Biden / Harris Focused Discussion

[Very Tired]

I'll go the extra step and say it's good she is coming home "without quotes." A US citizen detained by Russian in an obvious political stunt by Putin is good. Hopefully we can bring more political prisoners home. They are not "basketball players" or whatever, they are Americans.

Seems like it would just encourage them to jail US citizens on bogus charges in the hopes it catches media attention and they can release another high profile asset for themselves.

[BigToast]

Seems like it would just encourage them to jail US citizens on bogus charges in the hopes it catches media attention and they can release another high profile asset for themselves.

Again, this has been the MO for decades. That's how political prisoners work.

[Breccia]

This feels like the union sick days vs. economy paralysis debate again. I think we can all agree there is no objectively correct answer to this one, and that the situation sucks.

But if I had to pick a side, I'd go with "the United States does not negotiate with terrorists". Then someone would point out Trump and the Taliban and I'd say "well yeah, that's why not".

[s_bushido]

No one would have literally cared if she were arrested in any other country. "But it's a political stunt!" True, but that does not make this deal any less stupid.

She would not have been arrested in any other country. Except...idk...North Korea. And we (sometimes) try to get those people released as well. If conservative shitbags want to spin this as a loss for the current administration, that's not a flaw with said administration, that's a flaw with their dogshit ideology.

[Deus Mortis]

She would not have been arrested in any other country. Except...idk...North Korea. And we (sometimes) try to get those people released as well. If conservative shitbags want to spin this as a loss for the current administration, that's not a flaw with said administration, that's a flaw with their dogshit ideology.

Uhh hashish oil is still a schedule 1 drug in the United States and illegal on the Federal level https://www.dea.gov/sites/default/fi...bis-2020_0.pdf and here is a map where weed is illegal based on country https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...eed-is-illegal. She knowingly went to a country with a banned drug. This is not a case of some innocent person. While the crime is that was committed was harmless except to her, people have to know that taking drugs into other countries is a recipe for disaster. This is not a good look on this administration for the sole purpose of who we are releasing her for. At the end of the day I am happy that another American is home, and hopefully she will have no plans returning to Russia in the future.

[s_bushido]

Uhh

She would not have been arrested and held as a political prisoner in any other country.

There, I fixed it.

[DarkTZeratul]

She would not have been arrested in any other country.

And where that's *not* true, most countries would just deport her straight back to the US and ban her from returning, not throw her in prison indefinitely. It usually takes a lot to imprison the citizen of another country; it's practically unheard of to do so for mere contraband.

[Milchshake]

Again, the best thing about Biden. He doent care what Very Online People say.

President Biden giving nearly $36 billion to aid Teamsters’ pension fund, with 25,000 participants in Illinois.
President Joe Biden on Thursday is announcing the infusion of nearly $36 billion to shore up a financially troubled union pension plan, preventing severe cuts to the retirement incomes of more than 350,000 Teamsters workers and retirees across the United States.

The money for the Central States Pension Fund is the largest amount of federal aid provided for a pension plan, the Biden administration said, and comes from the American Rescue Plan, a $1.9 trillion coronavirus relief package that he signed into law in 2021.

Many union retirement plans have been under financial pressure because of underfunding and other issues. Without the federal assistance, Teamsters members could have seen their benefits reduced by an average of 60% starting within a couple of years.

[Templar 331]

A corporation not funding its employees' pension fund? Sounds like something that should have the union striking instead Biden giving a handout to cury favor after his last union debacle.

[Edge-]

A corporation not funding its employees' pension fund? Sounds like something that should have the union striking instead Biden giving a handout to cury favor after his last union debacle.

Even when Biden does something good, he loses. Really, liberals make it impossible to win because the win just isn't perfect enough.

[Templar 331]

Even when Biden does something good, he loses. Really, liberals make it impossible to win because the win just isn't perfect enough.

This isn't a win, this is exactly like the last time. It's Biden choosing between the right answer and the smart answer. Yes this helps the unions out now (smart) but in the long run when the next time they are in need of help their leverage will be the same or worst. He's shown that it isn't the unions and their ability to strike that make the choices here. It's the people with the money.

The right answer to this problem would be to make the corporations honor their agreement and properly fund the pension. If they do not, push for legislation to ensure the unions get their full benefits with threat of strike. Not just write them a check and say all's well.

[Milchshake]

Or... the Teamsters asked the Dems for help. Biden and Dems created a plan to use the American Rescuse Plan in early 2021 to help. They delivered the check today.

Hey look, there's the Teamsters guy right there.

[Templar 331]

Or... the Teamsters asked the Dems for help. Biden and Dems created a plan to use the American Rescuse Plan in early 2021 to help. They delivered the check today.

Hey look, there's the Teamsters guy right there.

"Here's a check for some money that was meant for something else. It should solve this problem." You think the unions are going to turn it down? Would refusing inspire the Democrats to draft legislation to strengthen the union's bargaining ability? This is just a fix for the symptom. Kicking the can down the road without fixing the problem. It's nothing more than false hope. Optics for a photo opt.

[Edge-]

"Here's a check for some money that was meant for something else. It should solve this problem." You think the unions are going to turn it down?

If it was as bad as you imply, yes.

Would refusing inspire the Democrats to draft legislation to strengthen the union's bargaining ability?

Does accepting it make it more likely? Because either way it's not likely without Democrats having a filibuster-proof majority.

This is just a fix for the symptom. Kicking the can down the road without fixing the problem. It's nothing more than false hope. Optics for a photo opt.

Yes, when there's no practical way to address the cause, the best you can do is "treat" the symptoms. Which is better than, "doing nothing at all" which is the alternative.

[Milchshake]

"Here's a check for some money that was meant for something else. It should solve this problem." You think the unions are going to turn it down? Would refusing inspire the Democrats to draft legislation to strengthen the union's bargaining ability? This is just a fix for the symptom. Kicking the can down the road without fixing the problem. It's nothing more than false hope. Optics for a photo opt.

You're being purposely obtuese.
Unions have been asking for pension help for years. The GOP refuses to help. Soon as Dems win a marginal trifecta, they earmarked those relief funds in the ARP for pension bailouts.
They bailed out multiple pensions from this plan; coal miners, steel workers, Delphi, etc. This was a plan that was years in the making. Not some photo op.
If you cant appreciate the planning involed. I worry about your ability to plan for a strike you're so thirsty for.


You're basically pulling a Kokolums, hoping that a Civil War General Strike will make your enemies suffer.

The more it becomes apparent that this isn't going to happen, the more they rage at whoever appears to be stopping the world from collapsing.

[Templar 331]

You're basically pulling a Kokolums, hoping that a Civil War General Strike will make your enemies suffer.

This is probably the only thing you've said that was right. Yes, I want a general strike across this nation. I want the U.S. middle class to stand up and show who has the power. I want a middle class that can live, not just survive. I want social programs in place that will help people like my mother who had to suffer from a crippling disease and couldn't work. And the first step in that course is for unions and Democrats to move for stronger worker's rights, higher wages and pension protection. Not just sign checks or play middle man in contract disputes. Get something set in stone! Something that not even the Republicans would dare fight against. Go all fucking out! Because we are generations behind on this shit something has to start in order to rectify this mess.

The more it becomes apparent that this isn't going to happen, the more they rage at whoever appears to be stopping the world from collapsing.

The world's not going to collapse. Even if the Republicans get all three branches again and push for some hellish labor laws or strip what rights we do have, the world will continue on. The difference will be in how much suffering the majority of us will have to endure.

[Shadowferal]

This is probably the only thing you've said that was right. Yes, I want a general strike across this nation. I want the U.S. middle class to stand up and show who has the power.

But you're not.
Most of the middle class is struggling today. They aren't in unions, most are living paycheck to paycheck. And making it more difficult to get the basics by striking workers is only going to make them angry.

[Templar 331]

But you're not.
Most of the middle class is struggling today. They aren't in unions, most are living paycheck to paycheck. And making it more difficult to get the basics by striking workers is only going to make them angry.

That's the idea. They should be angry. They shouldn't take this shit. They shouldn't suffer like this. This country shouldn't be the laughing stock that it is. We fucking tout around like we're the shit but all we are is knee high in shit. And the only way any of this will change is when people stop accepting it and get angry! And if you think I'm wrong in this approach, just look at the Republican side. How many of these people vote R because they are angry about imaginary shit that Fox News feeds them on a daily basis?

This is real. This is what most people suffer with on a daily basis. And if that's not enough of a cause to rally behind then the Democrats are fucking up big time. Democrats are scared to raise minimum wage because they will get blamed for prices going up. They're scared to upset the corporations because, as Edge pointed out, they have media to attack any opposition with. So what do the Democrats do? Take baby steps until that magic day they get all three branches and a filibuster proof Congress? Well I'm here to tell you until the Democrats start pushing more than "the Republican party is evil" (which we already know) it's never going to happen. You won't get enough of a voter base to out number the ones the Republicans have and win elections unless you push hard. It worked enough to break even this midterm, but what about the next election?

[Shadowferal]

That's the idea. They should be angry. They shouldn't take this shit.

You don't get it.
The unions will get the blame. And should Biden pull a Reagan and terminate those four unions, recalling the military rail road workers, he'll be cheered by the middle class.

[Edge-]

That's the idea. They should be angry. They shouldn't take this shit. They shouldn't suffer like this. This country shouldn't be the laughing stock that it is. We fucking tout around like we're the shit but all we are is knee high in shit. And the only way any of this will change is when people stop accepting it and get angry! And if you think I'm wrong in this approach, just look at the Republican side. How many of these people vote R because they are angry about imaginary shit that Fox News feeds them on a daily basis?

Who are they going to be angry with, and what will the consequences of that be?

I mean shit, we've already seen some unions break for Republicans in recent years despite Republicans consistently working against union interests short of the "WE WANT TO BRING BACK MANUFACTURING TO AMERICA!" platitudes that leave us with a huge taxpayer funded deal to bring thousands of jobs to in a Foxxcon plant in Wisconsin alongside a $10B investment, which ends up falling apart like always.

You have to play the hand you're dealt within the rules of the game, not the hand you wish you were dealt in the game you wish you were playing.