Soo...Is Shadowlands any good?

[Yriel]

IShadowlands also has the worst looking zones I can remember. I'm not saying the art and models are necessarily bad, but the all-encompassing dreariness and lack of contrast in every zone (except one that still manages to feel very monochromatic) is horrible. Getting around is also not interesting. It feels very linear with no way to even attempt to puzzle around overhanging very tall sheer cliffs.

It's the same with the dungeons imo.
I've never seen so many bland, boring, by the book dungeons that look like they came out of a random generator. Bosses are so-so but the dungeons themselves make me not want to run them often.

[james2400]

I think the shine will wear off faster than BFA, this is a extremely shallow timegated expansion.

And yes at the start BFA was being praised as a good expansion one of the best.

- - - Updated - - -

Active 60's with covenants picked equates to ~2million players assuming Mains and not alts.

wowranks.io/stats

[Dhrizzle]

Cant say I entirely disagree; however theres probably a little more to it than that. I think the player base has changed due to changes in the game - game leads - players follow. For instance, my (very) long standing guild, and friends list are pretty much empty. Mainly due to the "old school" type people being unhappy with the way WoW has went for the past several or more years. Now they no longer play, even on a part time, casual level. Different crowd, with different expectations of the game.

Classic, there seems to be some issues there with it that weren't there in the original release. Something about gold hording, at least thats what I heard. I only played it a short while when it first released. Also, yes, its really just the 'been there, done that' factor as well.

There's probably some sort of feedback loop going on. The game changes to suit the players, the players change to suit the game, rinse+repeat ad infinitum.

[kamuimac]

After 2 resets

1) Leveling in SL is obnoxius boring and unfun - theads of fate are compelte garbage worse then campaign
2)endgame is extremly gated
3)raids will be usual raids - those who enjoy them would enjoy any kind of piniata that drops loot
4)endgame for non raiders/non mythic + people is non existent and whatever remains in form of renown farm and anima gear is extremly gated

basicly - if you are a raider this is a dream expansion for you as you can log in raid log off

they baickly reverted game to cataclysm design .

for me ? im taking a break from wow - tomorrow gonna clear CN on normal and then going to play Cyberpunk - may return in 3-4 months once timegates are lifted .

i would be surprised if they didnt suffer a huge sub loss by the end of year seeing how weak and pathetic shallow and empty endgame this expansion is comapred to Legion and BfA. Cyberpunk is gonna steal a f...ton of their playerbase

[Balazzar]

I came back after years away (see my post history if don't believe me). My first concern with it was that I hit 60 and then had to rush 'gogogogo' through half Ardenweald and all of Revendreth to actually play the Covenants. Hated that. Side quests should be avoided at all costs on a first playthrough to anyone who hasn't started.

I don't like the Maw as it feels like a cop out. The place is empty and they added Eye of Jailer mechanic to disguise the fact that content-wise this is the drunkard step-brother to Timeless Islands or Nazjatar.

Torghast doesn't fit into WoW. I recently played Hades and Binding of Isaac. Those are very fun games that do this type of gametype MUCH better. Certain specs can steamroll Torghast and some cannot really even do Layer 3 alone--let alone 4-6 that are out soon. The Group Finder is already packed with 4/5 groups that want tank or healer only. Torghast doesn't make sense in a game designed around building a character for 15+ years. Games like Torghast are quite literally designed around discarding a toon after a run.

Daily Callings are okay now. More challenging and time consuming version of Emissaries (which was just kill 4 elites ASAP and leave). I get the feeling we got a few weeks until the hivemind at Reddit turns against these though.

I actually quite enjoy the dungeons.

I have unsubbed. I am not going to sit on forums complaining anymore than this one-time review. Once the initial new-expansion shine wears off it has the same early BFA feeling" 'this is empty.'

Not surprised to read it got record sales. At least in the northern part of North America the entire society is under lockdown again. Once a COVID vaccine is widely in use the game will ghost-town out as people have other things to do.

[Demithio]

There's probably some sort of feedback loop going on. The game changes to suit the players, the players change to suit the game, rinse+repeat ad infinitum.

I'm sure there is some of this going on, but I think there becomes a point where it becomes too much change for X number of players to "learn to like".

[huth]

I'm sure there is some of this going on, but I think there becomes a point where it becomes too much change for X number of players to "learn to like".

That's just life, though. The world changes. Go along with it or find something else, but you're not going to be able to stop it.

[Declaron]

I came back after years away (see my post history if don't believe me). My first concern with it was that I hit 60 and then had to rush 'gogogogo' through half Ardenweald and all of Revendreth to actually play the Covenants. Hated that. Side quests should be avoided at all costs on a first playthrough to anyone who hasn't started.

I don't like the Maw as it feels like a cop out. The place is empty and they added Eye of Jailer mechanic to disguise the fact that content-wise this is the drunkard step-brother to Timeless Islands or Nazjatar.

Torghast doesn't fit into WoW. I recently played Hades and Binding of Isaac. Those are very fun games that do this type of gametype MUCH better. Certain specs can steamroll Torghast and some cannot really even do Layer 3 alone--let alone 4-6 that are out soon. The Group Finder is already packed with 4/5 groups that want tank or healer only. Torghast doesn't make sense in a game designed around building a character for 15+ years. Games like Torghast are quite literally designed around discarding a toon after a run.

Daily Callings are okay now. More challenging and time consuming version of Emissaries (which was just kill 4 elites ASAP and leave). I get the feeling we got a few weeks until the hivemind at Reddit turns against these though.

I actually quite enjoy the dungeons.

I have unsubbed. I am not going to sit on forums complaining anymore than this one-time review. Once the initial new-expansion shine wears off it has the same early BFA feeling" 'this is empty.'

Not surprised to read it got record sales. At least in the northern part of North America the entire society is under lockdown again. Once a COVID vaccine is widely in use the game will ghost-town out as people have other things to do.

Im not far off you here mate.

I absolutely hated the "on-rails" levelling, the only enjoyable levelling zone was Revendreath in my opinion. Torghast is fun (for me at least, playing as BM/MM hunter) however as you quite rightly pointed out for some classes its basically impossible on layer 3 until they are in considerably better gear that what is available now (que people saying "omg wtf n00b i soloed it blindfold as a holy murlock blindfolded in ilvl 110 greens git gud" and so on...) yet for other classes its literally faceroll (pretty much any tank)

Dungeons are okay, seem a touch on the easy side however thats only speaking for m0. (Heroics seem kinda pointless now if im honest?)

In terms of Zones, Bastion is the best zone they have made for fucking ages. Reven is hard to navigate though and while it looks cool is basically just annoying, Arden is Hyjal 2.0 and Maldraxxus is just recycled plague shite.

Music is on the whole very poor compared to the usual standard.

Class design is very good, best since MoP.

---

All this being said, im surprised you have unsubbed already - while I do understand why you have. I think you should experience M1-15 to see how it plays out with the changed affixes, and at least do the raid on normal?

Each to their own obviously. I can see myself getting to 3/10m within the next 6-8 weeks then quitting until the next raid comes out. As far as the Anima and renown and all that shit goes I really dont care for it.

[Trumpcat]

It's good and living up to everything so far. Would have preferred more dungeons at launch.

[Eapoe]

After 2 resets

1) Leveling in SL is obnoxius boring and unfun - theads of fate are compelte garbage worse then campaign
2)endgame is extremly gated
3)raids will be usual raids - those who enjoy them would enjoy any kind of piniata that drops loot
4)endgame for non raiders/non mythic + people is non existent and whatever remains in form of renown farm and anima gear is extremly gated

basicly - if you are a raider this is a dream expansion for you as you can log in raid log off

they baickly reverted game to cataclysm design .

for me ? im taking a break from wow - tomorrow gonna clear CN on normal and then going to play Cyberpunk - may return in 3-4 months once timegates are lifted .

i would be surprised if they didnt suffer a huge sub loss by the end of year seeing how weak and pathetic shallow and empty endgame this expansion is comapred to Legion and BfA. Cyberpunk is gonna steal a f...ton of their playerbase

1). Subjective. I personally enjoy leveling. The only thing I dislike about it is that bonus areas are too long for the payoff and should probably be skipped.
2). What gate? Are you bringing up the inability to farm renown indefinitely? Yes, because that wouldn’t have people complain about having to grind nonstop to be powerful and unable to keep up with endgame players.
3). Pretty sure not every raid is met with praise and enjoyment.
4). What endgame did you have before this xpac? Endgame has always been PvP, raids, and recent addition of mythic+ in Legion. Are you counting what people call “loot piñata” of WQs as endgame?

Sounds like your more upset about not being able to just endlessly grind your way all the way up to the highest renown immediately and that Blizzard has basically put a parental lock on the system so players don’t go “waaah, I have nothing to do now that I hit max renown!”
Go play Cyberpunk. I hope you enjoy it. I will also be playing it in between things to do in WoW now that I can play it a little at a time without feeling like I’m letting myself fall behind. I’ll also be checking out loads of other games.
Yeah, you’re probably right. Huge sub loss right around the time the raids open up and players continue having things to do.

[Demithio]

That's just life, though. The world changes. Go along with it or find something else, but you're not going to be able to stop it.

True, but more accurately I would say "that's just corporate", and true, you're not going to stop it. It's all consuming in the gaming industry these days. However, some companies are worse than others.

If WoW were just a 'purchase to play' system I would probably be playing it very casually. WoW these days is like xyz game you purchase on Steam, between $30 - 50 or so for a month or two of entertainment. Then it gets more or less shelved. Paying $15 a month on top of an expansion price anymore seems almost crazy.

[Osmeric]

The only reason to play wow is to raidlog while getting 90%+ parses,

So, you're saying 90% of players have no reason to play WoW? Do understand that as people drop out, that top 10% becomes a smaller and smaller number of people.

If what you wrote there were the case generally, not just for yourself, the game would die almost instantly.

[BeepBoo]

If what you wrote there were the case generally, not just for yourself, the game would die almost instantly.

It's obviously not the case and was a "the reason I play wow" response. Seems plenty of people play wow to bumblefuck around doing world quests and dying in LFR as their personal goals; so more power to them. It was simply a way to give a frame of reference for how I'd judge if the game sucked or not.

[huth]

It's obviously not the case and was a "the reason I play wow" response.

Then write it as one, not as a generalist factual claim.

What you wrote implied that it is the only correct way to play the game, not your preferred way.

[melodramocracy]

And yes at the start BFA was being praised as a good expansion one of the best.

By whom, exactly? My first impression of BfA was one of being underwhelmed, and that never went away.

Now that the new car smell has left the expansion, so to speak... I'm still playing, still entertained, but all is not perfect:

1. While the zones are all amazing in their own ways, this expansion again drives home the idea that connected zones are the best implementations from a player immersion perspective. Northrend, Outlands, and Legion all feel 'better' than disassociated zone expansions (BfA, Cata, Shadowlands). Having said that, I get why they did it this way, this time around

2. The legendary system leaves quite a bit to be desired. Memories give you no indication of their limitations (what sort of gear it can be used on, what spec) until you go try and craft with it. Given the expense and timesink required to get soul ash + a good memory for your current class / spec, I think I liked the RNG acquisition better.

3. Leading me directly to Torghast. I don't dislike it, and it's eons better than Horrific Visions in every single way, but over the long haul I see this becoming pretty dreadful. I'm sort of hoping some alternate means of generating soul ash are introduced (perhaps a gear recycler much like BfA had)

4. Very minor nitpicks: The Ember Court is just dumb, and a tarnish on an otherwise pretty interesting system. The game also continues to suffer from currency bloat, which is something they should be steering away from rather than throwing more on the pile.

Lastly, the game doesn't feel like Warcraft at all at this point. This is far more of a Diablo MMO than WoW has ever been before. Which isn't a bad thing, but it just seems to have really left any semblance of it's roots behind.

[VyersReaver]

2. The legendary system leaves quite a bit to be desired. Memories give you no indication of their limitations (what sort of gear it can be used on, what spec) until you go try and craft with it. Given the expense and timesink required to get soul ash + a good memory for your current class / spec, I think I liked the RNG acquisition better.

I hated Legion way of getting legendaries. Now you at least know what you can do to get the legendary that you want/is best for you. Some are gated (like Torghast wing-specific ones, or raid ones before it went live, or world boss now that I think about it), but now at least you're almost guaranteed set. Soul Ash not having catch-up is a bit of a letdown, but then again, while T4 leggo is like a 2 month investment, T1 (which is the same legendary power as T4) is a 2 week investment, and that is much better than whatever that was in Legion. You can even have BiS stats on it!

[ZazuuPriest]

2. The legendary system leaves quite a bit to be desired. Memories give you no indication of their limitations (what sort of gear it can be used on, what spec) until you go try and craft with it. Given the expense and timesink required to get soul ash + a good memory for your current class / spec, I think I liked the RNG acquisition better.

Memories tell you exactly what type of gear the go into and what spec it is for before you craft it

[Forteofgray]

There is so much to do but you're not forced to do some of it, like the side-activities in the covenant areas. The anima doesn't feel like a grind like the last two expansions' resources did - you sort of just accumulate anima as you play like doing heroics. The only things I don't like are having to port/fly back and forth from zones to Oribos and the Maw sucks entirely. I fucking hate getting jumped by the Jailer's minions because of that gauge filling up. Also, why do devs always put interface stuff in the middle of the screen? That gauge could be anywhere but it's in the top-middle of the screen. Then there's the fact you can't mount... It's like they had a discussion during the conceptual stages of the Maw's development and said "how annoying can a zone be made to be? Let's do that".

[Stacko]

It's been a ton of shit but kind of lit so far for me. I really don't like the way covenants work, and I don't care for the new raid. Class design is okay, but needs tuning.

My biggest issue is the same as every xpac though, the players. Pugging content makes me feel like I'm having a stroke.

[Hinastorm]

It's fine. It's retail wow.

A little bloated mechanic wise for my taste, both in classes and dungeon/raid mechanics. So few specs are straightforward now. Which is a mixed bag.