Soo...Is Shadowlands any good?

[Hopjesvla]

So...sounds like this is for the casual player...

Define casual though. You can still be a knowledgeable and skilled player without having to spend hours grinding same things over and over again.

[mojusk]

So...sounds like this is for the casual player...

only for those who lack the imagination of how to improve your power when a big neon sign isnt showing you the way.

[Shadowferal]

"Casual" wasn't a criticism.

[Rageadon]

What do you mean "sounds like"? There are completely different things. I mean your opinion is your own, but at least have basic knowledge about things you criticize.

How are they different? You need to farm it into oblivion to stay relevant

[The King in Yellow]

I'm loving it so far. (Especially way more than BFA).

The dungeons are fun, the zones look amazing and I am looking forward to the rest of the story and the upcoming raids. Hopefully it will remain as good as it is to me right now.

[Naiattavain]

im liking the shadowlands expac more than legion and bfa by far. my only complaint is that we have to finish the campaign of story before we could choose covenant before 60. right now i dinged 60 expecting to join a covenant. just kinda let down after that lol.

so far though the expansion is pretty good but we need to make rogues stronger i think alliance walks over the class and its a joke a very sic joke at blizzard at this point. paladins are too strong for the game to be considered balanced. my suggestions is to recommend giving every class weaknesses and strengths rogues are too squishy and don't do decent damage for a trade off to play right now. games fucked as its left this way. the quality of the game is terrible right now.

i think the content of the shadowlands expansion is decent though it good enough to entertain.

[Gorsameth]

So...sounds like this is for the casual player...

I'd call it less grindy, rather then casual.

[bloodwulf]

I like it a lot. I was getting skeptical the weeks prior to launch but really enjoy it. The lack of endless grind is great and the reason I already have two 60s and working on my third. Goal is to have 10 by end of January. Toghast is fun as hell and the dungeons are all great in my opinion.

My only issue is how antifun the maw is. It is tedious and boring, but luckily, asides from gem slots, there is not a ton you need from there, so if you have alts that dont need a gem slot on every piece of gear, you dont have to grind the maw.

- - - Updated - - -

im liking the shadowlands expac more than legion and bfa by far. my only complaint is that we have to finish the campaign of story before we could choose covenant before 60. right now i dinged 60 expecting to join a covenant. just kinda let down after that lol.

so far though the expansion is pretty good but we need to make rogues stronger i think alliance walks over the class and its a joke a very sic joke at blizzard at this point. paladins are too strong for the game to be considered balanced. my suggestions is to recommend giving every class weaknesses and strengths rogues are too squishy and don't do decent damage for a trade off to play right now. games fucked as its left this way. the quality of the game is terrible right now.

i think the content of the shadowlands expansion is decent though it good enough to entertain.

What in the world are you talking about? A faction walking all over a class (heads up alliance has rogues as well). Also I have seen rogues essentially 100 to 0 people in a stun lock right now. Subtlety seems exceptionally powerful in PVP....

[music49]

From the view of a higher end raider:

Leveling: First time through is always the best, each zone is beautiful in its own way, and individual stories in each zone has me hooked. Music and art work always an A+ from blizzard. This time around there is a campaign quest line is clearly marked that has to be done to unlock stuff, so you may hit max level in the second to last zone, but you don't get a ton of pop up quests until you finish the campaign which is great so you never really feel overwhelmed. There are also tons of side quests that you can do as you go or save for later for days you have extra time on WoW

Second time through: I'm taking my time and doing all the side quests and gathering mats both to use and to auction off. There is a skip campaign feature which I've only heard bad things about but I don't know how it works to give a proper opinion except that everyone has told me to avoid it, I'll try it on my next alt.

Hitting lvl cap and completing your leveling campaign: Once you finish the campaign questline and hit lvl 60 you will get a quest to choose your covenant for a HUGE majority of the games population go with what is fun is the only advice I can give. If your doing high end raiding your going to go with what performs better . But if your even a casual mythic raiding guild, your covenant choice doesn't really matter. That being said some covenants just make some classes better to play. (Example: Elemental Shaman is LOADS more enjoyable to play with necrolord covenant, I personally don't see playing elemental on any other covenant). As per usual once you finish leveling and the leveling section of the campaign you will start getting a bunch of quests. Seems like a lot, but just need to knock them out one by one to unlock the few end game features.

END GAME:

Covenant: What I thought the biggest issue was going to be isn't so round of applause to blizzard for that. As long as you do the weekly anima quest and campaign quests, your caught up performance wise. This will give you renown (different from anima) which unlocks your soulbind tree. Everything else is optional, upgrade your covenant in what ever order you want. The mission table is a little more interactive allowing you to "mid-max" your followers and what slot you put them in, but at the same time so easy to use its not an annoyance. With no flying yet, the transportation upgrade for your covenant is great way to get around your zone your covenant is in. But some zones (Revendreth) are a pain to get around. I'm should be able to get my build-a-bear/monstrosity upgrade next reset which again is all optional but sounds fun.

World Quests/Callings: (formally emissaries): Nothing has really changed here. Some WQs are easier than others. Callings you now have to accept from a given NPC in your covenant hall, however its little more varied than just doing WQ's. It could be fill the bar by doing anything in the zone (collecting treasures, killing rares) to clear the dungeons in the zones.

Dungeons: Each dungeon is a part of the zones story, and each boss is varied enough to not feel like a grind when running multiple in a row. I can see a few bosses being pug killers if even one person doesn't know the fight (find a guild), but all fun and I'm excited to start running a couple mythic +'s

Maw: This is by far my least favorite part of the expansion. Down to the bar bones its do the two dailies and event, kill as many rares as you can, then leave before dying. If you die you loose half your currency but can recover it if you go back to your body, if you die again while running back to your body you loose half of what ever you have on you and the original lost currency disappears. SO if your unlucky you could multiple days of collecting if your not careful. As a higher end raider I want to get exalted with the person in the maw and collect as much stygia (maw currency) as possible to be able to buy sockets for my gear. With that, if you don't care about getting sockets for your gear then the maw is optional for you

Torghast: My favorite feature so far, I can see people playing Wow just for this feature alone. A little confusing at first. Each week only so many wings are open( I think two) and each wing has 8 layers. (only 3 layers week 1 not sure about week 2, but all will be available to unlock when raid comes out) You unlock any layer of any wing by doing the previous level layer of any wing. You collect soul ash your fist time through to go towards building or upgrading you legendary item. I believe you only need to do the highest level of each wing that rewards soul ash to get the weekly cap. So if your not a fan of torghast you only have to do minimal content of it to get what you need. I'm guessing layer 4 or 5 and past that will give you some sort of torghast currency for cosmetics, or maybe nothing at all and it's all just for fun, which I will do. I do hope they add more anima powers to torghast per raid teir, but if they don't I'm okay with that too.

Legionaries: Pick your best one for the content you "main" and go get the recipe for it, some might be better off waiting until mythic raid launches to craft their legendary, some already have there BiS and can crafting this first reset after collecting enough soul ash from torghast, and some might be better off collecting their second best legendary.

PVP: I don't pvp and I don't think rated pvp is even available yet

Overall opinion: Shadowlands is starting off strong. I think the maw could use a little tuning or something else maybe a place to bank your stygia for the day so its not ALL at risk every time you go to the maw. Torghast is super fun and I hope more anima powers get added as we go. As a higher end raider, the required content is fun, and the optional content is even more enjoyable. I feel the more casual a player you are the more enjoyable this expansion gets because you can focus on what is really fun for you and ignore the rest

This is only week one with the first reset still not here, so I'd check back in maybe a week or two into raid progress as things can ad will probably change

[Zyrinx]

It's a 7/10 for me.

I liked, generally, the MSQ

Travel is tough. Mob density is high and terrain is a problem, especially in Bastion.

Rares and treasures seem good, if you can get there. Random chest icons on the map with no clue how to get them doesn't feel that great. They seem important. But who knows.

Trying out the rental powers as you level is great

You really really really should get a covenant hearthstone to your sanctum a la Dalaran and Garrison

The max level systems and grinds aren't explained very well, like, at all. I had no idea I til I watched a video that Renown was via the Anima weekly. Are there other ways go gain renown? I have no idea.

I have no idea at all how this mission table mini game works, it's not explained at all. Heals in the back, I guess? Does left/right spacing matter? Who knows. I'll hope for an add-on to do it for me ingame.

In on the fence about torgast, I wanted to love it, but it does seem really really repetitive so far. Jury is out tho I haven't been above level 1.

Didn't do the dungeons yet. Probably should have. But I guess there are some large one time anima quests so maybe it's better I didn't. Dunno.

[Dracullus]

How are they different? You need to farm it into oblivion to stay relevant

No you not. You need only 1000 per week to keep your Renown catched up.

[Adam Jensen]

I think it's good so far. Torghast is pretty amazing.

Except for Layer 3 Synod. Synod can go fuck himself.

[DesoPL]

If people think Shadowlands is BfA 2.0 then their problem is not with BfA but with modern WoW, which is fine, because Shadowlands is a pretty significant departure from what made BfA, BfA.
No more infinite grinds, no more Titanforging, a more relaxed pace.

Tbh metacritic lost his credibility long ago, so i don't take serious opinions from fans. Allthough there is few rare cases i take, like it was with Warcraft 3 (D)eforged.

[Demithio]

I'm on full empathy.

And that's why there's "Classic."

Glad you're full of empathy. However, it seems classic has some 'gold hording' issues that wernt present in the original.

[bloodwulf]

Here is how i score the general features of the Expack currently available.
Leveling - Very short, but a lot of escort missions and talking head missions. 7/10
Grind - No endless grind, the important weekly things can be done in a night. 9/10
Class Balance - Build any type opinion on M0s and nonseasonal PVP is a mistake. No Score Yet
Environments - Hands down the best looking expansion to date, and the sound is great . 10/10
Covenants - Far less impactful than they were in early beta, their weekly events are boring but the visuals are cool. 5/10
Torghast - Best new side mode introduced to the game, and i really hope they expand on this. 10/10
The Maw - Boring and slow, but the Stygia being largely only used for Maw/Torghast upgrades is fine. For the majority of players the sockets wont make meaningful difference. 3/10
Story - I mean its wow, the story has kinda sucked for a while, but its better than another faction war. 6/10
Callings - Vast improvement over emissaries, and the fact that you can progress them in dungeons a lot of the time is very nice. 8/10
Conduits - Had potential to be problematic, but has largely been nerfed to just another passive system. The 10hr cd seems pointless but at least we can change them. 6/10
Dungeons - Personally feel there are more good dungeons than bad dungeons and the good ones (DOS, TOP, HOA) really stand out. 9/10
Alt Friendliness - Catch up mechanics from the start, short leveling experience, ability to skip hours of RP with Threads of Fate. 9/10

Largely i feel Shadowlands is greatly improved on BFA, I log on every day with something im excited to do. My guild is incredibly active and asides from the Maw i have yet to hear anyone whose opinion matters to me really complain. It also seems like the high end players really enjoy the game a lot better than they did at BFA start, and i enjoy watching their content greatly.

[oldgeezer]

It's a 7/10 for me.

I liked, generally, the MSQ

Travel is tough. Mob density is high and terrain is a problem, especially in Bastion.

Rares and treasures seem good, if you can get there. Random chest icons on the map with no clue how to get them doesn't feel that great. They seem important. But who knows.

A bunch of chests appeared on my Bastion map yesterday when I was doing whatever the equivalent of the Emissary is. On reaching them, often in itself not an easy task, they were locked, requiring some random item or objective to open. There were no breadcrumbs about how I might achieve this. That's just bad game design.

Likewise the WQ which leave you baffled about what you actually have to do, and when you find out from a third party site (how many players will be doing that?), you see that it's something with multiple stages and beyond tedious.

And the total, ungainly mess that is Covenants, soulbinds, conduits, renown, anima, stygia, the fragmented world, etc.
I haven't even tried Torghast yet. Maybe it's amazing.

This is not elegant, compelling design Blizzard. I am disappointed.

[Raisei]

Shadowlands might just be the best WoW expansion yet. It feels simultaniously more modern and keeps the classic way of playing the game intact. Many things people disliked were removed (like the infinite grind) the visuals are stunning, the story so far had some very emotional and epic scenes that hint at many deep lore threads we will learn more about in the future.
Class Balance seems to be really good, Covenants too. The choice you make is more about your personal taste then about pure performance. Unless you are a Mythic Raider the difference in pure numbers is small so that you can decide with Utility or Style in mind. I personally was torn between NF and Venthyr since both had good abilities and good style. Decided on Venthyr in the end because that is what fit my character better.

So yes, it is good. Despite all the doomsayers that wanted the game to die over a decade ago, WoW is in it's 16th year and still improving with new and fun content.

A bunch of chests appeared on my Bastion map yesterday when I was doing whatever the equivalent of the Emissary is. On reaching them, often in itself not an easy task, they were locked, requiring some random item or objective to open. There were no breadcrumbs about how I might achieve this. That's just bad game design.

Likewise the WQ which leave you baffled about what you actually have to do, and when you find out from a third party site (how many players will be doing that?), you see that it's something with multiple stages and beyond tedious.

That's called a puzzle or a riddle. Things do not always have to have the solution being obvious. Especially if they are completely optional. GW2 for example had whole areas that were "jumping puzzles", there was no explanation and no route through them told to you, you just went in and tried it. People really need to stop calling a game bad because it does not hand them everything on a silver plater at their convenience. Challenges, both mental and physical, are a good thing.

And the total, ungainly mess that is Covenants, soulbinds, conduits, renown, anima, stygia, the fragmented world, etc.
I haven't even tried Torghast yet. Maybe it's amazing.

This is not elegant, compelling design Blizzard. I am disappointed.

Nothing about these systems is a mess, they work completely fine and offer advanced options to customize your character. This game just isn't a hack and slash dungeon crawl that can be played with your eyes closed, you need to pay a minimum of attention. Compared to Legion and BFA there was already quite some stuff cut. If they had cut even more there would be nothing new and people would complain about that.

[schwank05]

It's a 7/10 for me.

I liked, generally, the MSQ

Travel is tough. Mob density is high and terrain is a problem, especially in Bastion.

Rares and treasures seem good, if you can get there. Random chest icons on the map with no clue how to get them doesn't feel that great. They seem important. But who knows.

Trying out the rental powers as you level is great

You really really really should get a covenant hearthstone to your sanctum a la Dalaran and Garrison

The max level systems and grinds aren't explained very well, like, at all. I had no idea I til I watched a video that Renown was via the Anima weekly. Are there other ways go gain renown? I have no idea.

I have no idea at all how this mission table mini game works, it's not explained at all. Heals in the back, I guess? Does left/right spacing matter? Who knows. I'll hope for an add-on to do it for me ingame.

In on the fence about torgast, I wanted to love it, but it does seem really really repetitive so far. Jury is out tho I haven't been above level 1.

Didn't do the dungeons yet. Probably should have. But I guess there are some large one time anima quests so maybe it's better I didn't. Dunno.

This is honestly my only complaint so far the Story was great, I loved that I could skip all side quests and only do the Main story Quests and dinged like 2 quests into Ravendreath. I loved Maldraxxus, the Covenant stuff is great and seems meaningful unlike Order halls or Garrisons. I like the dungeons so far many have little trash which is nice, I have enjoyed Torghast ive done Layer 3 and only ever really died to the traps as Frost DK. All in all its one of the best launches since CATA for me so we will see how it plays out as of now its a solid 8/10.

[oldgeezer]

That's called a puzzle or a riddle. [..] Challenges, both mental and physical, are a good thing.

It certainly is a puzzle, but it's not a good puzzle. It's just tedious, and time-filling. There's no clue, at all, to the solution in game. If you like that sort of thing, more power to you. Personally I prefer to just log off for the evening and find something more interesting to do.

And while I'm here, what was the rationale for removing the SL flight whistle? (other than 'increasing engagement').

[Shadowferal]

Shadowlands might just be the best WoW expansion yet.

So yes, it is good. Despite all the doomsayers that wanted the game to die over a decade ago, WoW is in it's 16th year and still improving with new and fun content.

"Bestest expansion ever"

..gawd...if you're not the one that says that about every expansion you sure fit in with those that do.