1. #9881
    Quote Originally Posted by BronzeCondor View Post
    Is this a Whataboutism?
    The world is literally on tape laughing at Trump and you guys wore that as a badge of honor.

  2. #9882
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasRules View Post
    Gov Desantis.

    For the next year and half until the midterms you are going to be seeing a lot of slogans related to:"But yet, if you want to vote, he thinks it’s too much of a burden to show a picture ID when you’re voting, so no voter ID, but have to show your medical papers just to be able to live in everyday life. Give me a break. "
    Still caught up in Voter ID shenanigans? So adorable. Didn't Trump's commission's findings prove to you that voter fraud doesn't exist? Period.

    Hey, speaking of Desantis, how are you dealing with him promoting a drug who's company paid Desantis $12MM to sell it throughout the state? Any outrage on that?

  3. #9883
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasRules View Post
    Gov Desantis.

    For the next year and half until the midterms you are going to be seeing a lot of slogans related to:"But yet, if you want to vote, he thinks it’s too much of a burden to show a picture ID when you’re voting, so no voter ID, but have to show your medical papers just to be able to live in everyday life. Give me a break. "
    If an ID costs anything and is required to vote then it's a tax on voting, which is literally against the Constitution.

    Dontrike/Shadow Priest/Black Cell Faction Friend Code - 5172-0967-3866

  4. #9884
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    I'd go a step further.

    They know there's nothing to actually criticize, so they put these flaming bags of shit on the Dem's doorsteps, so to speak, because they know there's no clean way for them to dispose of it, and then they can taunt them for getting shit on their hands or whatever.

    If they had valid conduct/policy arguments, they wouldn't need to rely on these kinds of "gotchas" set up by Republicans. They'd just go after them directly. But they can't, because those grounds don't exist, so here we are. Biden's the worst because he failed to completely solve an incredibly shitty circumstance that Trump created and handed to him to deal with. Or something.
    A multi President problem that everyone agrees America should leave is not the flaming bag of shit. The pulling out timing and clusterfuck of how it is being handled is the bag of shit. Even liberal or left leaning media are trouncing the Biden administration for how poorly this is being executed. This is something to criticize and even your beloved media is doing it. You can pretend this is not the issue, but you do apologize for everything the democrat party does in a country you are not a part of. Too bad your precious media has tired of carrying the water.

    I am willing to bet if Obama was President and the taliban said the Americans should be gone by the August 31 deadline, he would have given them the finger and told them we are leaving when everyone is out. I'd say just about any President would not have terms of Americans safety dictated by the taliban...well, maybe Carter would have. But nice as usual, you only blame Trump...the guy who is in every post you create because he invades every part of Canada and affects you soooo much.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    That's an interesting way of saying that Biden upheld the deal that Trump made with the Taliban.
    So Biden pulled out at Trump's deadline...because that was the deal he made. It's also a known fact that everyone wants us out of Afghanistan, but Biden changed the Trump date and did it extremly poorly, to the point of right wing media like CNN, ABC, NBC claiming the execution was chaotic and poorly done. Did Trump make a deal that said he will have the taliban dictate the terms at which Americans will be safely evacuated from Afghanistan? Because Biden is not challenging the taliban at all on the deadline...guess you are okay with Americans who can't get out by august 31 being detained and beaten by the taliban.

  5. #9885
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasRules View Post
    The pulling out timing and clusterfuck of how it is being handled is the bag of shit.
    Yet you're ignoring Stephen Miller sabotaging the refugee process, and Trump did not give the Biden Administration a smooth transition.

    It's also a known fact that everyone wants us out of Afghanistan, but Biden changed the Trump date and did it extremly poorly, to the point of right wing media like CNN, ABC, NBC claiming the execution was chaotic and poorly done.
    Yet Evacuations currently is on track and have passed 70,000 people.
    Last edited by szechuan; 2021-08-25 at 10:05 AM.
    A Fetus is not a person under the 14th amendment.

    Christians are Forced Birth Fascists against Human Rights who indoctrinate and groom children. Prove me wrong.

  6. #9886
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasRules View Post
    Did Trump make a deal that said he will have the taliban dictate the terms at which Americans will be safely evacuated from Afghanistan
    That's how deals work when you surrender, Trump got bent over by the Taliban for a few photo ops. Trump didn't include the Afghan government or terms for people who worked with the US government which is the issue at the moment.

  7. #9887
    For what it's worth I think Afghanistan would've fallen to the Taliban at some point or the other. Short of the UN making it some odd protectorate, there's no way this could've been avoided. So Biden has done the right thing by pulling out and avoiding anymore American lives from being lost.

    Good on him.

  8. #9888
    Quote Originally Posted by Valkyrst View Post
    For what it's worth I think Afghanistan would've fallen to the Taliban at some point or the other. Short of the UN making it some odd protectorate, there's no way this could've been avoided.
    Even Biden essentially acknowledged that, even before we pulled out. What was surprising was that it took them ten days instead of three months.

  9. #9889
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkyrst View Post
    For what it's worth I think Afghanistan would've fallen to the Taliban at some point or the other. Short of the UN making it some odd protectorate, there's no way this could've been avoided. So Biden has done the right thing by pulling out and avoiding anymore American lives from being lost.

    Good on him.
    Yep and in 3 months most Americans will have forgotten about this anyway. (If anyone tries to use this as a campaign issue in a year, they’ll be met with blank stares).

    As long as there’s no massacre, this seems to be somewhat successful, obviously can change at any moment.

  10. #9890
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    Leaving Afghanistan was planned and initiated by Trump as part of Doha, literally all Biden did was not stop what Trump had done. If Lindsey "Opportunism is my middle name" Graham thinks Biden should be impeached for that, but not Trump for colluding with multiple foreign governments to affect election results, or insurrection, the GOP is lost. The GOP is in for a looooooong 7.5 years of Biden if they think that is the bar for a "disastrous" Presidency. There is no reasoning that can be done with the GOP now, they are full OAN and Pillow Guy off the rocker. Trump was their drug, and the only move they know how to make now are repeating conspiracy theories or pushing fantasies that Biden should resign or be impeached the first time he makes a decision that the right disagrees with.

    The sad part is that everything has shifted so far to the right that the Democrat party today is more aligned with the moderate conservatism of the GOP 20-30 years ago. The GOP today is now aligned with the ideas that David Duke pushed 20 years ago. There are some individual members of Congress that are liberal, but is no real liberal party in the US anymore. The party system is now varying degrees of conservatism, the Demos are now the moderate conservatives and the GOP aligns politically with autocratic governments.

  11. #9891
    After bitter showdown, House Democrats advance $3.5 trillion spending plan with Biden child allowance and tuition-free community college

    It's an important step, but the drafting doesn't come until the fall. There is bound to be more fighting ahead for this one. It likely won't have everything it should in it, but we need to have a lot of what it will have passed. With the thin majority in the House (and the likelihood of losing the House in 2022 thanks to gerrymandering and the scuffed Census), this needs to get done with all speed.

  12. #9892
    Corporate Dems are massive cowards.

  13. #9893
    Quote Originally Posted by Benggaul View Post
    After bitter showdown, House Democrats advance $3.5 trillion spending plan with Biden child allowance and tuition-free community college

    It's an important step, but the drafting doesn't come until the fall. There is bound to be more fighting ahead for this one. It likely won't have everything it should in it, but we need to have a lot of what it will have passed. With the thin majority in the House (and the likelihood of losing the House in 2022 thanks to gerrymandering and the scuffed Census), this needs to get done with all speed.
    It’s not an important step in my mind because all this is a part of the procedure since to vote on it. It first has to move into this stage so it’s still very much a wait and see what will happen situation.

  14. #9894
    Quote Originally Posted by szechuan View Post
    Yet you're ignoring Stephen Miller sabotaging the refugee process, and Trump did not give the Biden Administration a smooth transition.



    Yet Evacuations currently is on track and have passed 70,000 people.
    You are ignoring that we left behind enough equipment for the taliban to have more black hawk helicopters then Australia. I am sure that is on Trump too, as everything is Trump's fault.

  15. #9895
    If Trump wasn't so damn stupid it wouldn't be his fault.

  16. #9896
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasRules View Post
    You are ignoring that we left behind enough equipment for the taliban to have more black hawk helicopters then Australia. I am sure that is on Trump too, as everything is Trump's fault.
    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-taliban-hands

    You mean the Afghan helicopters? The one that isn't shown even getting off the ground? That they likely can't even maintain or resupply?

    Damn man.

  17. #9897
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasRules View Post
    You are ignoring that we left behind enough equipment for the taliban to have more black hawk helicopters then Australia. I am sure that is on Trump too, as everything is Trump's fault.
    As far as I know, we didn't leave anything like that behind. Those were in the possession of the Afghan army, who just let the Taliban have them.

    Were you supposing that we should have just, what, repo'd all US-made armament prior to withdrawal? I can't even imagine how that would have looked. We ostensibly gave those to the Afghan army so that they could continue to rule effectively. We couldn't have taken them back, and we couldn't have prevented the Afghan army from basically just giving them to the Taliban without directly fighting back against the Taliban return.


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  18. #9898
    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    As far as I know, we didn't leave anything like that behind. Those were in the possession of the Afghan army, who just let the Taliban have them.

    Were you supposing that we should have just, what, repo'd all US-made armament prior to withdrawal? I can't even imagine how that would have looked. We ostensibly gave those to the Afghan army so that they could continue to rule effectively. We couldn't have taken them back, and we couldn't have prevented the Afghan army from basically just giving them to the Taliban without directly fighting back against the Taliban return.
    To boot...how many of them are trained technicians? Do they have supply lines for fuel, parts, and munitions? Can any of them even like, fly the damn things?

  19. #9899
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    To boot...how many of them are trained technicians? Do they have supply lines for fuel, parts, and munitions? Can any of them even like, fly the damn things?
    By and large, the answer to that is no. This was actually one of the specific examples of wasteful spending that SIGAR brought up as far back as 2013, that we were buying advanced military vehicles and weapons that required US parts and US technicians and US software and giving them to a government that would - even in the best case scenario that we left and the Taliban didn't overthrow them - one day have none of those things.

  20. #9900
    Over 9000! PhaelixWW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkTZeratul View Post
    By and large, the answer to that is no. This was actually one of the specific examples of wasteful spending that SIGAR brought up as far back as 2013, that we were buying advanced military vehicles and weapons that required US parts and US technicians and US software and giving them to a government that would - even in the best case scenario that we left and the Taliban didn't overthrow them - one day have none of those things.
    I'm guessing that the hope was that it would keep them dependent upon continued good will between Afghanistan and the US in the future to keep them maintained.

    The other alternative, I guess, is that the Afghan army just never considered actually keeping them after the US left.


    "The difference between stupidity
    and genius is that genius has its limits."

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