Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

[8bithamster]

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

your opinion =/= objective... please stop using that word when you have no idea what it means. And again, if you really think more original areas instead of "OMG TINKER INSERT WE NEED GADGETZAN!!!!!!" that Teriz keeps spouting will utterly destroy wow, that's really more of a you problem than an "objective" fact

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A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

Ignore it, anyone who says their opinion is an objective fact really loses all credibility.

[Koollan]

A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

The thing is that Shadowlands will not be added to. There will be no more planes of Death, and I would bet legitimate money on it. Shadowlands is being left behind, and our next stops are likely the planes of Void and Light - and, predictably, those will go very badly.

This is coming from somebody who is legitimately extremely excited for Dragonflight, but given how they've completely discarded entire chunks of lore in Shadowlands in service of providing 'death mechanics' and making it so the fact that shamans and monks having ancestor spirits that they call upon is completely retconned... I really, really dread to see what the other planes would turn out to be. I'm super skeptical. If they did the Shadowlands like this, what makes us think that pulling more lore out of nowhere like that would go better the second time?

[Xilurm]

Excellent.

Sadly this will make people whine even more.

[Koollan]

your opinion =/= objective... please stop using that word when you have no idea what it means. And again, if you really think more original areas instead of "OMG TINKER INSERT WE NEED GADGETZAN!!!!!!" that Teriz keeps spouting will utterly destroy wow, that's really more of a you problem than an "objective" fact

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Ignore it, anyone who says their opinion is an objective fact really loses all credibility.

If you take a look at the sentiment from the WoW community as a whole, you will receive the same answer. In the eyes of the public, it is objective. The writing was poorly done. The execution was as well. I have never encountered a soul who believes otherwise, and I have my doubts that I ever will, until the rose tinted goggles come out in another expansion or two.

[Sondrelk]

A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

I think SL kinda proved ly longstanding theory correct in the sense that an expansion taking entirely place in a cosmic realm, or otherwise heavily influenced by one theme, doesn't really work.

Cosmic realms like the Shadowlands, Emerald Dream, or Argus would, and Idd work much better when it's the climactic finale to a more grounded expansion. Not when it's the main dish for two years.

Visual spectacle is easy, and making things different from eachother is also trivial. But that shouldn't mean you should go for it.

[Local Ardenweald Faerie]

Heyyy, popping back in after a few months.

Are the new levelling changes coming tomorrow? As in XP squish and all of that. I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Thanks.

[Hyrja]

Heyyy, popping back in after a few months.

Are the new levelling changes coming tomorrow? As in XP squish and all of that. I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Thanks.

Leveling changes are coming on 15 november with the Evokers

[Jaggler]

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all.

That's just flat out wrong. There are a countless number of afterlives.

[Local Ardenweald Faerie]

Leveling changes are coming on 15 november with the Evokers

Appreciate you!

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I think SL kinda proved ly longstanding theory correct in the sense that an expansion taking entirely place in a cosmic realm, or otherwise heavily influenced by one theme, doesn't really work.

Cosmic realms like the Shadowlands, Emerald Dream, or Argus would, and Idd work much better when it's the climactic finale to a more grounded expansion. Not when it's the main dish for two years.

Visual spectacle is easy, and making things different from eachother is also trivial. But that shouldn't mean you should go for it.

Thats not true at all. Cosmic realms can work, it just depends on execution. Don't be silly

Cosmic realms like the Shadowlands, Emerald Dream, or Argus would, and Idd work much better when it's the climactic finale to a more grounded expansion. Not when it's the main dish for two years.

That wasn't why people disliked Shadowlands but ok.

[wowrefugee]

Thats not true at all. Cosmic realms can work, it just depends on execution. Don't be silly





That wasn't why people disliked Shadowlands but ok.

There is no singular reason why people disliked Shadowlands as a setting. But there are plenty of players who have been for the past years asking to go back to Azeroth because being in a cosmic realm the entire time is not what players want from WoW.

The person you're replying to has a point. It's the same structure JRPGs use - start off grounded and end up fighting god in a cosmic realm - and for good reason.

[Sondrelk]

Thats not true at all. Cosmic realms can work, it just depends on execution. Don't be silly





That wasn't why people disliked Shadowlands but ok.

The main reason players disliked SL were because of the droughts, but even without that I got the impression noone was all that impressed with the Shadowlands as a place, beyond the visual spectacle.

I will admit i could be wrong and it's just personal taste, but i was never all that enthused by the Shadowlands, and constantly found myself wondering what it would have been like to have less out there ideas constantly.

I honestly found spending time in the Shadowlands kinda draining. The visuals never really allowed me to unwind like i could in Boralus or the Broken Isles.

This is why I much preferred Argus being one patch. It was visually stunning, and it gave the impression of importance easily. But since it was just one patch, even with it being the final patch and therefore quite long, i still didn't really get bored with it, or found it excessively tiring.

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Leveling changes are coming on 15 november with the Evokers

Pretty sure the new levelling is available instantly. The only thing that should change in that regard when the Dracthyr come out is the removal of the Winds of Wisdom 50% experience buff.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

Oh no, you can't brute force check something. I'm sure absolutely no one is working on being remotely smart about it to reduce the amount of possible permutations that need to be simulated... /s

I addressed that. Notice how I said "alternative calculation system".

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Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

Broadly agreed. I'd say it was a terrible idea to reveal so much about the afterlife and have us go through it as though it were just another tourist destination. It cheapens the finality of ascension to the afterlife and the mystique of death in itself. It's a final mystery that shouldn't be solved so haphazardly in any setting.

[MadamSerenity]

Pretty sure the new levelling is available instantly. The only thing that should change in that regard when the Dracthyr come out is the removal of the Winds of Wisdom 50% experience buff.

It's not. It will still be roughly the same amount of XP until Phase 2 when we get the beta amounts.

https://imgur.com/a/hmlDfrT

[Cheezits]

I know people like to shit on Shadowlands for not having Shaman content, but now that we're seeing Shaman stuff in Dragonflight... I think this was intentional?

The ancestral spirit stuff is not confirmed a retcon yet. There may absolutely be a place that some shamanistic spirits go that is NOT the Shadowlands. Or, the Shaman afterlife will get mentioned here now that Shamanism is relevant to the expansion. We already see that Wild Gods go to restore in the Dream and multiple gods snatch up souls on Azeroth.

We're getting heavy hints that Elements come from the Lifelands or some sector of it, so I think that the Ancestral Plane being retconed into a place for Shaman spirits to chill in the Lifelands would be cool and make some sense.

Also: Monks and Shamans use the same energy. It was 100% intentional to leave them out at the same time.

[AOL Instant Messenger]

your opinion =/= objective... please stop using that word when you have no idea what it means. And again, if you really think more original areas instead of "OMG TINKER INSERT WE NEED GADGETZAN!!!!!!" that Teriz keeps spouting will utterly destroy wow, that's really more of a you problem than an "objective" fact.

Foul. Logical fallacy. False dichotomy.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Foul. Logical fallacy. False dichotomy.

Don't enourage the Tinker liker. You don't need to be a devil's advocate all the time.

[Revamp Man]

so tomorrow expect
1. broken talent loadout system saying you have too many when you have maybe 1
2. UI constantly resetting and giving LUA errors
3. broken addons
4. wonky scaling in all dungeons
5. people in trade bitching about where evokers and events are

[therumblings]

so tomorrow expect
1. broken talent loadout system saying you have too many when you have maybe 1
2. UI constantly resetting and giving LUA errors
3. broken addons
4. wonky scaling in all dungeons
5. people in trade bitching about where evokers and events are

Hit the nail on the head lol