Biden / Harris Focused Discussion

[Draco-Onis]

They're...not? They just can't rush through legislation given the current makeup of the Legislature and shit as we've already covered?

They've failed to capitalize on the insurrection not to mention 4 years of crimes by the former president. Biden and the democrats haven't passed even in the house legislation that would curb presidential power or even the most basic force the president to release his taxes. Democrats have been acting like this is politics as usual when it comes to action.

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It's sad. You literally cannot articulate how threatening to expel Manchin from the Democratic party will have an effect, no matter how many times the question is asked of you.

It's like you're just saying "Well, we have to do something!" which is basically a little kid's retort.

What exactly do you see happening if that threat is levied?

Do you think even moderate public pressure from Biden is being put on him at all at the moment? you think the current kid gloves is the best approach?

[Orange Joe]

They've failed to capitalize on the insurrection not to mention 4 years of crimes by the former president. Biden and the democrats haven't passed even in the house legislation that would curb presidential power or even the most basic force the president to release his taxes. Democrats have been acting like this is politics as usual when it comes to action.

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Do you think even moderate public pressure from Biden is being put on him at all at the moment? you think the current kid gloves is the best approach?

Why do you think public pressure is going to change anything? At best you would need the public pressure to come from his voters, and I'm fairly certain in saying they agree with what he is doing or he wouldn't be there.

[Edge-]

They've failed to capitalize on the insurrection

How do they capitalize on it? Investigations, which are ongoing, sadly take time. Criminal referrals for failure to show up for a subpoeana, sadly take time and don't have a ton of teeth in Congress.

What else should they be doing right now?

not to mention 4 years of crimes by the former president.

See above. What are they supposed to do to speed these things up, especially since their investigations would largely be political in nature (which they are, and are ongoing) whereas there are actual criminal investigations going on elsewhere.

Biden and the democrats haven't passed even in the house legislation that would curb presidential power or even the most basic force the president to release his taxes.

Releasing tax documents is a pretty reactionary choice for Trump only, and honestly that's a pretty pointless thing to try to rally the caucus around.

Democrats have been acting like this is politics as usual when it comes to action.

No, they have a razor-thin majority in the House and especially in the Senate. Something which, again, has been repeatedly hammered in by folks like myself since the 2020 election to temper expectations that they'd be able to be fantastically productive. Especially in light of Manchin as a known quantity since that time.

We're no more happy about what's going on, but we're also not surprised by it because we've been paying attention and know that this was the most likely outcome of the current Congressional makeup.

[PhaelixWW]

Do you think even moderate public pressure from Biden is being put on him at all at the moment? you think the current kid gloves is the best approach?

Like I said, you haven't even established why you think such pressure will have an effect. Any other question is meaningless before you answer that.

Stop evading and answer.

[Draco-Onis]

How do they capitalize on it? Investigations, which are ongoing, sadly take time. Criminal referrals for failure to show up for a subpoeana, sadly take time and don't have a ton of teeth in Congress.

What else should they be doing right now?

Have we really learned nothing from Benghazi? Trump committed tons of crimes, where's the Trump truth commission in the senate or the house?

[PhaelixWW]

Have we really learned nothing from Benghazi? Trump committed tons of crimes, where's the Trump truth commission in the senate or the house?

What, you mean the two impeachments and January 6th commission?

[DingDongKing]

Is all this just boiling down to "why aren't the Democrats behaving like the Republicans?"?

I would nope not, after the last 4/5 years of calling their shit out because they shouldn't have been doing it in the first place.

If you said to me, 'Dems should be as aggressive as Republicans and leverage negative sentiment when campaigning', they absolutely should.

[beanman12345]

Tbh fighting for democracy isn't even a concern for me anymore. Like that other thread about possibly already being past point of no return for climate change, if we haven't passed it, we're at the precipice now, and damn if that global summit was the opposite of encouraging. It's clear Biden wants to get to work on fighting climate change, but Manchin being the bought bitch he is, making that impossible. China not doing on that front either. So yeah climate is fucking us right now, and it's only going to get exponentially worse, so yeah more important shit to think about then if manchin is in the democrat party or not.

[Yuujin]

I mean after specifically calling them out for said behaviour over the last few years. Pretty garbage take to have big issues when one party does it, but then want the party you support to do the same when they're in power.

Democrats can't get shit done. Donald Trump was able to bully his party into compliance. Biden can't even get two senators to agree to help the American people over their own personal interest, let alone outside interest. Democrats are royally fucked if they keep trying to play the game the same way they are now.

[beanman12345]

Democrats can't get shit done. Donald Trump was able to bully his party into compliance. Biden can't even get two senators to agree to help the American people over their own personal interest, let alone outside interest. Democrats are royally fucked if they keep trying to play the game the same way they are now.

Republicans can't get shit done either, even under Trump. Trump failed to bully 100% of his party too, otherwise we wouldn't have the ACA anymore. It wasn't just McCain that voted against repealing it either. All Trump got done was judges and tax reduction on rich. Biden got done is judges too. both parties failing to function properly.

[PhaelixWW]

Democrats can't get shit done. Donald Trump was able to bully his party into compliance. Biden can't even get two senators to agree to help the American people over their own personal interest, let alone outside interest. Democrats are royally fucked if they keep trying to play the game the same way they are now.

No, Biden is just screwed by the Senate deadlock giving far too much power to two idiots. If the Senate were 52/48, you'd be singing an entirely different tune. This isn't somehow indicative of the entire Democratic party, this is just the nature of a stalemate.

[Draco-Onis]

What, you mean the two impeachments and January 6th commission?

Do you think those two impeachments and the limited scope commission covers all the crimes he and his cronies committed in 4 years? A public accounting of everything they did is justified not to mention politically advantageous.

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Do Democrats need to be... well, just better? Absolutely.
Do Democrats need to stoop to the criminal levels of the Republicans? I'd argue no.

well currently they are being the same old same old.

[PhaelixWW]

Do you think those two impeachments and the limited scope commission covers all the crimes he and his cronies committed in 4 years? A public accounting of everything they did is justified not to mention politically advantageous.

Welp.

Now you're showing your hand. Because all you care about is political theater and you're not interested in reality. I just can't tell whether this is because you're incredibly naive or something more sinister.

The fact that you keep attempting to evade the earlier question certainly makes it seem more like the latter than the former.

[Yuujin]

No, Biden is just screwed by the Senate deadlock giving far too much power to two idiots. If the Senate were 52/48, you'd be singing an entirely different tune. This isn't somehow indicative of the entire Democratic party, this is just the nature of a stalemate.

When Democrats see a the House and a Senate that is controlled by their party unable to pass something that can meaningfully change the lives of millions of Americans, you don't think that'll turn them off to voting in the midterms? Of course it will.

Republican voters just need buzz words like immigrants, caravans, MS13, CRT, and crime to show up at the polls.

Unless something changes, Democrats are going to get slaughtered in the midterms.

[PhaelixWW]

Unless something changes, Democrats are going to get slaughtered in the midterms.

That was always the de facto expected outcome, just going by historical trends. It doesn't mean Democrats are "doomed".

[Draco-Onis]

Welp.

Now you're showing your hand. Because all you care about is political theater and you're not interested in reality. I just can't tell whether this is because you're incredibly naive or something more sinister.

Political theater isn't reality? again Did you learn nothing from Benghazi? political theatre is politics, if you want politicians who don't want to get their hands dirty I got news for you. I think you are the one who is naive, republicans have tied themselves to Trump by not holding him publicly accountable they have enable them to have all the benefits without any of the downsides.

The fact that you keep attempting to evade the earlier question certainly makes it seem more like the latter than the former.

I have given my answer you are the one who decided to deride it as childish and immature as if accepting the status quo is a noble stance.

[Yuujin]

That was always the de facto expected outcome, just going by historical trends. It doesn't mean Democrats are "doomed".

Don't think I said they were doomed, just royally fucked. And you don't lose because of a historical trend. You lose because of something you did or didn't do, and unless they manage to turn this around or pull something phenomenal out of their asses, this will be at the top of the list of reasons for defeat.

[PhaelixWW]

Political theater isn't reality? again Did you learn nothing from Benghazi? political theatre is politics

If you think Benghazi was "real politics" and is what we should aspire to, then you're definitely worse than just a hopeless naif. Good to know.

I have given my answer

Lulz. No, you didn't. You're avoiding it again right now.

[Draco-Onis]

If you think Benghazi was "real politics" and is what we should aspire to, then you're definitely worse than just a hopeless naif. Good to know.

Benghazi was smart and effective politics the results speak for themselves and Hillary did nothing really wrong but her name was smeared even before she declared. I don't know why you think we should not be holding criminals accountable just because they served in the government. The public has a right to know the extend of the crimes committed.

Lulz. No, you didn't. You're avoiding it again right now.

Restate the question again because I thought I answered it already.

[PhaelixWW]

you don't lose because of a historical trend. You lose because of something you did or didn't do

The historical trend exists because the "something" that the Democrats "did" was get Biden elected.

You can ignore it all you want, but the trend has been well-documented by the experts of political history.