Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Gorsameth]

I figure somebody will make an alternative calculation system, but this bodes well if true. It means that we won't see the "cookie-cutter" builds people were worried about, at least not until field testing becomes more plausible.

we had cookie cutter builds before sims existed. They are never going to go away.

Oh no, you can't brute force check something. I'm sure absolutely no one is working on being remotely smart about it to reduce the amount of possible permutations that need to be simulated... /s

[Berkilak]

Ye, you forgot that with this huge talent revamp for everyone, there will be constant adjustments. As they said, it takes currently 5 full days to imprfectly sim a spec. GL doing it back to back only to start over because something has changed.

I think you're overestimating how much variation there will be. For the most part, we still have "pick these for single-target," "pick these for AoE," "pick these for PvP," and so on. If you have a singular goal, there's only going to be a couple ways to achieve that goal. If you're looking to pump single-target, why are you simming AoE talents? Why are you simming all first/second-tier talent builds? There's so much useless junk going on. A bot can very easily know what is worth simming and what is not.

Give it a couple weeks.

[Forum Man]

Ye, you forgot that with this huge talent revamp for everyone, there will be constant adjustments. As they said, it takes currently 5 full days to imprfectly sim a spec. GL doing it back to back only to start over because something has changed.

I'm using this prepatch to just have tons of fun
I'm going venthyr on my WW for the covenant ability we never used

Might see if I can turn my DK into a zookeeper
No aoe on my pally
Ultra fire Mage with big pyros

Gonna be a crazy time

[Koollan]

Please no.. We don't need an expansion gadgetzan. I'd much rather have some originality.

Much rather see some stuff from other planes. So much things they can do with that.

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

[huth]

Ye, you forgot that with this huge talent revamp for everyone, there will be constant adjustments. As they said, it takes currently 5 full days to imprfectly sim a spec. GL doing it back to back only to start over because something has changed.

What takes 5 days is simming every possible talent setup for the spec tree. Many of those are not going to be sensible options to begin with and are basically just a waste of time. You could massively decrease the time required by cutting it down to only those that might actually be good.

All this means is that bruteforcing isn't going to be a viable and sensible method of doing it.

[Throren]

Speaking about other drake types - are there even wild versions of the wylder- and velocidrakes on the isles? It felt super weird to just get them as random quest rewards without any story connection or backstory on them.

There's a member of the blue Dragonflight that uses the Wlyderdrake model that you meet in Azure span. He's got the -gos name ending, talks and everything

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

[8bithamster]

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

your opinion =/= objective... please stop using that word when you have no idea what it means. And again, if you really think more original areas instead of "OMG TINKER INSERT WE NEED GADGETZAN!!!!!!" that Teriz keeps spouting will utterly destroy wow, that's really more of a you problem than an "objective" fact

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A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

Ignore it, anyone who says their opinion is an objective fact really loses all credibility.

[Koollan]

A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

The thing is that Shadowlands will not be added to. There will be no more planes of Death, and I would bet legitimate money on it. Shadowlands is being left behind, and our next stops are likely the planes of Void and Light - and, predictably, those will go very badly.

This is coming from somebody who is legitimately extremely excited for Dragonflight, but given how they've completely discarded entire chunks of lore in Shadowlands in service of providing 'death mechanics' and making it so the fact that shamans and monks having ancestor spirits that they call upon is completely retconned... I really, really dread to see what the other planes would turn out to be. I'm super skeptical. If they did the Shadowlands like this, what makes us think that pulling more lore out of nowhere like that would go better the second time?

[Xilurm]

Excellent.

Sadly this will make people whine even more.

[Koollan]

your opinion =/= objective... please stop using that word when you have no idea what it means. And again, if you really think more original areas instead of "OMG TINKER INSERT WE NEED GADGETZAN!!!!!!" that Teriz keeps spouting will utterly destroy wow, that's really more of a you problem than an "objective" fact

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Ignore it, anyone who says their opinion is an objective fact really loses all credibility.

If you take a look at the sentiment from the WoW community as a whole, you will receive the same answer. In the eyes of the public, it is objective. The writing was poorly done. The execution was as well. I have never encountered a soul who believes otherwise, and I have my doubts that I ever will, until the rose tinted goggles come out in another expansion or two.

[Sondrelk]

A different plane of existance not used in a way players want doesn't mean other planes of existance shouldn't be used. Dumb agrument and if they wanted to add other afterlives in SL they can they have an Arbiter for that or even completely change it. Its their lore they can do it.

I think SL kinda proved ly longstanding theory correct in the sense that an expansion taking entirely place in a cosmic realm, or otherwise heavily influenced by one theme, doesn't really work.

Cosmic realms like the Shadowlands, Emerald Dream, or Argus would, and Idd work much better when it's the climactic finale to a more grounded expansion. Not when it's the main dish for two years.

Visual spectacle is easy, and making things different from eachother is also trivial. But that shouldn't mean you should go for it.

[Knight of the Astral Star]

Heyyy, popping back in after a few months.

Are the new levelling changes coming tomorrow? As in XP squish and all of that. I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Thanks.

[Hyrja]

Heyyy, popping back in after a few months.

Are the new levelling changes coming tomorrow? As in XP squish and all of that. I can't seem to find an answer anywhere.

Thanks.

Leveling changes are coming on 15 november with the Evokers

[Jaggler]

Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all.

That's just flat out wrong. There are a countless number of afterlives.

[Knight of the Astral Star]

Leveling changes are coming on 15 november with the Evokers

Appreciate you!

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I think SL kinda proved ly longstanding theory correct in the sense that an expansion taking entirely place in a cosmic realm, or otherwise heavily influenced by one theme, doesn't really work.

Cosmic realms like the Shadowlands, Emerald Dream, or Argus would, and Idd work much better when it's the climactic finale to a more grounded expansion. Not when it's the main dish for two years.

Visual spectacle is easy, and making things different from eachother is also trivial. But that shouldn't mean you should go for it.

Thats not true at all. Cosmic realms can work, it just depends on execution. Don't be silly

Cosmic realms like the Shadowlands, Emerald Dream, or Argus would, and Idd work much better when it's the climactic finale to a more grounded expansion. Not when it's the main dish for two years.

That wasn't why people disliked Shadowlands but ok.

[wowrefugee]

Thats not true at all. Cosmic realms can work, it just depends on execution. Don't be silly





That wasn't why people disliked Shadowlands but ok.

There is no singular reason why people disliked Shadowlands as a setting. But there are plenty of players who have been for the past years asking to go back to Azeroth because being in a cosmic realm the entire time is not what players want from WoW.

The person you're replying to has a point. It's the same structure JRPGs use - start off grounded and end up fighting god in a cosmic realm - and for good reason.

[Sondrelk]

Thats not true at all. Cosmic realms can work, it just depends on execution. Don't be silly





That wasn't why people disliked Shadowlands but ok.

The main reason players disliked SL were because of the droughts, but even without that I got the impression noone was all that impressed with the Shadowlands as a place, beyond the visual spectacle.

I will admit i could be wrong and it's just personal taste, but i was never all that enthused by the Shadowlands, and constantly found myself wondering what it would have been like to have less out there ideas constantly.

I honestly found spending time in the Shadowlands kinda draining. The visuals never really allowed me to unwind like i could in Boralus or the Broken Isles.

This is why I much preferred Argus being one patch. It was visually stunning, and it gave the impression of importance easily. But since it was just one patch, even with it being the final patch and therefore quite long, i still didn't really get bored with it, or found it excessively tiring.

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Leveling changes are coming on 15 november with the Evokers

Pretty sure the new levelling is available instantly. The only thing that should change in that regard when the Dracthyr come out is the removal of the Winds of Wisdom 50% experience buff.

[Le Conceptuel]

Oh no, you can't brute force check something. I'm sure absolutely no one is working on being remotely smart about it to reduce the amount of possible permutations that need to be simulated... /s

I addressed that. Notice how I said "alternative calculation system".

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Shadowlands was one of the planes and they pretty objectively ruined the mysticism of death in its entirety. They also said 'f you' to shamans and monks. Their afterlives don't even exist at all. Imho, they'd provide similar treatments to the other planes of magic. It would largely be ruinous to WoW as a whole if we explored more of these planes. The only one I could fathom us going back to is the Emerald Dream, given that it's one of the already-explored-partially planes. We'd best leave all of the others alone until proper depth is added to each of their lores in prior expansions.

Broadly agreed. I'd say it was a terrible idea to reveal so much about the afterlife and have us go through it as though it were just another tourist destination. It cheapens the finality of ascension to the afterlife and the mystique of death in itself. It's a final mystery that shouldn't be solved so haphazardly in any setting.