1. #16821
    Titan Lenonis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redwyrm View Post
    You want to see the Right lose it's mind in hate and hypocrisy. Let Biden pardon his son at any point in his presidency.
    Honestly if he loses re-election I don't see any reason why he wouldn't. And frankly I'd be hard pressed to blame him. It's his son after all.
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    It's called resistance / rebellion.
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  2. #16822
    Quote Originally Posted by Lenonis View Post
    Honestly if he loses re-election I don't see any reason why he wouldn't. And frankly I'd be hard pressed to blame him. It's his son after all.
    Because that'd be a pretty transparent abuse of his power for personal/family gain and would just lead Republicans to declare that the pardon is PROOF of all their allegations.

    There's no reason to pardon him for anything right now. He broke some laws and will have to deal with the consequences, and almost everything that the GOP is pretending is SUPER DUPER CEREAL is largely either fictional or a complete and total non-legal issue for Hunter.

  3. #16823
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    There's no reason to pardon him for anything right now. He broke some laws and will have to deal with the consequences,
    Consequences that would frankly be pretty minor even if he weren't the president's son. Like, he's almost certainly not looking at anything more serious than some fines.

  4. #16824
    Titan Lenonis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Because that'd be a pretty transparent abuse of his power for personal/family gain and would just lead Republicans to declare that the pardon is PROOF of all their allegations.

    There's no reason to pardon him for anything right now. He broke some laws and will have to deal with the consequences, and almost everything that the GOP is pretending is SUPER DUPER CEREAL is largely either fictional or a complete and total non-legal issue for Hunter.
    Note I didn't say it would be the right or ethical decision. But as someone who would clearly be leaving the political stage for good he has very little personal reason to not ensure his kid is safe. The question is whether or not Biden's internal sense of morals and justice would outweigh his love as a father. And I would understand if they didn't. that's all I'm saying.

    That being said I also fully expect the right wing to lose interest when Biden leaves office. They'll find a different target to witchhunt.
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    It's called resistance / rebellion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana Violence View Post
    Also, one day the tables might turn.

  5. #16825
    Quote Originally Posted by Lenonis View Post
    Note I didn't say it would be the right or ethical decision. But as someone who would clearly be leaving the political stage for good he has very little personal reason to not ensure his kid is safe. The question is whether or not Biden's internal sense of morals and justice would outweigh his love as a father. And I would understand if they didn't. that's all I'm saying.

    That being said I also fully expect the right wing to lose interest when Biden leaves office. They'll find a different target to witchhunt.
    So fuck everyone else, just as long as he gets his? I know that's not your intention, but that's basically what you're arguing here.

    Hunter, largely, is no in any serious legal jeopardy himself. He's facing some consequences, but nothing like decades of jailtime (hell, even years probably). The Republican investigations into him also aren't really about him, nor are they turning up much beyond some potential additional tax evasion (the horror!) for him to be worried about, they're just using him to get to Dark Brandon.

    The actions would reflect upon the Democratic party more broadly in a negative way and validate all the Republicans claims of impropriety. It would be a monumentally stupid idea. To your point, the second Biden leaves office they'll lose interest in him and consequently in Hunter as they seek to find some new nontroversy to gin up.

  6. #16826
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkTZeratul View Post
    Consequences that would frankly be pretty minor even if he weren't the president's son. Like, he's almost certainly not looking at anything more serious than some fines.
    Yeah, but you'll never convince the sippenhaft brigade of that. They all insist that there totally was damning evidence of serious offenses on the infamous laptop, that they saw it, that they could prove it, and that they're only not proving it out of respect for the supposed victims. (Never mind how if it were legit, someone would have alerted the FBI and he'd be up on far more serious charges.)

    Anyway: I say let him face the consequences for what we know he did do. He's a grown-ass adult.
    Last edited by Dacia Ultan; 2023-12-04 at 09:05 PM.

  7. #16827
    Biden ban on menthol cigarettes to be delayed amid political concerns, officials say
    Quote Originally Posted by WaPo
    The Biden administration will further delay a long-awaited ban on menthol cigarettes after fierce lobbying from critics who warn that a prohibition could anger some Black smokers who favor the products and could hurt President Biden’s reelection prospects, administration officials said.The Biden administration will further delay a long-awaited ban on menthol cigarettes after fierce lobbying from critics who warn that a prohibition could anger some Black smokers who favor the products and could hurt President Biden’s reelection prospects, administration officials said.
    The proposed ban has revealed deep fissures in the African American community, with proponents saying that removing menthol cigarettes will save hundreds of thousands of lives. But high-profile opponents, including the American Civil Liberties Union and some prominent civil rights figures such as the Rev. Al Sharpton, assert that a ban would foster an underground market, leading police to disproportionately target smokers who are Black.
    Get your Newports while you can.

  8. #16828
    Titan Lenonis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    So fuck everyone else, just as long as he gets his?
    Again not that I agree with it but that is how American politics seems to be these days.

    To be clear I don't think there should be a pardon.
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    It's called resistance / rebellion.
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    Also, one day the tables might turn.

  9. #16829
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Biden refuses to commit to debating.

    Spoken reason: Biden's too busy being President.

    Unspoken reason: Why would Biden debate Trump if Trump won't debate anyone?

    Now, Biden would massacre Trump in any fair debate. But quite frankly, I don't think anyone expects one. If the debates have fair and honest impartial moderators, Trump can't get away with chain lying about winning 2020, and that's all he has. He'll bail.

  10. #16830
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Biden refuses to commit to debating.

    Spoken reason: Biden's too busy being President.

    Unspoken reason: Why would Biden debate Trump if Trump won't debate anyone?

    Now, Biden would massacre Trump in any fair debate. But quite frankly, I don't think anyone expects one. If the debates have fair and honest impartial moderators, Trump can't get away with chain lying about winning 2020, and that's all he has. He'll bail.
    Biden would massacre Trump in an academic, properly moderated debate. Where the moderator will step in and penalize spewing falsehoods.

    But that's not what political debates are. Political debates are about if you can undercut your opponent's popular support, or bolster your own by being particularly inspirational, among the fraction of the audience who'd be willing to listen to you. Trump's supporters are immune to being challenged on their blind faith; if they weren't all these criminal charges and such would've hurt his support, and it really hasn't. A debate isn't going to move the needle at all. And Biden? Biden's a known factor, and he's not going to say anything surprising or inspirational at this stage that will get disaffected voters to shout "Oh yeah!" and get motivated to turn out for him, where they otherwise would've stayed home. He's doing fine, but "doing fine" isn't going to get people to turn out.

    Even assuming both did show up, I don't see a debate affecting polling very much, if at all, even if Trump spends the entire time just making fart noises with his mouth. Hell, he'd probably gain support for that.


  11. #16831
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Hunter Biden indicted on nine new charges, three felonies and six misdemeanors, involved with $1.4 million of unpaid taxes.

    Well, if there's enough evidence, then charge him. No-one is above the law.

  12. #16832
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Hunter Biden indicted on nine new charges, three felonies and six misdemeanors, involved with $1.4 million of unpaid taxes.

    Well, if there's enough evidence, then charge him. No-one is above the law.
    Yep, no one cares. Except Republicans, they think that this means that Joe Biden is guilty, because the sins of the son also go on the father, somehow.

  13. #16833
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Hunter Biden indicted on nine new charges, three felonies and six misdemeanors, involved with $1.4 million of unpaid taxes.

    Well, if there's enough evidence, then charge him. No-one is above the law.
    Pay your fuckin taxes, yo. I don't think this is some weird "DEEP STATE" conspiracy theory to get him, seems like he broke the fuckin law. Oh no, justice may be served. Perish the thought.

  14. #16834
    Titan Lenonis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Pay your fuckin taxes, yo.
    The funny(?) part of this is if it were one of trump's kids conservatives would be cheering tax evasion because taxation is theft blah blah blah.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana Violence View Post
    It's called resistance / rebellion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana Violence View Post
    Also, one day the tables might turn.

  15. #16835
    This is a good conclusion to the acts of IRS whistleblowers Gary Shapley and Joseph Ziegler. They testified that they had sufficient evidence to charge Hunter Biden with crimes, but higher-ups did nothing with it. Now, the very evidence that they first uncovered is being used in criminal charges. Justice served.

    Don't try to write off payments to prostitutes and sex clubs as business expenses when dealing with the IRS.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  16. #16836
    Quote Originally Posted by Lenonis View Post
    The funny(?) part of this is if it were one of trump's kids conservatives would be cheering tax evasion because taxation is theft blah blah blah.
    They cheered when Trump himself evaded taxes.

    They cheered when Romney evaded taxes.

  17. #16837
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Don't try to write off payments to prostitutes and sex clubs as business expenses when dealing with the IRS.
    You know who else did that?

    Trump.

    Cohen paid off a prostitute. We haven't heard the last of that. I expect such an upstanding, genuine poster such as yourself to be consistent when this topic comes up again.

  18. #16838
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    This is a good conclusion to the acts of IRS whistleblowers Gary Shapley and Joseph Ziegler. They testified that they had sufficient evidence to charge Hunter Biden with crimes, but higher-ups did nothing with it. Now, the very evidence that they first uncovered is being used in criminal charges. Justice served.

    Don't try to write off payments to prostitutes and sex clubs as business expenses when dealing with the IRS.
    Funny. When a Republican did it he was good enough to be elected president.

    I also hope maybe you can see that properly funding the IRS to go after tax cheats instead of cutting their already insufficient funding so like Republicans want is something all of us should support.
    “Logic: The art of thinking and reasoning in strict accordance with the limitations and incapacities of the human misunderstanding.”
    "Conservative, n: A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal who wishes to replace them with others."
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  19. #16839
    Quote Originally Posted by shimerra View Post
    Funny. When a Republican did it he was good enough to be elected president.

    I also hope maybe you can see that properly funding the IRS to go after tax cheats instead of cutting their already insufficient funding so like Republicans want is something all of us should support.
    Yes, the famously right-wing IRS that suppressed prosecution of Trump crimes prior to Trump's election.

    Institutional rot is, surprisingly enough, a poor argument for funding the rot much harder. Two unmoving truths about the American bureaucracy is that failures are due to not having enough money, and successes are proof of deserving additional funding.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  20. #16840
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Yes, the famously right-wing IRS that suppressed prosecution of Trump crimes prior to Trump's election.

    Institutional rot is, surprisingly enough, a poor argument for funding the rot much harder. Two unmoving truths about the American bureaucracy is that failures are due to not having enough money, and successes are proof of deserving additional funding.
    Typical of you to misunderstand the issue using stock conservative dribble.


    No institution is perfect, but spare me your rambling about some arbitrary concept of small government or rot. You show zero interest in actually addressing said rot and actively encourage it when it benefits your ideology. And much of that rot you're citing was explicitly put there at the request of Republican voters. Case in point the Trump tax cuts that expired for the bottom brackets but were permanent for high earners.

    The IRS has been woefully understaffed for decades and the ones who remain are deinceitvized to prosecute much of the white collar crime they do find. This is 100% explicitly intentional overwhelming thanks to Republicans. One such example when you could file paper forms, something conservatives kept open despite that it was the preferred avenue to commit fraud, was how Republicans specifically cut funding for the people whose job it was to transcribe the physical tax forms as well as restricting the information they transcribed making it harder to find fraud.

    Republicans will shit their pants if a single low income individual gets food stamps that shouldn't. But a wealthy donner abuses incorporation laws and charitable write offs letting them cheat their way out of millions in taxes? Go for it! And folks like you cheerlead them along as it's done because most of you seem to think you're just a temporarily embarrassed millionaire hoping you can benefit yourself one day.
    If we rooted out every single cent of fraud from the food stamp/welfare programs it would still pale in comparison to the billions of taxes people like Trump dodge every year. But the mere idea of a fast-food worker using his EBT card for lobster enrages you far more than the billions of taxes dodged by the top earners.

    The two unmoving truths of American society is partisan hacks like yourself continue to misunderstand issues and their causes and that solving them is impossible because of some conservative principle you only apply when convenient or the solution is actually socialism and evil. If you'd like to actually educate yourself on something for once two excellent books are Perfectly Legal and Free Lunch.
    Last edited by shimerra; 2023-12-08 at 07:02 PM.
    “Logic: The art of thinking and reasoning in strict accordance with the limitations and incapacities of the human misunderstanding.”
    "Conservative, n: A statesman who is enamored of existing evils, as distinguished from the Liberal who wishes to replace them with others."
    Ambrose Bierce
    The Bird of Hermes Is My Name, Eating My Wings To Make Me Tame.

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