1. #8321
    Warchief
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    I mean, there's nothing really hypocritical about saying "There are people who don't like either major party, and voted for a third party that they liked significantly more. And while I personally also don't like either major party, I recognize that one of the two will win, so even though I'd RATHER the third party be in charge I'll hold my nose and vote for the major party I hate less."

    In countries with more than 2 legitimate options, such strategic voting is quite common, to the point that many countries have revamped their voting systems so that people can safely vote their primary pick AND still gain the benefit of strategic voting in scenarios where their primary pick simply won't win.

    Edit: Pretty much if Perot or ANY third party candidate actually filled the role of a 'spoiler' that changed who won the election, it's because FPTP is the absolutely worst way to run a modern election possible. It's designed, explicitly, to preserve political dynasties and freeze out as much potential competition as possible.
    Last edited by Lynarii; 2021-05-05 at 04:55 PM.

  2. #8322
    Immortal Milchshake's Avatar
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    Query: Biden 2020/21 understands the mood of the national electorate better than other candidates and the beltway press?

    Proof:
    Q: "What did you get?"

    President Biden: "Tacos and some enchiladas."

    Q: "Do you have any comments on the efforts to oust Liz Cheney from the House Republican leadership post?"

    Biden: "I don't understand the Republicans."



    It's Taco night in America!

  3. #8323
    Void Lord Felya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milchshake View Post
    It's Taco night in America!
    It’s cinco de Mayo everywhere...
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi

  4. #8324
    I was Irish for one day a couple of months ago, and today I'm Mexican. (ok...the door's open. Go ahead)

  5. #8325
    Quote Originally Posted by Milchshake View Post
    It's Taco night in America!
    I'm still furious we don't have taco trucks on every corner. Biden needs to get on delivering on that threat from Republicans, I don't have a single decent taco spot near me. Just a garbage Taco Bell. It's really a travesty.

  6. #8326
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    I was Irish for one day a couple of months ago, and today I'm Mexican. (ok...the door's open. Go ahead)
    Were you a Jedi yesterday?

    Biden set to flex clemency powers

    The White House held a Zoom call last week to discuss criminal justice reform with advocates and formerly incarcerated people, some of whom are pressing Biden to use his powers to free people jailed on drug offenses and sick and elderly people who pose no threat to society.

    While the White House did not signal any imminent moves, officials indicated that Biden will not hold off until later in his term to issue pardons or commutations.

    “It was clear that they are working on something,” said Norris Henderson, founder and executive director of New Orleans-based Voice of the Experienced, who participated in the call. “They are looking at that right now as an avenue to start doing things.”
    Didn't Obama do this to a large number of people arrested for 10g of pot, or something?

  7. #8327
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Were you a Jedi yesterday?
    Actually I was feeling kinda Sithy yesterday.... confused...nah, I don't wanna talk about it.

  8. #8328
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Nah, it wasn't a tough choice for you, that's simply an attempt to shed responsibility. I've watched Trumpsters bend over backwards for years, to justify their choices and actions.

    Meanwhile, when they turn around and try and complain, the detest that it co tinues to get poi Ted out to them.

    I guess you weren't displeased.
    I stand by my voting choices. Go make a thread about me if you want. For this thread, you should demonstrate that you can separate personal voting choices and voters at large. For example, because you are a libertarian, your own logic would say you can’t speak about Republican and Democratic voting determinations, since your views differ.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  9. #8329
    Immortal Milchshake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    It’s cinco de Mayo everywhere...
    Even in Canada? They're still monarchist simps. They have no Battle of Puebla or Battle of Ticonderoga to celebrate.

    Props or Aboriginal Day though!

  10. #8330
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    I stand by my voting choices. Go make a thread about me if you want. For this thread, you should demonstrate that you can separate personal voting choices and voters at large. For example, because you are a libertarian, your own logic would say you can’t speak about Republican and Democratic voting determinations, since your views differ.
    Not at all, I'm simply pointing out that you were not displeased, and you willingly and knowingly voted for an outright terrible human being.

    Many voters are displeased, and good for them. I know I certainly wouldn't vote for a racist sexual predator.

    On that note, at least we are returning to a point of normalcy, and we get to see how truly out of touch they always were.
    Last edited by Machismo; 2021-05-05 at 05:32 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wilfire View Post
    I hate personal freedom because people abuse it like a shiny new toy.

  11. #8331
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Federal judge overturns CDC's eviction ban.

    I mean...I'm disappointed, but the decision of the court stands. Hopefully, it helped for as long as it was allowed to last.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Biden's plan will cost far more than advertised, says a study by Wharton.

    "Whoa, Wharton? Isn't that Trump's school?"

    (a) they're a good business school and (b) they fucking hate Trump. The study is fine.

    In a study out this week, a big part of the $900 billion difference cited by the Penn Wharton researchers appears to be what the American Families Plan will spend on education efforts.

    The Biden administration is proposing to fully fund two years of universal pre-K for three- and four-year-olds and make two years of community college free for whoever wants it. The Penn Wharton researchers said both of those programs will cost significantly more than the White House estimates, although the research team didn't specify how much more. The researchers also said proposed tax credits for children and low-income families and spending to fund health insurance premiums will be more costly than the White House estimates.

    In all, the researchers said Mr. Biden's plan will spend $2.5 trillion on programs and tax credits, compared to the White House's estimate of $1.8 trillion.

    On taxes, the Biden administration said the plan will bring in $1.5 trillion for the government by imposing more taxes on Americans who make more than $400,000 a year. Not included in the American Families Plan or the Wharton analysis is the White House's proposal to raise corporate taxes by $2.1 trillion and spend more than $2 trillion in infrastructure, both of which are part of a different Biden plan.

    The Penn Wharton researchers, though, said they believed Mr. Biden's American Families Plan would bring in $1.3 trillion over the next decade, or $200 billion less than what the Biden administration predicts. The primary difference has to do with how much money the administration believes it can bring in by beefing up the Internal Revenue Service.

    Mr. Biden has proposed spending $80 billion in the next 10 years to increase the agency's staff and improve its audit powers. The White House predicted increased tax compliance will add $700 billion in revenue over the next decade.

    The Wharton researchers put that estimate at $480 billion, which is still higher than others have said. A study by the Congressional Budget Office last year suggested that investing $80 billion in the IRS would generate about $200 billion in additional tax revenue over a decade.
    Now, maybe other studies will come out later, but this isn't great news for the plan.

    "Okay, but why post this? I thought you liked Biden?"

    I do. And I'd prefer if his statements and estimates were on target. I don't think he outright lied here, but biased stats are still unhelpful.

  12. #8332
    Void Lord Felya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Actually I was feeling kinda Sithy yesterday.... confused...nah, I don't wanna talk about it.
    The start of May is a turbulent week for identity... you start out a communist, then end black out drunk... it’s USSR in 5 days...
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi

  13. #8333
    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    The bold part that I responded to, was not an assertion of your personal voting considerations... it’s defining Perot voters as showing displeasure. You didn’t just say you don’t put the onus on third party voters, you defined them while saying it.
    Look again. I said it was the highest voter turnout for third parties since Perot. I did not speculate on what Perot voters were voting for at the time. I can provide a link to the original post of that would be helpful.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    Not at all, I'm simply pointing out that you were not displeased, and you willingly and knowingly voted for an outright terrible human being.

    Many voters are displeased, and good for them. I know I certainly wouldn't vote for a racist sexual predator.

    On that note, at least we are returning to a point of normalcy, and we get to see how truly out of touch they always were.
    Ok, maybe next time start with the point that you’re critical of my voting choices. It’s dumb to try to generalize it to third parties in general, and then flee the assertion as soon as it’s challenged.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  14. #8334
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Look again. I said it was the highest voter turnout for third parties since Perot. I did not speculate on what Perot voters were voting for at the time. I can provide a link to the original post of that would be helpful.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Ok, maybe next time start with the point that you’re critical of my voting choices. It’s dumb to try to generalize it to third parties in general, and then flee the assertion as soon as it’s challenged.
    Oh, that was already covered.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    Multiculturalism hurts and kills. This happened before Trump and it would be happening without him. Racism arises from a multicultural society. If we were monocultural, people would not see issues through the lens of race.
    This is a poster saying that people are at fault for being the victims of terrorism, because they are not white.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wilfire View Post
    I hate personal freedom because people abuse it like a shiny new toy.

  15. #8335
    Void Lord Felya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Look again. I said it was the highest voter turnout for third parties since Perot. I did not speculate on what Perot voters were voting for at the time. I can provide a link to the original post of that would be helpful.
    Oh, I’ll be even more helpful...

    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    A little off topic, but that was in the context of my voting decisions. I don't put that on other voters that express their displeasure by going third party. I can appreciate their choices and why they made them without demanding they also align with my choices on the matter.
    “Their” displeasure is your assertion about their intent, not yours.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Ok, maybe next time start with the point that you’re critical of my voting choices. It’s dumb to try to generalize it to third parties in general, and then flee the assertion as soon as it’s challenged.
    Yeah, let’s not do that...

    - - - Updated - - -
    @tehdang I refuse to believe that you don’t know the difference between...

    I can’t say why third parties voted the way they did.

    Versus...

    I can’t say why third party voters expressing their displeasure.

    You do understand that one of those statement is what you claimed to have said, while the other is a generalization that you did say?
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi

  16. #8336
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynarii View Post
    I mean, there's nothing really hypocritical about saying "There are people who don't like either major party, and voted for a third party that they liked significantly more. And while I personally also don't like either major party, I recognize that one of the two will win, so even though I'd RATHER the third party be in charge I'll hold my nose and vote for the major party I hate less."

    In countries with more than 2 legitimate options, such strategic voting is quite common, to the point that many countries have revamped their voting systems so that people can safely vote their primary pick AND still gain the benefit of strategic voting in scenarios where their primary pick simply won't win.
    I’m glad somebody gets it.

    It’s common to become a Democrat in big blue cities to strategically vote in the primary, since the winner of the closed primary undoubtably wins the election, and they want to participate in the selection of the eventual mayor/representative.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  17. #8337
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    It’s common to become a Democrat in big blue cities to strategically vote in the primary, since the winner of the closed primary undoubtably wins the election, and they want to participate in the selection of the eventual mayor/representative.
    Big 'ol citations needed for these claims*

  18. #8338
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Federal judge overturns CDC's eviction ban.

    I mean...I'm disappointed, but the decision of the court stands. Hopefully, it helped for as long as it was allowed to last.
    Goonies never say die:

    Justice Dept. to appeal judge's order vacating CDC eviction moratorium

  19. #8339
    Void Lord Felya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Big 'ol citations needed for these claims*
    Here you go... Neither NY or California have open presidential primaries... not sure what big blue states are left... Washington?:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_p..._United_States
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi

  20. #8340
    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    Here you go... Neither NY or California have open presidential primaries... not sure what big blue states are left... Washington?:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_p..._United_States
    In CA you can remain NPA (no party affiliation) and request a primary ballot for either party, and you don't even need to live in a big city for it.

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