Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[micwini]

Thank god the short login screen music was just placeholder!

[Beefhammer]

Thank god the short login screen music was just placeholder!

Proving once again MMO-champion is just full of the sky is falling chicken littles that do not understand how to be patient.

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How often are we going to, all of a sudden, find and explore mysteriously hidden islands? Happened three times now (Pandaria, Broken Isles, Dragon Isles) - the trope is overused already.

We didn't all of a sudden happen to find them as if they were missed on the map. Pandaria was shrouded in mists. Dragon Isles were hidden by the Dragonflight. Broken Isles and Zandalar were already known and discovered, we had no reason to go there previously.

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This engine has reached its limit. Everything from implementing new features to simple bugfixing has become too problematic. They should have started making a new one 1-2 expansions ago. I can get why they haven't done it yet because that would be a lot of money to invest for an old game in a niche genre. It's easier to make 10 mobile games and get better revenue from them.

The engine gets updated every expansion and works fine for what they are doing. The cost to make a new one then port or remake the game into the new one is way too resource prohibitive.

[Zebir95]

The engine gets updated every expansion and works fine for what they are doing. The cost to make a new one then port or remake the game into the new one is way too resource prohibitive.

It doesn't work fine if what ion said about player housing is true. They cannot implement certain features because the engine doesn't allow it. And we're not talking about rocket science, but things other games already have.

You're right on the cost and i think that's the only reason they're still milking the old engine.

[Beefhammer]

[B]

It doesn't work fine if what ion said about player housing is true. They cannot implement certain feature because the engine doesn't allow it. And we're not talking about rocket science, but features other games already have.

You're right on the cost and i think that's the only reason they're still milking the old engine.

I did say for what they are doing. They werea ble to figure out the main backpack issue and other issues, Garrisons show they have a the basics for housing if they wanted to do it, it is just a matter of time before they find a fix.

[Nymrohd]

This engine has reached its limit. Everything from implementing new features to simple bugfixing has become too problematic. They should have started making a new one 1-2 expansions ago. I can get why they haven't done it yet because that would be a lot of money to invest for an old game in a niche genre. It's easier to make 10 mobile games and get better revenue from them.

I don't think it is realistic to suggest a new engine this late in the game. It would be impossible to port the existing game in a new engine, they'd probably have to redo so much from scratch. Better make a new game at that point.

[Lahis]

I don't think it is realistic to suggest a new engine this late in the game. It would be impossible to port the existing game in a new engine, they'd probably have to redo so much from scratch. Better make a new game at that point.

And everyone knows there will never be new game so some features like housing is forever off the table.

[Zebir95]

I did say for what they are doing. They werea ble to figure out the main backpack issue and other issues, Garrisons show they have a the basics for housing if they wanted to do it, it is just a matter of time before they find a fix.

You can work on it as much as you want but the engine can only go so far. You will never have a fully free housing system. It will always be something clunkier than what people expect it to be, like having fixed spots for the items etc. They do a good job in finding ways to make something work and that's true, but you can clearly see the how limited they are.

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I don't think it is realistic to suggest a new engine this late in the game. It would be impossible to port the existing game in a new engine, they'd probably have to redo so much from scratch. Better make a new game at that point.

Oh i know that. A new engine is what the game needs, but i know the chances to of it happening are almost 0. People should just accept it and move on.

[Sondrelk]

And everyone knows there will never be new game so some features like housing is forever off the table.

Didnt Ion mention housing in some interview where he talked about Dragonflight not being the right time for housing? Or did I just imagine him saying something to that effect?
I know that I argued that housing would only really work if it was coupled with a world revamp, or otherwise some expansion with heavy emphasis on Stormwind and Orgrimmar, but I feel like Ion vaguely said something in that direction as well.

I don't think the issue with housing is that it's impossible to have in WoW. Just that it would be excessively difficult to implement in any way that satisfies those that are used to stuff like Wildstar or similar.
The amount of effort that would be required just for the basic stuff like asset placement would be immense, and I doubt they would do all of that in one go.

[Nymrohd]

And everyone knows there will never be new game so some features like housing is forever off the table.

I guess you could still have some very limited housing but then one would wonder what the point is. Pre build, pre decorated, very limited item hooks (things like how the archeology pristine relics phase in from existing doodads or how the Tier sets show up in the Class Halls).

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Didnt Ion mention housing in some interview where he talked about Dragonflight not being the right time for housing? Or did I just imagine him saying something to that effect?
I know that I argued that housing would only really work if it was coupled with a world revamp, or otherwise some expansion with heavy emphasis on Stormwind and Orgrimmar, but I feel like Ion vaguely said something in that direction as well.

I think someone said they completely ruled housing off on Preach's interviews because of engine limitations. Which obviously sucks.

[Zebir95]

Didnt Ion mention housing in some interview where he talked about Dragonflight not being the right time for housing? Or did I just imagine him saying something to that effect?
I know that I argued that housing would only really work if it was coupled with a world revamp, or otherwise some expansion with heavy emphasis on Stormwind and Orgrimmar, but I feel like Ion vaguely said something in that direction as well.

I don't think the issue with housing is that it's impossible to have in WoW. Just that it would be excessively difficult to implement in any way that satisfies those that are used to stuff like Wildstar or similar.
The amount of effort that would be required just for the basic stuff like asset placement would be immense, and I doubt they would do all of that in one go.

Preach said on stream yday that he talked with ion about player housing and he basically said that the current engine wouldn't support it. So, to have player housing you'll need to have a new engine.

[Nymrohd]

Preach said on stream yday that he talked with ion about player housing and he basically said that the current engine wouldn't support it. So, to have player housing you'll need to have a new engine.

Or a new game. Azeroth Real Estate! Selling Azeroth?

[Zebir95]

Or a new game. Azeroth Real Estate! Selling Azeroth?

A new warcraft mmo would be amazing, but they don't really have a reason to develop it. Wow is 18 years old and is still the top (second top, depending on what you believe) of its genre. They have no reason to push for another mmo especially considering the cost. Maybe things will change once the riot mmo is out.

[Fahrad Wagner]

Yes boiiiii, there's a long version!

So happy there is a long version indeed!

[Sondrelk]

So happy there is a long version indeed!

Love the bit with the violin. Going to assume that is the music for the Azure Span, to really make it sound similar to Grizzly Hills and Howling Fjords.

[Fahrad Wagner]

Love the bit with the violin. Going to assume that is the music for the Azure Span, to really make it sound similar to Grizzly Hills and Howling Fjords.

I was just about to comment on this, it's definitely a throwback to Grizzly Hills, and a well executed one I must say! Looking forward to hear all the other music pieces they have in store for this expansion!

[Nymrohd]

A new warcraft mmo would be amazing, but they don't really have a reason to develop it. Wow is 18 years old and is still the top (second top, depending on what you believe) of its genre. They have no reason to push for another mmo especially considering the cost. Maybe things will change once the riot mmo is out.

First off, was joking. Second the joke was not for the new game to be an MMO, it was for it to be a Sims real estate game completely about building properties (and maybe selling them?)

[Prenderghast]

Didnt Ion mention housing in some interview where he talked about Dragonflight not being the right time for housing? Or did I just imagine him saying something to that effect?
I know that I argued that housing would only really work if it was coupled with a world revamp, or otherwise some expansion with heavy emphasis on Stormwind and Orgrimmar, but I feel like Ion vaguely said something in that direction as well.

I don't think the issue with housing is that it's impossible to have in WoW. Just that it would be excessively difficult to implement in any way that satisfies those that are used to stuff like Wildstar or similar.
The amount of effort that would be required just for the basic stuff like asset placement would be immense, and I doubt they would do all of that in one go.

Yep - it was in Ion's interview with Hazelnuttygames the week of DF reveal (full thing is on youtube if you want to watch it). Hazel asked what sorts of considerations take features such as player housing on or off of the table.

Ion said that player housing is something many people on the team want, but that they want to do it the right way, and to do so would take a huge amount of effort and probably wouldn't be something they implement all in one go. He called back to WoD garrisons and addressed how they were a let-down in regards to customizability, and elaborated on the "it would cost a raid tier" line that is often thrown around. Basic jist of his answer: The devs want it, it would be really hard and would come at the cost of something else, they're not planning on it for Dragonflight, but the dream lives on.

All in all it was a pretty well-explained and reasonable answer. If she had just asked something like "player housing when" I think she wouldn't have gotten so much out of him; but asking more about the considerations that go into that sort of decision lent itself to a more interesting take.

That interview was in April of this year and is the most recent insight on player housing that I know of, although based on other comments in this thread it sounds like Preach may have addressed it recently as well.

[infinitemeridian]

Yep - it was in Ion's interview with Hazelnuttygames the week of DF reveal (full thing is on youtube if you want to watch it). Hazel asked what sorts of considerations take features such as player housing on or off of the table.

Ion said that player housing is something many people on the team want, but that they want to do it the right way, and to do so would take a huge amount of effort and probably wouldn't be something they implement all in one go. He called back to WoD garrisons and addressed how they were a let-down in regards to customizability, and elaborated on the "it would cost a raid tier" line that is often thrown around. Basic jist of his answer: The devs want it, it would be really hard and would come at the cost of something else, they're not planning on it for Dragonflight, but the dream lives on.

All in all it was a pretty well-explained and reasonable answer. If she had just asked something like "player housing when" I think she wouldn't have gotten so much out of him; but asking more about the considerations that go into that sort of decision lent itself to a more interesting take.

That interview was in April of this year and is the most recent insight on player housing that I know of, although based on other comments in this thread it sounds like Preach may have addressed it recently as well.

The real problem is the playerbase doesn't want it. Bring up housing and half of this website will tell you it's "pointless". They just want to raidlog and call it a day.

[Sondrelk]

The real problem is the playerbase doesn't want it. Bring up housing and half of this website will tell you it's "pointless". They just want to raidlog and call it a day.

I think it's more that making housing good would take an extremely large amount of upfront development before it could end up good. And that endpoint is basically just another collection tab like transmog and battle pets.

Just doesn't seem worth it for what should ideally not interact with player power at all.

[Arafal]

The real problem is the playerbase doesn't want it. Bring up housing and half of this website will tell you it's "pointless". They just want to raidlog and call it a day.

MMO Champion is not in any way, shape or form an indicator for general sentiment of the playerbase.