Should all story quests be solo phased?

[Collected]

Before I begin.. I know. It's an MMO. Stop being anti-social. It's not a single player game. etc.

Ok now for the question. Whilst levelling in Shadowlands I've decided to actually give a damn about the story line/lore etc. I'm reading all the quest text and taking my time rather than steamrolling the content. At least on my main. It's been a lot of fun so far.

However one minor annoyance is when I'm taking part in a quest and performing actions someone will run in and finish off the mob I'm fighting as part of that story quest. That's completely fine. They're on the same quest, same mob etc. Why should they stand and watch? But I find myself wondering if it would be a better experience to be phased for all of these quests so it's just me and the quest mobs/NPCs etc. Anyone else find themselves feeling that way too? Perhaps even a toggle option somewhere to allow players to opt into a more solo style story experience?

I'm prepared to be slated for even suggesting this but I was curious if others were of the same opinion.

[FuxieDK]

They don't need to be solo phased; they just need to have quests/mobs yield the same amount of XP and quest items as they do now, and the divided by party size.

So mobs that give 400xp, each gets 100 if 4 in group.
Quests that give 8k XP, gives 2k for each Pers n in a 4 man group.
And mobs that drop 1 quest item per kill, have 25% chance of dropping 1 in a 4 man group.

This way, it will be stream lined..

[Unlimited Power]

They don't need to be solo phased; they just need to have quests/mobs yield the same amount of XP and quest items as they do now, and the divided by party size.

So mobs that give 400xp, each gets 100 if 4 in group.
Quests that give 8k XP, gives 2k for each Pers n in a 4 man group.
And mobs that drop 1 quest item per kill, have 25% chance of dropping 1 in a 4 man group.

This way, it will be stream lined..

First of all, he's not talking about questing in a party. He's talking about questing solo but other players just happen to be doing the same quests in the area.

Second of all, your suggestion makes no sense. 4 people questing together are not completing the quests 4 times as quickly as someone completing them solo. And if being grouped up split the xp, people would just leave the group before turning in quests.

In the first place, if xp actually was split by the amount of people in a group, even if a group of 5 completed every single quest on their way through the shadowlands zones, the reduction in xp would ensure they wouldn't reach level 60 by the time they finish the last quest.

In other words, they'd be forced to complete dungeons or grind mobs just to reach level 60.

[lionofwar87]

I love GW2 system. Its solo unless I want the person there to help. For that same reason, FF14 MSQ is so annoying. Allow people in the party to be present and get credit for completing the MSQ. If that person wants to be in the spot light for a scene, let them intiate the quest and allow others to choose to participate.

[Razion]

An option to hide players has been in a lot of MMOs. May be nice for WoW as a toggle of sorts.

There are definitely times during important endcap questlines where other people would feel better left out. For quests with important lore and emotional moments it would be nice to hide players, but sometimes moments like these can be a surprise and players just coming along breaking the mood is also as random. Would be a nice option to have, but I feel like if I didn't have a quick bind for it it would probably just stay on or off all the time. Most MMOs that use a hide player feature have it to a keybind, so maybe that's best..?

[tommyhil622]

i just wish they phased out people when they do the in game cut scene. There's always an idiot standing right in front of bolvar or other prominent people during important cut scenes. Super annoying lol.

[Pakheth]

An option to hide players has been in a lot of MMOs. May be nice for WoW as a toggle of sorts.

There are definitely times during important endcap questlines where other people would feel better left out. For quests with important lore and emotional moments it would be nice to hide players, but sometimes moments like these can be a surprise and players just coming along breaking the mood is also as random. Would be a nice option to have, but I feel like if I didn't have a quick bind for it it would probably just stay on or off all the time. Most MMOs that use a hide player feature have it to a keybind, so maybe that's best..?

Yeah, this was what I felt as well. There were plenty of times during Bastion were other players really stood out during quests and not in a good way. You summed up my feelings pretty well actually so kudos.

[sephrinx]

No.

There should be - nothing - in this game that is "solo phased."
This is an MMO, not Elder Scrolls.

[Kazlofski]

I also wish questing while leveling would be phased.

I find myself getting distracted when I read a quest, and I see people come in on my screen moving around like chicken while I am trying to concentrate on reading the text. I know it's my problem but just saying it'd be nice to not have players run around while I am trying to read.

Also it bothers me a bit that there are important quests, when you are being addressed personally like you are THE hero, not A hero and you need to get somewhere asap, then you see lots of people run around you while the NPC is talking to you personally or while you are making your way to the important meeting place, and other players are following you. Really hurts immersion in my opinion.

[Pakheth]

No.

There should be - nothing - in this game that is "solo phased."
This is an MMO, not Elder Scrolls.

Then I would prefer it if Blizzard stopped making quests where YOU are the ONLY HERO!

[FuxieDK]

Second of all, your suggestion makes no sense. 4 people questing together are not completing the quests 4 times as quickly as someone completing them solo. And if being grouped up split the xp, people would just leave the group before turning in quests.

You are right. 4 people don't do quests 4x as fast as solo; they do it 5-10x as fast. Mobs are busted down by groups in a way, solo play cannot do.

And if people drop gr up and re-group when turning in, then impose a 60 seconds CD on joining groups.. Will work wonders..

[rrayy]

No.

There should be - nothing - in this game that is "solo phased."
This is an MMO, not Elder Scrolls.

Methinks you don't understand what MMO means. It means Massive multi player online. That does not mean you are required to be in a group. It only means a massive amount of players online at one time.

[Orange Joe]

You are right. 4 people don't do quests 4x as fast as solo; they do it 5-10x as fast. Mobs are busted down by groups in a way, solo play cannot do.

And if people drop gr up and re-group when turning in, then impose a 60 seconds CD on joining groups.. Will work wonders..

You do know with the current system all a solo player has to do is tag mobs other people are killing. If you're going that slow it's on you not playing solo


Hell I play solo as a tank. I'll come into a area and grab all the mobs I can. Other players will see this and come AoE them down with me. There is no reason a solo player can't compete with a group unless they suck ass.

[EntertainmentNihilist]

Yes. "MMO" is just three letters. Games shouldn't be built to match the platonic ideal of the genre they are classified as, they should be sorted into a genre as an afterthought.

[jackalope]

I registered just to comment on this thread!

What has always bothered me about WoW and most modern MMOs is that the quests treat you as THE hero, and with storyline quests that means you're the hero of the entire world/universe.

That's not consistent with the whole concept of a massively multiplayer game. The world is supposed to be persistent and self-consistent. You're a character in the world. When you know every other player has the same "hero of the world" history, that just makes it no longer an MMO. When NPCs are amazed to see a person from your world, when dozens of others from your world are right next to you, that totally breaks the immersiveness of the world.

Older MMOs were not like this. In Everquest the quests were tasks, and you weren't THE ONE. In Asheron's Call there were big world stories, and every player was a part of the story, not the hero. The world had to band together to face threats. I seem to recall Burning Crusade was like that, you were explicitly a part of a war. Then afterwards Blizzard seems to have decided to give players a single player hero's journey!

It's strange that hardly anyone talks about this. I guess folks who are under a certain age don't know any different. To them, an MMO is basically a single player game where you see other players and sometimes group

[WowIsDead64]

They don't need to be solo phased; they just need to have quests/mobs yield the same amount of XP and quest items as they do now, and the divided by party size.

So mobs that give 400xp, each gets 100 if 4 in group.
Quests that give 8k XP, gives 2k for each Pers n in a 4 man group.
And mobs that drop 1 quest item per kill, have 25% chance of dropping 1 in a 4 man group.

This way, it will be stream lined..

Bad idea, because it opens gates to griefing. There always be that toxic troll guys, who'll just hit mob, increasing it's health, and do nothing to kill it. Long time ago I suggested compromise solution. Don't phase location. Phase mobs themselves. I.e. you see other players, but when you hit mob - you get your own copy of it.

[EntertainmentNihilist]

I registered just to comment on this thread!

What has always bothered me about WoW and most modern MMOs is that the quests treat you as THE hero, and with storyline quests that means you're the hero of the entire world/universe.

That's not consistent with the whole concept of a massively multiplayer game. The world is supposed to be persistent and self-consistent. You're a character in the world. When you know every other player has the same "hero of the world" history, that just makes it no longer an MMO. When NPCs are amazed to see a person from your world, when dozens of others from your world are right next to you, that totally breaks the immersiveness of the world.

Older MMOs were not like this. In Everquest the quests were tasks, and you weren't THE ONE. In Asheron's Call there were big world stories, and every player was a part of the story, not the hero. The world had to band together to face threats. I seem to recall Burning Crusade was like that, you were explicitly a part of a war. Then afterwards Blizzard seems to have decided to give players a single player hero's journey!

It's strange that hardly anyone talks about this. I guess folks who are under a certain age don't know any different. To them, an MMO is basically a single player game where you see other players and sometimes group

It's almost as if old-school MMO's are dead, most modern audiences don't like them, and Blizzard is accommodating that as to not have the game die.

Seriously, the game should not be built around your preconceptions of what the three letters "MMO" mean. Most people don't want that.

Personally, I find the idea of being a random, nameless adventurer doing menial tasks boring.

[cparle87]

Bad idea, because it opens gates to griefing. There always be that toxic troll guys, who'll just hit mob, increasing it's health, and do nothing to kill it. Long time ago I suggested compromise solution. Don't phase location. Phase mobs themselves. I.e. you see other players, but when you hit mob - you get your own copy of it.

That happens now. The hit it so its health increases griefing.

[WowIsDead64]

That happens now. The hit it so its health increases griefing.

I know. Blizzard seem to be too "greedy" to implement design from other MMOs, i.e. implicit auto-grouping, where all players get credit, when others complete WQ. They think, that allowing such griefing is better, than allowing players to complete things via AFKing there. Dunno, may be this problem is exaggerated and is worst case scenario, but other games don't seem to have such problem. Who cares, if somebody is AFK? He punishes himself, because if he would help, he would complete WQ faster.

Another bad design - is so called "PVP" design. I don't know, why Blizzard still do it for WM off players. I've just completed "fix artillery" WQ in Maldraxxus. I don't know, if such WQs are specifict to Maldraxxus only due to it's "PVP" theme, but it's very bad design. It's design where other faction players are able to prevent you from completing WQ. That is the worst case of griefing. When other players are allowed to prevent you from playing properly. It implies PVPing, i.e. fighting with other faction for domination. May be it's good from PVP point of view. But IT JUST DOESN"T WORK IN WM OFF MODE. How many times should I repeat it? We turn out WM off for reason. Because we want to avoid such griefing.

And of course situation gets much worse due to FACTION IMBALANCE. I.e. if you want us to do competitive content, you should provide good faction balance then. But Blizzard don't. And it happens to me both when I play Alliance and Horde.

- - - Updated - - -

It's almost as if old-school MMO's are dead, most modern audiences don't like them, and Blizzard is accommodating that as to not have the game die.

Seriously, the game should not be built around your preconceptions of what the three letters "MMO" mean. Most people don't want that.

Personally, I find the idea of being a random, nameless adventurer doing menial tasks boring.

On the other hand, there is no word Social in MMORPG abbrevation. There are separate social games. Such as Stardew Valley, Escapist, etc. Massive Multiplayer Online means just this. That many players can play it at the same time. That's it.

[jackalope]

It's almost as if old-school MMO's are dead, most modern audiences don't like them, and Blizzard is accommodating that as to not have the game die.

Seriously, the game should not be built around your preconceptions of what the three letters "MMO" mean. Most people don't want that.

Personally, I find the idea of being a random, nameless adventurer doing menial tasks boring.

I think the main reason old school MMOs are dead is that WoW sucked up all the players. I don't think the quests pretending you're the only player is the reason for that, I think it's because the game has always had good mechanics. WoW was also a lot easier than the MMOs it competed against, since it got rid of real death penalties. No one would argue easier is better, but we can recognize that it's more appealing to more people, while also being less satisfying.

You're looking at traditional MMOs the wrong way. You aren't a random nameless adventurer, you are an adventurer with a chance to make a name for yourself in a persistent world, and much of that is social interaction and roleplaying your character. Canned single player quests and stories where every player pretends to be alone in the game world are really a poor substitute. If you never played the older MMOs it's hard to explain