Biden / Harris Focused Discussion

[cubby]

OMG OMG PLEASE STOP

no one ever borrowed from SS and not one dime has ever been effected by congress.

This has been debunked over and over again. SS gets over 80 billion dollars a year in interest by investing in treasuries.

You are 100% wrong.

The answer is that the federal government has borrowed all of that trust fund money and spent it, exactly as Krauthammer asserted.

[Elegiac]

Literally the new people are paying in to pay out the people who were in there longer.

Which isn't the case for pay as you go schemes like insurance and social security.

Social Security is a pay-as-you-go system. Current contributors pay for current beneficiaries. It transfers income from the current generation of workers to the current generation of retirees, with the promise that there will be another generation of workers to pay for the current generation of workers’ retirement. It does not require a doubling of participants every time a payment is made to a current beneficiary or a geometric increase in the number of participants. In its essence, Social Security is a contract between generations, binding together the interests of both young and old in a system that provides protection to all.

Womp womp.

[uuuhname]

there we go again with it being ok to kill grandma but heaven forbid we tax the rich more.

[Zan15]

When you are tasked with being able to win a major war and a minor one at the same time with minimal US casualties, it isn't cheap.

You need to recheck your math.

LOL we proved it in the last couple "minor ones" that all those trillions spent on those fancy weapons and ships did shit to win these "wars"

a major war, yah a few billion dollars and the world is ended. You don't need trillions if a "major" war broke out, hell there will be no use for money if it ever really did.

[cubby]

It's not fully funded.

It hasn't been fully funded for... my entire fucking life, and long before that.

It's a fucking Ponzi Scheme.

Just more of your lies.

The answer is that the federal government has borrowed all of that trust fund money and spent it, exactly as Krauthammer asserted.

[Kellhound]

Okay? This doesn't give them a popular mandate, it makes it a minority government.



"Our colonies don't see us as imperialist" is a funny argument, lol.

Go figure that the regimes which are curated to be favorable to the US and its policy goals might be hesitant to be critical of the US and its policy goals.

You do like to move goalposts don't you.

So, NATO, Japan, South Korea, Australia, etc. are US colonies.... Bet that would surprise them!

[Machismo]

Up until just a short few years ago SS was still taking in more money then it was paying out. "fully funded" is a misnomer that is often misquoted a lot and taken out of context. Technically SS has always been underfunded since its expected to cover everyone, even kids who haven't even started contributing into the system yet.

SS was by all means fully funded till it started taking in less money then it was paying out. Decades and Decades it was technically "fully funded". Wasn't till about 10 years after the tax increases were stopped did it start to go down the road of insolvency.

Again the solution is a combination of tax increases, retirement age adjustments, income cap removal, benefit adjustments, opening up to Medicare for all, cost savings for M4A, all income regardless of sources being taxed, etc etc.


And no its not a fucking Ponzi Scheme no matter how you say it.

You just contradicted yourself. It's not fully funded, for that exact reason. The amount they had in reserves wasn't close to enough to pay for those who had already paid into the system.

It has long been on the road to insolvency, we've seen this coming since the 1990's, when they didn't plan for the spike in life expectancy, and their aging models were simply shit. Now, whether that was due to massive incompetence, or simply blatant corruption... I'll leave that for you.

At the end of the day, expecting more and more tax increases is simply not a viable option.

Yes, it is designed just like a Ponzi Scheme, new people paying in to cover the costs (losses) of the older. it literally relies on a continuous growth of new investors, and when that growth isn't met, they just raised taxes... over and over again.

[Hinastorm]

It's literally a higher percentage of their income...

So, it's more, both in total, and in percentage.

That's how it works.

Oh shit, now you people want a wealth tax on top of income taxes? Talk about punishing people for saving money...

There are diminishing returns on what wealth does for people. This has been studied and proven.

It's literally simply a fact that taxing the rich at higher percents and amounts makes sense.

Why do you care more about the wealthy keeping more of their money than you care about the well being of the majority?

[Kellhound]

You forgot the part where anyone asked you to start said wars.

Mutual defense treaties...

[Machismo]

there we go again with it being ok to kill grandma but heaven forbid we tax the rich more.

So, when are you willing to pitch in and pay more?

- - - Updated - - -

Which isn't the case for pay as you go schemes like insurance and social security.



Womp womp.

Once again, you are describing a Ponzi Scheme...

[Elegiac]

So, NATO, Japan, South Korea, Australia, etc. are US colonies....

Basically.

The relationship between the US and its "allies" is much the same as the relationship between Britain and Egypt. "Colony" is just such a crass term these days.

[Machismo]

Just more of your lies.

The government did borrow it, and they got treasury notes in return.

That's bought debt...

Now, that $2.5t money isn't CLOSE to enough to fund all those who have already paid into the system... not by a fucking long shot. Even the SSA admits to their unfunded liabilities.

[Elegiac]

Once again, you are describing a Ponzi Scheme...

Ponzi schemes require a geometric increase of participants. Insurance and social security do not because they are pay as you go schemes.

Once again: you are just using the definition of a Ponzi scheme incorrectly.

[Zan15]

You are 100% wrong.

OMG really dude i expected more from you.


So the 2 trillion dollar surplus invested in treasuries is fake?

The Billions a month the SS sells of those treasuries to pay benefits out are fake? The billions it buys with excess capital is fake?
Gee the checks are still clearing so the money exist, so how is there no money in there?


The SS trust fund invest in treasuries.
The Federal Govt does not borrow money from SS. They have no ability.
The SS trust fund could tomorrow stop investing in treasuries and just let the money sit there. But why would they, they earn 80+ billion a year in safe interest for the program.

[Elegiac]

Mutual defense treaties...

A treaty you dictated the writing of isn't someone asking, lol.

[Machismo]

There are diminishing returns on what wealth does for people. This has been studied and proven.

It's literally simply a fact that taxing the rich at higher percents and amounts makes sense.

Why do you care more about the wealthy keeping more of their money than you care about the well being of the majority?

I care about everyone, that's the point. I don't hate them, just because they are wealthy. I don't want to punish them for what they have.

Taxing the rich is the easy, lazy, and selfish way out. It's a populist ideal, and it stinks of prejudice.

I care about their liberty, just as I care about yours.

[Kellhound]

LOL we proved it in the last couple "minor ones" that all those trillions spent on those fancy weapons and ships did shit to win these "wars"

a major war, yah a few billion dollars and the world is ended. You don't need trillions if a "major" war broke out, hell there will be no use for money if it ever really did.

We won the wars, lost the occupations, there is a difference.

You can have a major war that does not devolve into a nuclear exchange. You also have to be able to win such a war to prevent it from happening. Deterrence requires capability.

[Machismo]

Ponzi schemes require a geometric increase of participants. Insurance and social security do not because they are pay as you go schemes.

Once again: you are just using the definition of a Ponzi scheme incorrectly.

Ummm, and this is attained by increasing population, and increase of taxation...

Well, have you figured it out, yet?

[uuuhname]

So, when are you willing to pitch in and pay more?

as soon as you stop being so comically disingenuous.

[Elegiac]

Ummm, and this is attained by increasing population

Noooooo? SS does not require an exponentially increasing population to remain solvent and never has.

and increase of taxation...

Thus making it not a Ponzi scheme.