Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Kiivar86]

Ion kinda confirming we will have more classes added in the future:

"This is something we talk about a lot. Evoker not having a tank spec, I think, is more a reflection on the fantasy of what being a draconic being is and how you would expect it to act. A breath weapon and wings and mobility and all that felt like it lent itself more to a ranged-based class, a caster. And caster abilities don’t always work well with tanking, so we didn’t go in that direction with that fantasy. Future classes may have tank specs."

I mean, yeah? Why would they stop adding them?

[Lahis]

I mean, yeah? Why would they stop adding them?

BREAKING NEWS! World of Warcraft will add more content in the future!

[Kiivar86]

BREAKING NEWS! World of Warcraft will add more content in the future!

Yeah I saw some people posting this bit elsewhere too like that and again just leaves me scratching my head.

It'd be news if they confirmed they wouldn't add new classes.

[Nebron]

Ion kinda confirming we will have more classes added in the future:

"This is something we talk about a lot. Evoker not having a tank spec, I think, is more a reflection on the fantasy of what being a draconic being is and how you would expect it to act. A breath weapon and wings and mobility and all that felt like it lent itself more to a ranged-based class, a caster. And caster abilities don’t always work well with tanking, so we didn’t go in that direction with that fantasy. Future classes may have tank specs."

Funny, their "reflection on the fantasy of what being a draconinc being is and how one would expect it to act" seems to be way off from what people conceptualized for so many years on these forums. They made them slim AF, and caster suits this concept well. But then, they could have implemented bulkier guys to serve as tanks or something? And in the end... this logic doesn't work really. What keeps a DRAGON that embraced the power of all 5 ASPECTS from being able to tank. Kinda meh. I guess it's about the lack of time/resources to go for three specs. But the feedback from playerbase may still change their mind about it in the future.

[Berkilak]

Funny, their "reflection on the fantasy of what being a draconinc being is and how one would expect it to act" seems to be way off from what people conceptualized for so many years on these forums. They made them slim AF, and caster suits this concept well. But then, they could have implemented bulkier guys to serve as tanks or something? And in the end... this logic doesn't work really. What keeps a DRAGON that embraced the power of all 5 ASPECTS from being able to tank. Kinda meh. I guess it's about the lack of time/resources to go for three specs. But the feedback from playerbase may still change their mind about it in the future.

They need playable Drakonids as a more typical draconic humanoid race with access to normal classes.

[Lahis]

Funny, their "reflection on the fantasy of what being a draconinc being is and how one would expect it to act" seems to be way off from what people conceptualized for so many years on these forums. They made them slim AF, and caster suits this concept well. But then, they could have implemented bulkier guys to serve as tanks or something? And in the end... this logic doesn't work really. What keeps a DRAGON that embraced the power of all 5 ASPECTS from being able to tank. Kinda meh. I guess it's about the lack of time/resources to go for three specs. But the feedback from playerbase may still change their mind about it in the future.

Dragons are primarily magical beings and Evoker's spellcasting focus mirrors that.

Sure, dragons are also physically strong, but that is merely a byproduct of their immense size, something which the Dracthyr lack.

[Nymrohd]

Dragons are primarily magical beings and Evoker's spellcasting focus mirrors that.

Sure, dragons are also physically strong, but that is merely a byproduct of their immense size, something which the Dracthyr lack.

I'd say that is a product of their anatomy, not their size. Plenty of animals are extremely lethal in a physical fight without being huge. Dracthyr possess claws, talons as well as wings strong enough to produce a wing buffet and a tail strong enough to produce a tail sweep.

[The Stormbringer]

Ion kinda confirming we will have more classes added in the future:

"This is something we talk about a lot. Evoker not having a tank spec, I think, is more a reflection on the fantasy of what being a draconic being is and how you would expect it to act. A breath weapon and wings and mobility and all that felt like it lent itself more to a ranged-based class, a caster. And caster abilities don’t always work well with tanking, so we didn’t go in that direction with that fantasy. Future classes may have tank specs."

Not sure why they think the fantasy doesn't include a big, beefy, POWERFUL dragon that just beats the crap out of people using its massive bulk, huge claws, giant tail, and bitey jaws. Dragons aren't "quick and swooshy casters". They're GIGANTIC enemies who have presence and weight. Maybe little DRAKES are quick and swooshy casters, but DRAGONS are not.

[Makorus]

More or less every single dragon humanoid race in the fantasy genre is slim, tall, elegant and not beefy at all.

Even actual dragons are very slim in WoW. Dracthyr are literally dragons on two legs.

[CalamityHeart]

Eh. In my opinion, they went in the correct direction as far as the Evoker class design leaning all the way into the ranged/magical/mobile traits of dragons rather than their more mundane animal traits like their 'scratchy claws' or their 'bitey jaws'. Or, rather than 'correct', I'd say I think they went in the much less boring direction. I probably would not be half as interested in trying out Evoker as I am now if the bulk of their kit was different flavors of 'scratch/bite your enemy for X to Y damage'. I already have a feral druid.

[Nebron]

Dragons are primarily magical beings and Evoker's spellcasting focus mirrors that.

Sure, dragons are also physically strong, but that is merely a byproduct of their immense size, something which the Dracthyr lack.

Well, that's precisely why so many people were upset about the size of dracthyr - because it didn't reflect on the nature of dragon. But that's Blizzard's game, and that's what they decided to provide. Not that I'm okay with that, but yup, in the end, they are the devs, not me

Also, as far as I know, Neltharion created dracthyr as a "perfect soldier". I'd assume one would add upon the dragon, not take some away from it, to create a Dragon+ They wield the power of 5 aspects, yet they clearly lack the black essence in that whole concept. And since black drakes are often represented as the biggest, the strongest and lorewise are connected to the idea of 'protecting' (Earth-warden), it only seems natural for them to become tanks.

[huth]

Well, that's precisely why so many people were upset about the size of dracthyr - because it didn't reflect on the nature of dragon. But that's Blizzard's game, and that's what they decided to provide. Not that I'm okay with that, but yup, in the end, they are the devs, not me

Also, as far as I know, Neltharion created dracthyr as a "perfect soldier". I'd assume one would add upon the dragon, not take some away from it, to create a Dragon+ They wield the power of 5 aspects, yet they clearly lack the black essence in that whole concept. And since black drakes are often represented as the biggest, the strongest and lorewise are connected to the idea of 'protecting' (Earth-warden), it only seems natural for them to become tanks.

When you consider logistics and the natural weaknesses of dragons, it makes sense. They don't need help with large open terrain battles. They need something for when there isn't enough room to accomodate a dragon.

Besides, this makes for easier logistics, and that's the backbone of every army. They are perfect soldiers. Not perfect fighters.

[Alanar]

They need playable Drakonids as a more typical draconic humanoid race with access to normal classes.

They should make those playable.. they have to.
I see more positive response to that model then those geckos for real.

They will miss the ball if they end up being playable way to late like the zandalari trolls. To fuel on the excitement of players they should try to put them in(if at all) in a .2 patch when the hype is still there and not in the end when no one cares anymore.

- - - Updated - - -

More or less every single dragon humanoid race in the fantasy genre is slim, tall, elegant and not beefy at all.

Even actual dragons are very slim in WoW. Dracthyr are literally dragons on two legs.

Nice try, but I still dont like the model..

[Luck4]

WoWs story would be better if they just didn't give a shit about the whiny playerbase complaining about "unfair treatment" or "I don't care about that character" and just told a coherent story without changing it 5000 times because baby Timmy doesn't like Sylvanas and wants more Arthas and how it's not fair that the Night Elf tree burns down.

You know that a coherent story without acknowledging the whiny player base would end up with Sylvanas getting the death sentence, right?

The only reason why Sylvanas is still alive is that some players would riot if she got what she deserved. She's one of the evilest characters in the franchise and yet escaped justice while other guys such as Elisande, Garrosh, and Kael'thas, died for way less.

[Nebron]

When you consider logistics and the natural weaknesses of dragons, it makes sense. They don't need help with large open terrain battles. They need something for when there isn't enough room to accomodate a dragon.

Besides, this makes for easier logistics, and that's the backbone of every army. They are perfect soldiers. Not perfect fighters.

Yeah, cannot disagree on that, good take
But I guess it's a bit far gone for that subject. After all, we are here, in WoW, having a new class based on Aspects. I'm especially surprised there's no black flight involved in their skillset, since Neltharion was the very dragon that made them in the first place.
I don't know, if I were a designer, it would be such an obvious choice for development. There's never too many tanks in this game. We technically had no mail tank, which is another opportunity to fill that gap. Neltharion is all about earth, strength, endurance. You can't get more thematic dragon for tank's role than black dragonflight's one. This whole idea about them being purely spellcaster, as far as it's cool and fun, kinda feels forced to me, to break some "consensus"? for the lack of other word.
It's a bit re-imagining a wheel to me. We know what dragons are, we know that a big part of their nature is strength and enormity. Instead, we get a gecko. To be honest, when we got the first leaks, I was in a great disbelief, as it simply didn't fit my image of WoW's creature

With dragon-themed tank, there's so much you can do, like some sort of "overheated" gimmick. We shall see, maybe they'll change their minds.

[unfunnymeme]

You know that a coherent story without acknowledging the whiny player base would end up with Sylvanas getting the death sentence, right?

A coherent story would have had her die from suicide after the death of Arthas. Or just staying Bitchqueen of the Forsaken(because the Jailer wouldn't exist).

[Aeluron Lightsong]

A coherent story would have had her die from suicide after the death of Arthas. Or just staying Bitchqueen of the Forsaken.

That would of been boring and are we really going to bring up the Dark Lady...


AGAIN?

[huth]

Yeah, cannot disagree on that, good take
But I guess it's a bit far gone for that subject. After all, we are here, in WoW, having a new class based on Aspects. I'm especially surprised there's no black flight involved in their skillset, since Neltharion was the very dragon that made them in the first place.

That ability where they fly across the field and breath downwards is Black. That's why it throws up rocks all over the place.

[Plehnard]

What's worrisome? If your answer is "not knowing what crap they could possibly come up with to ruin the lore" then you are wrong. Keeping story hidden (regardless of what it is) is FAR superior to spoiling ALL of it on the PTR/Alpha/Beta.

Let's just give you one example why hiding it with the Wow team is a bad Idea. The Darkshore frontline scenario had in it initial form that Maiev called Tyrande her Queen, that was only changed after people pointed out how utterly stupid and wrong that was and that wasn't the only lore fuckup there. The current WoW team didn't know/care about established lore and all trust they could have had must be earned first.

[CalamityHeart]

Let's just give you one example why hiding it with the Wow team is a bad Idea. The Darkshore frontline scenario had in it initial form that Maiev called Tyrande her Queen, that was only changed after people pointed out how utterly stupid and wrong that was and that wasn't the only lore fuckup there. The current WoW team didn't know/care about established lore and all trust they could have had must be earned first.

They called Tyrande a 'Queen' instead of 'High Priestess'. That was... incorrect, of course. But the appropriate response/feedback to that one-word flub in the script is "Hey. Tyrande's not the Queen, she's High Priestess." and any "backlash" beyond that is unnecessary and overblown, for as minor an error as that was. I detest most things that have come out of BFA as a given, but come on. It's one word.

That, and probably whatever other little lore fuckups you can pull out of Darkshore, really doesn't make for a strong argument toward the whole 'Don't hide the cutscenes and endgame storylines of the upcoming unreleased expansion; lay it all out for the community to judge' stance. If anything, it strengthens my opinion that they should keep such things shuttered until launch. If this is really the kind of community that's going to analyze every breadcrumb of lore and decry it as utterly stupid and disgraceful when they find one word out of place, then yes, keep the bigger bits of story under lock and key and away from those such people for as long as humanly possible.

Trust in Blizzard's writing ability does need to be earned, but there's really no reason they have to try and earn it with every single spoiler and total transparency before launch. :/