Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Vasoka]

So, by the end of the month the raid testing may be considered done, correct? And the rest of the features may as well take 2 weeks at most to be implemented properly.

It really seems that 9.2 is heading towards early-mid February.

Ofc. Lost Ark, Swtor xpac, end of dragons - all in February. It means Blizzard need to hit as well at the same time so the bleeding is tolerable.

[Foreign Exchange Ztudent]

By the way: Happy New Year @ all.

Any interesting developments in the last 2 weeks?

No, Raid Testing is ending next week. Blizzard was cheeky saying that Eternity's End doesn't have a release date indicating that it is coming soon and the Council is dead as Retail Devs are too afraid to post responses.
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https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...details/334518


Cutoff 18th of January. Raid Testing ending next week if they test more additional Raid Finders if not it ends in the last week of January. February 8th/15th seems likely as Eternity's End Release Date.

[Lmaop]

Blizzard needs to have severe case of sniffing their own farts if they think they can release their patch in 9.2 and compete with the games in that month, and im not even talking mmos

So probally whats gonna happen

[Teriz]

Product sales and success of product does not equate a good experience for the consumer. When will this go into peoples' heads?

I had a good experience with a product. I think people feel that if they hate something, it must be the same for everyone else. That isn't always the case. I did not hate my experience with BFA. As I said before, questing in Kul'tiras and Zandalar were good experiences for me as a player, and I thoroughly enjoyed myself.

Like I said, everyone has their own opinions. One size doesn't fit all.

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Solid, decent, playable... probably. I think, despite all my own criticisms, BfA was at least "okay", or close to it. Not great, not stellar, not especially impressive, and certainly not good with lore, but by 8.2 at least? Maybe. I never played in 8.3 though, so I can't speak for Visions or anything.

Unfortunately "okay" just isn't enough for me anymore.

I found the new continents and environments very impressive. Also the quests were very well done. The overall story of BFA was just okay, and there were some serious letdowns as the expansion progressed. However, I feel that people are being overly dramatic acting like playing through BFA was some sort of torturous experience.

[Lady Atia]

I wouldn't be even that shocked if this prediction turned out to be false.

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New disc mount modeled after Jailer's nipples?

I actually hope for a soul eater rather than another disc mount. Also I have no clue what you have against nipples, lol.

[Nokster10]

I had a good experience with a product. I think people feel that if they hate something, it must be the same for everyone else. That isn't always the case. I did not hate my experience with BFA. As I said before, questing in Kul'tiras and Zandalar were good experiences for me as a player, and I thoroughly enjoyed myself.

Like I said, everyone has their own opinions. One size doesn't fit all.

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I found the new continents and environments very impressive. Also the quests were very well done. The overall story of BFA was just okay, and there were some serious letdowns as the expansion progressed. However, I feel that people are being overly dramatic acting like playing through BFA was some sort of torturous experience.

You're talking like the expansion is all about the questing experience and story. But guess what, that's just a tiny part of it. What about the systems, azerite armor being complete dogshit balance wise , method of aquisition etc. What about warfronts being just pointless and impossible to lose? What about island expeditions being just spammable farming spots for azerite? Incredibly unbalanced corruptions? Corruption vendor with weekly rotations(lmao) ?

Add that all together and the expansion was below mediocre, but hey for you it was a good expansion because you liked 3 quests

[EbaumsTipster]

I mean, most people say SL is dumpster-tier solely because of the story (note: not the zone stories! just the main one) and the "feel", so objective expansion rating is out the window now.

[Lmaop]

I dont understand why you guys arguing about if BfA was good or "solid" or whatver
The only people whose opinions matter, blizzard, obviously fucking not agree with you because Shadowlands is nothing like BFA. So internally they either thought it was shit, it was received badly, or both.
Like no matter how you spin it its just wrong

[EbaumsTipster]

I dont understand why you guys arguing about if BfA was good or "solid" or whatver
The only people whose opinions matter, blizzard, obviously fucking not agree with you because Shadowlands is nothing like BFA. So internally they either thought it was shit, it was received badly, or both.
Like no matter how you spin it its just wrong

Yeah, it should be noted the biggest problem for people in Shadowlands is the story/cosmic feel and lack of Azeroth, NOT anything mechanical.

[infinitemeridian]

You're talking like the expansion is all about the questing experience and story. But guess what, that's just a tiny part of it. What about the systems, azerite armor being complete dogshit balance wise , method of aquisition etc. What about warfronts being just pointless and impossible to lose? What about island expeditions being just spammable farming spots for azerite? Incredibly unbalanced corruptions? Corruption vendor with weekly rotations(lmao) ?

Add that all together and the expansion was below mediocre, but hey for you it was a good expansion because you liked 3 quests

I think you greatly underestimate just how important tone and setting is for an open world game.

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Yeah, it should be noted the biggest problem for people in Shadowlands is the story/cosmic feel and lack of Azeroth, NOT anything mechanical.

I think it's the biggest problem, but it's not the only problem. Lack of interesting content, what we have being pretty phoned in, etc. definitely still contributes.

[Dracullus]

It's not like those 24-hour sales mean nothing for MMORPGs anyway. New World sold roughly 850.000 copies within 24 hours and already lost 90% of those players after 3 months. While the record itself is great, it doesn't tell anything about the longevity of Shadowlands at all.

Who said about longevity? I said it's bullshit that SL "game breaking issues" are theme or covenants, cause it was popular on launch, even more than usual (although it would be unfair to say lockdown had nothing to do with it).

Also, which I didn't mention in previous post, forums were pretty chill and quiet first months, I clearly remember people saying that honeymoon is longer than usual. Problem is that we waited 3 months for any news about future, 5 months for PTR and 7 months for new content. In Legion we got patch after 1.5 month... And remember that fast patch not only provides content, but also is reaction for feedback that can fix potential or minor issues that will grow in time (Torghast, no gearing path for casuals after 200). Imagine 7 months of Legion with undertuned EN and before legendary tuning.

You know what theme people hated (not everyone of course, but substantial amount)? MoP on launch and reveal. And numbers clearly show this as well.

Btw, funny that you disregard this number so easily on various occasions as indicator of WoW stability, even if it's official stable number you get every ~two years. Yet when you tried to prove TBC Classic is more popular than SL you used... google trends, and when you claimed FF14 is currently most popular MMO.. wait, did you back it up with anything?

[Lmaop]

Yeah, it should be noted the biggest problem for people in Shadowlands is the story/cosmic feel and lack of Azeroth, NOT anything mechanical.

And to add on to that BFA in contrast WAS build like Legion, most of it systems either extensions or spins on Legion design (i think they even might said this but dont quote me on that, im not sure) .

So its pretty safe to assume that blizzard thought legion was good/well-received and bfa was not, hence the change in Shadowlands.

Which pretty much minmaps with general discussion about those expansions imo.

[EbaumsTipster]

If Blizz confirmed more about the Azeroth plotlines that would be followed up on post-Shadowlands, people would be more forgiving. 2 year filler is a dumb idea. (Lesson to be learned from Shadowlands: people care more about WoW lore and setting than they do WoW characters)

Edit: Looks like they are not interested in community council stuff about retail at the moment, so I'm guessing they have given up on Shadowlands and are waiting on expansion reveal to discuss retial.

[Nokster10]

I think you greatly underestimate just how important tone and setting is for an open world game.

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I think you overestimate how open world wow is. Literally every single piece of relevant content is instanced.

[infinitemeridian]

I think you overestimate how open world wow is. Literally every single piece of relevant content is instanced.

Do you think tone and setting do not extend to instanced content? And sure, maybe only "relevant" content is instanced, but that doesn't change the fact that 99% of the time is spent in either:

-Oribos
-The afterlive zones
-covenant sanctum

[UndedoKoleda]

No, it was evidenced long before Chronicle doubled down on it. Also, it is 100% conclusive. They didn't just draw the four known old gods and then rAnDoMLy decide they were going to add in a 5th unknown one just to fill space. They also wouldn't bother adding in the line in her artifact's history specifically pointing out that one of theories of her origin is being the remnant of a old god for no reason. Or Xal'atath's line where she very clearly indicates that there used to be more than four.

Xal'atath does not speak at all like a minion of the Old Gods. She has zero respect for any of them, to the point of dismissiveness, insults, or even open hostility towards their forces. She frequently uses "us" and "we" in reference to the other Old Gods specifically, not their forces.

Everything about her suggests that she was a 5th old god destroyed at some point by the other four.

About the bolded part- there was an interview with the artist, where he answers questions regarding the artwork of Chronicles and it seems that some pieces are indeed just randomly added.


https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ight=interview

The interview itself:
https://kiraser-eng.blogspot.com/202...author-of.html

Kiraser: There’s this question about one of your Chronicle vol.3 artworks, that still intrigues me to this day. The book opens with the picture of the Old Gods. 4 of them are all known to the players, but the 5th one looks like a Cthulhu of sorts. So my question is, whether it was some sort of a nod to the existence of another big Old God on Azeroth (like, in Battle for Azeroth there are 2 characters that kind of count as such: G'huun and Xal'atath)? Or maybe it was just a Cthulhu-reference?

I understand that if it’s a big plot-twist secret Old God, you can’t reveal it. I'm just curious if the “Cthulhu” was more than a reference.

Joseph: Hey, Tried to find some of my references for this drawing but at the end I think that I made this one up. So no big plot twisted secret, sorry ^_^

He doesn't deny it 100%, maybe he just really forgot. I think that if he was afraid of breaking NDA by answering this, he would have stated so, like he does later in the interview.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

And to add on to that BFA in contrast WAS build like Legion, most of it systems either extensions or spins on Legion design (i think they even might said this but dont quote me on that, im not sure) .

So its pretty safe to assume that blizzard thought legion was good/well-received and bfa was not, hence the change in Shadowlands.

Which pretty much minmaps with general discussion about those expansions imo.

The theme isn't what people are whining about.

You know what theme people hated (not everyone of course, but substantial amount)? MoP on launch and reveal. And numbers clearly show this as well.

Cause people(Those kind anyways) are superficial.

[EbaumsTipster]

Cause people(Those kind anyways) are superficial.

It doesn't matter, those are the customers. People hated Mists theme so they dipped and hated the expansion, even if people today are more friendly towards it. The same thing is happening to Shadowlands.

It doesn't matter if it's wrong or right, it's just reality. And it WILL reflect on the next expansion where they are ALREADY trying to plead to the customers that it will be different (see: Ion mentioning Goldshire)

[Lmaop]

Do you think tone and setting do not extend to instanced content? And sure, maybe only "relevant" content is instanced, but that doesn't change the fact that 99% of the time is spent in either:

-Oribos
-The afterlive zones
-covenant sanctum

I agree with nogster here. I think if you would make a chart of mmorpg where themes of open world matters wow come up probally last. Its just not what people buy and play this game nowadays. Does that mean it doesnt matter at all or to nobody? No but themes of an expansion never saved or doomed an expansion in the past. The "pandaland" theme that was paned was one of the most stable xpacs and retroactively one of the most revered meanwhile the "hecking poggers" back to tbc WoD expansion with the Orcs to "back to old warcraft" is a shitstain and the peak of raid or die where the subs tanked so hard they didnt even showed it anymore. Shadowmoon valley could looked like Storm Peaks and nothing would change

This is a game where one of the endgame activities is to farm the same 8 dungeons for 2 years with the same lootable for fucks sake. You guys need to understand that this is the game now. They are better alternatives for people that want enjoy a story or 3d modeled overworld so its logical it matters alot less to people here

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The theme isn't what people are whining about.


Cause people(Those kind anyways) are superficial.

Did you misquote me because nowhere in the post you quoted did i mention theme?

[Makabreska]

It doesn't matter, those are the customers. People hated Mists theme so they dipped and hated the expansion, even if people today are more friendly towards it. The same thing is happening to Shadowlands.

It doesn't matter if it's wrong or right, it's just reality. And all it will reflect on is the next expansion where they are ALREADY trying to plead to the customers that it will be different (see: Ion mentioning Goldshire)

I mean, how many people hated it? Vocal minority, who laughed "kung-fu panda lol"? You always have these each expansion. We had people being mad and going "twilight lol" when they saw Cata's Worgens. No sane dev will listen to those, and "going back to Azeroth" comment was not based on them. The exhaustion of grand, cosmic themes is real among players and devs, as it limits the possible future stories. Scaling it down is only natural, especially if SL is the finale of a big story project that spans multiple expansions.