the Titans had specific aspects naturally. Perhaps they visited Zereth Ordos and each gained a specific insight into a facet of the cosmos. Perhaps they are just cosmically powerful creatures and each of them had a preference for some type of magic and studied something more extensively than the rest.

Schroedinger's titan

[Sondrelk]

We are told the void wants that
We were also told that the Titans created everything

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Moruzond wants to allow galakrond to succeed so we go to stop him in the past
We succeed and Moruzond goes into the future of the hour of twilight

I really hope Blizzard remembers that we are supposed to kill Murozond in the End Time dungeon.
I don't care that it's several years old, from a patch that players generally disliked. It's too perfect a storytelling beat to have us send Murozond almost literally into our own past to be killed.

[Nymrohd]

It's not really an immortal getting salty he is immortal though. Nozdormu would likely learn something or other that convinces him that the Titans plan is bogus, spurring him to attempt subverting it, likely dragging other dragons along with him who also think the Titans are not as great as they might have seemed.

Honestly, something as simple as learning the truth about Galakrond as a Titan experiment could set him off.

But Galakrond was not a Titan Experiment. He was the unintended consequence of a titan experimented corrupted by the Old Gods.

Also shouldn't Nozdormu already know this? I mean isn't that what his power does?