Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Ersula]

And let's be real. One would have to be pretty stupid mentally to remain defiant against Alleria Windrunner, first mortal in the history of the Cosmos to successfully defy the Shadows' whisperes, and Turalyon, most famous Paladin in history, who was turned by a Naaru into an immortal guardian of the Cosmos.

She says she successfully defied the Shadow's whispers. But based on the Nightborne acquisition questline, she's not in control of anything: Then after almost accidently corrupting the sunwell, instantly, Alleria insists she's fine & wants to go back to the sunwell as soon as possible. Her "ability to control the void" is based on nothing. She is the one being controlled.

At best she's in deep denial, or at worst she's already fully corrupted and being used as some sort of void sleeper-cell.

[Varodoc]

She says she successfully defied the Shadow's whispers. But based on the Nightborne acquisition questline, she's not in control of anything: Then after almost accidently corrupting the sunwell, instantly, Alleria insists she's fine & wants to go back to the sunwell as soon as possible. Her "ability to control the void" is based on nothing. She is the one being controlled.

At best she's in deep denial, or at worst she's already fully corrupted and being used as some sort of void sleeper-cell.

She never says this. Blizzard does. On their official website. With this I accept your concession.

[ExiHext]

Damn, this conversation beats all the Great Arguments of 2021!

Yep, and all because I dared to express myself inaccurate (which I already admitted a page earlier). On the other hand I think everyone with half a braincell must have understood what I was trying to say.
Doesn't matter, the titans were made by the First Ones...be it from robots, arcane energy or whatever. They are constructs...like they made constructs...and then those made vrykul and earthen.

[Ersula]

She never says this. Blizzard does. On their official website. With this I accept your concession.

The official website has also said trolls are a vegetable.

[Paperfox]

The official website has also said trolls are a vegetable.

What about Gnomes? I've heard they're quite good in soup.

[Makorus]

She says she successfully defied the Shadow's whispers. But based on the Nightborne acquisition questline, she's not in control of anything: Then after almost accidently corrupting the sunwell, instantly, Alleria insists she's fine & wants to go back to the sunwell as soon as possible. Her "ability to control the void" is based on nothing. She is the one being controlled.

At best she's in deep denial, or at worst she's already fully corrupted and being used as some sort of void sleeper-cell.

No, you don't understand. Her constantly having voices in her head telling her to kill everyone around her, and those voices getting stronger and stronger is totally her being in control. Just like her almost fucking over her own people (and probably the whole world) was totally in her control, because she "defied the Shadow's whispers" (except when she doesn't, like in the comic, where she gets affected by them somewhat emotionally, or after N'zoth gets killed, where she says the whispers are getting stronger).

[Varodoc]

The official website has also said trolls are a vegetable.

Blizzard Canon > Your headcanon

Many have sought to harness the corruptive magic of the Void. Most who tried have fallen into madness. Determined to use this power for the good of Azeroth, Alleria Windrunner is the first mortal to succeed at defying the shadow's whispers. Coming to the aid of a group of her kin who nearly gave in to the darkness, Alleria has vowed to train these Void elves to control the shadows within them and pledge their newfound powers to the Alliance.

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/races/void-elf

It is Canonically stated that Alleria Windrunner is the first mortal in the history of the Cosmos to successfully defy the Shadows' whispers. What this means is that, Canonically, ALL those who wielded the Void before her, did not successfully defy it.

[Makabreska]

I really hope for Alleria to loose it to the Void in the future and be our dungeon/raid boss that gets killed, just to see this guy world crumble.

[Makorus]

Blizzard Canon > Your headcanon



https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/races/void-elf

It is Canonically stated that Alleria Windrunner is the first mortal in the history of the Cosmos to successfully defy the Shadows' whispers. What this means is that, Canonically, ALL those who wielded the Void before her, did not successfully defy it.

So the player character does not defy the whispers? I mean, she might defy the whispers but she is still CANONICALLY not in control of her powers and clearly inexperienced (almost destroyed the planet by inviting the Void Lords over).

[Varodoc]

So the player character does not defy the whispers?

No. The whole point of the Shadow Priest spec is that they can only stay in Void form for a very brief period of time before going back to normal. Alleria and the Ren'dorei are essentially in Void form perpetually.

The only Player Character who defies the whispers Canonically is the Ren'dorei PC. Everyone else is either a Shadow Priest who uses an actual Void form just for a few seconds, or someone who doesn't use the Void at all.

The Shadow Priest spec in built in a way that the PC literally starts growing tentacles and other abnormal things out of their bodies whenever they use Void form (in the Warcraft universe, if someone grows massive tentacles, it means they are going insane) and they can literally pick a talent called "Surrender to Madness", what do you think Blizzard had in mind when designing this spec? Very clearly not the idea of a Void user who is lucid and maintains their composure.

The only player character who defies the whispers, like Alleria, is a Void elf who is RP'd as one of the transformed elves (so not one of the scholars and such, who would also count as "Ren'dorei; Children of the Void" but were not biologically transformed by the Void).

[Hitei]

No. The whole point of the Shadow Priest spec is that they can only stay in Void form for a very brief period of time before going back to normal. Alleria and the Ren'dorei are essentially in Void form perpetually.

No? Hello?

The Shadow Priest spec in built in a way that the PC literally starts growing tentacles and other abnormal things out of their bodies whenever they use Void form (in the Warcraft universe, if someone grows massive tentacles, it means they are going insane) and they can literally pick a talent called "Surrender to Madness", what do you think Blizzard had in mind when designing this spec? Very clearly not the idea of a Void user who is lucid and maintains their composure.

That is the exact opposite of what the spec implies, which is that the player knows exactly how much void can be safely wielded. The fact that they can "literally pick a talent called "Surrender to Madness"" should tell you that they are quite capable of resisting the call of the void and managing the whispers; they can willingly surrender to them for more power.

The fundamental spec mechanic is deliberately building and then releasing insanity, which is exactly what Alleria does every time she uses her powers and has to deal with the whispers telling her to kill everyone.

[Varodoc]

Because apparently this needs to be explained here.

Alleria CHOOSES whether she's going to use her normal fair form or her Void form.

The Shadow Priest CAN'T choose that, literally just play one (since nothing can be taken for granted here, Shadow form =/= Void form btw).

Those here who disagree with me disagree with Canon. I won't repeat myself.

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/game/races/void-elf

It is Canonically stated that Alleria Windrunner is the first mortal in the history of the Cosmos to successfully defy the Shadows' whispers. What this means is that, Canonically, ALL those who wielded the Void before her, did not successfully defy it.

[Hitei]

Because apparently this needs to be explained.

Alleria CHOOSES whether she's going to use her normal fair form or her Void form.

The Shadow Priest CAN'T choose that, literally just play one (since nothing can be taken for granted here, Shadow form =/= Void form btw).

Those here who disagree with me disagree with Canon. I won't repeat myself.

The player chooses to enter both Shadow AND Void form. What are you even arguing here? Also, a random fucking advertisement blurb on the site is not the arbitrator of canon.

[Raetary]

Oh great, another round of Alleria circlejerk.
As if we haven't had enough of those.

Can we go back to discussing what constitutes a machine? That was a significantly less annoying topic.

[Hitei]

Oh great, another round of Alleria circlejerk.
As if we haven't had enough of those.

Can we go back to discussing what constitutes a machine? That was a significantly less annoying topic.

I would like to know why you think a mechanical array counts as a machine, and an electrical array counts as a machine, but for some reason a magical array does not.

[Varodoc]

The player chooses to enter both Shadow AND Void form. What are you even arguing here? Also, a random fucking advertisement blurb on the site is not the arbitrator of canon.

False.

Everything that is written in the Official website is Official and thus part of the Official Canon.

And you don't really "choose" whether to enter Void form or not, unless you don't know how to play the spec or are griefing your group.

[Makabreska]

I would like to know why you think a mechanical array counts as a machine, and an electrical array counts as a machine, but for some reason a magical array does not.

Y'all need 10.0 leaks.

- - - Updated - - -

And you don't really "choose" whether to enter Void form or not, unless you don't know how to play the spec or are griefing your group.

Yes you do pal. As of 9.0 Void Form is a CD.

[Hitei]

And you don't really "choose" whether to enter Void form or not, unless you don't know how to play the spec or are griefing your group.

This is just about the stupidest logic I've ever read.

So according to you, canonically, every player shaman in the game is being mind controlled by the elements and is forced to use totems, because non-retarded players use their totems to maximize DPS and utility? Every guardian druid is insane and HAS to be in bear form, because playing the spec involves being in bear form and you'd just be griefing your group to pull in caster? Canonically, to you, all Demon Hunters absolutely must shoot lasers out of their eyes every 30 seconds, they do not choose to.

Stop. This is embarrassing to even read.

[Ersula]

It is Canonically stated that Alleria Windrunner is the first mortal in the history of the Cosmos to successfully defy the Shadows' whispers. What this means is that, Canonically, ALL those who wielded the Void before her, did not successfully defy it.

Yeah yeah yeah she defied them in 7.3 then failed to defy them in 7.3.5. Clearly its not a one-and-done sort of thing.

- - - Updated - - -

Everything that is written in the Official website is Official and thus part of the Official Canon.

As long as we ignore everytime they revised the official website, or the devs reconned something.

- - - Updated - - -

So based on what we see in Zareth Mortis, is everything originally machine in origin & it's the old-gods's curse that made all flesh? Wouldn't that imply the Old Gods are the only reason free-will exists in this universe??

[Makorus]

Because apparently this needs to be explained here.

Alleria CHOOSES whether she's going to use her normal fair form or her Void form.

The Shadow Priest CAN'T choose that, literally just play one (since nothing can be taken for granted here, Shadow form =/= Void form btw).

Those here who disagree with me disagree with Canon. I won't repeat myself.

I like how you don't go into my point about Alleria did not defy or even shows any kind of mastery when she almost destroyed Silvermoon. Didn't do a good job defying it back then, huh?

She is literally called a Vessel in the same quest. She thinks she is in control but everything that happens proves that she is not.