To be honest, Anduin is the cancer of story.

[bagina]

Learn what a Mary sue actually is before calling Anduin one

The only mary sue of wow is Sylvanas

Wrong. You should follow your own advice.

[Cherry123]

I'm tired of his holiness, i hope the jailer makes him pure evil. Light, light….. just shut up!

[loras]

He is the worst written character since 1994.He occupies a lot of story resources.

EVERY character will eventually serve this boring Mary Sue.

-----------------------

lol,Alliance fans... of course you like Anduin,but don't forget how you used to treat Thrall.Remember guys when people used to complain how Thrall was a Mary Sue for being a powerful shaman? I wish that people were complaining now about Jaina Tyande and Anduin getting DBZ powers.BTW,Sylvanas is no longer Horde character after 8.25.

“Green Jesus this...Green Jesus that...” "Mary Sue" “Horder bias” “blizz favor horde too much” “why quest with horde npc?”"Why am I going to save Horde leader"...

you compained over and over again during cata.

after that?

Khadgar---Whitehair Jesus(6.0 pre-patch 6.2)
Velen---WhiteBeard Jesus(7.2 7.3)
Malfurion---GreenBeard Jesus(7.0)
Turalyon---Light Jesus(7.3)
Alleria---Void Jesus(7.3)
Tyrande---Moon Jesus(7.0)
Magni---Diamond Jesus(BfA)
Now we have Anduin---Jesus of Jesuses
Everyone looks like The boy king's servant.

since the Shadowland pre-patch, all 3 alliance leader show feat of strength while the horde leader just got beat over and over…We go in the maw,we found Jaina all good fighting them while Baine and Thrall are just powerless.Finally the Jailer attack them and once again the horde leader got beat while Anduin got a ‘‘heroic’’ moment.

Interpunction is your friend, Sylvanas is not.
Anduin i'm just neutral about, i think most who love or hate him use him project their frustration about certain things.

[bagina]

How can Anduin be a mary sue if he's lost many battles and not everyone loves him/ does what he says

I didn't call Anduin a Mary Sue. Also ironic, you don't see how that applies to Sylvanas even more? No one in-universe likes Sylvanas, she's hated by almost every NPC, no one does what she says, and she's lost more battles than she's won. She's shown to be DEEPLY flawed. Literally nothing about her says Mary Sue. A female character that's simply powerful is not a Mary Sue.

[loras]

I didn't call Anduin a Mary Sue. Also ironic, you don't see how that applies to Sylvanas even more? No one in-universe likes Sylvanas, she's hated by almost every NPC, no one does what she says, and she's lost more battles than she's won. She's shown to be DEEPLY flawed. Literally nothing about her says Mary Sue. A female character that's simply powerful is not a Mary Sue.

He probably means villain-sue, evil mary sue.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VillainSue

[geco]

Anduin is the reason why we can't have interesting stories on the Alliance side.
Which alliance has to initiate the conflict? no Anduin wouldn't.
That the alliance has more race than human? No Anduin has to be the one who shines.
That there is a decent Kaldorei vs Human clash in BFA? No, you can't go against Anduin.
That the Alliance has to punish the Horde? Nope Anduin.
That the Alliance has to have a non-human leader now that Varian is gone? Nope Anduin why yes.
That Anduin screwed up and literally betrayed the Kaldorei at the end of BFA? It doesn't matter it's Anduin he does everything right.

Anduin is Cancer. One thing in the plot that takes up much more space than it should and does the plot bad.

I didn't call Anduin a Mary Sue. Also ironic, you don't see how that applies to Sylvanas even more? No one in-universe likes Sylvanas, she's hated by almost every NPC, no one does what she says, and she's lost more battles than she's won. She's shown to be DEEPLY flawed. Literally nothing about her says Mary Sue. A female character that's simply powerful is not a Mary Sue.

That's why Anduin is the Merry-Sue. He can do whatever he wants and everyone will love him. He can literally free the guilty of genocide and Name him here and the Kaldorei have no choice but to applaud.

[omeomorfismo]

Anduin is basically ultimate normie fantasy character. You just can't be more normie than him.

He always reminds me of those pseudo christian tv series back in 80s/90s when you had this big family with 20 kids ranging from newborn to adult. He would be second oldest and would have episode about drugs when he says something like "I don't need no meth for jesus is my drug of choice".

lol
probably thats even the reason he is the only consistent character in all warcraft. the fact that he is so stereotyped that no one can even misinterpreted him even by mistake

[shise]

He is good, but there are many irrational haters, such as yourself.

He is fair, reasonable and tries everything on his hands to reach peace. I mean.. he is the perfect leader lol... But that is the problem, people like problematic nutcases such as Garrosh instead. But remember, you need all, te good, the bad, the ugly and the pretty to make a good story all in all.

And I play horde, btw.

[omeomorfismo]

How can Anduin be a mary sue if he's lost many battles and not everyone loves him/ does what he says

lol? who hate him? the evulzzzzzz? even genn is constantly flip flopping between "wraaaaarg revenge" and "b-b-but he is so handsome, he remember my kid" without taking any action since stromheim. even his suppoused enemies were killing their own troops to satisfy their light master just in bfa
lost many battles? they ever meant anything? damn he won 4° war without doing anything

[geco]

lol
probably thats even the reason he is the only consistent character in all warcraft. the fact that he is so stereotyped that no one can even misinterpreted him even by mistake

But anyway he is King of the alliance without having to be one and the characters around him react badly and artificially.
So it is still very badly written.

[Rngmonster The God]

Finally someone who thinks the same way as i do. I bet Anduin does some wololo shit and beats the Jailer in the end of the expansion.

[Soon-TM]

He probably means villain-sue, evil mary sue.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VillainSue

Correct. While Sylvanas is the epitome of an evil Mary Sue, our friend (we HAVE to be friends with him, or we will be depicted as "unreasonable", or straight evil) Andy is another flavour of Mary Sue. He reminds me a lot of Cata Thrall, but in an even more annoying version.

- - - Updated - - -

Finally someone who thinks the same way as i do. I bet Anduin does some wololo shit and beats the Jailer in the end of the expansion.

That would be Med'an levels of Mary Sue LOL

[Eazy]

Nothing is more cancer than Sylvanas post wotlk.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

MOST written yes.

BEST written, debatably. Quality =/= Quantity. Just because he has the limelight more often, doesn't mean the story they're writing for him is good. (In fact, most would argue the other way around.)

In this case, being underdeveloped is actually a boon for the others, because the development Anduin DOES get is so horrendous.

Jiana is likely the most written about character not anduin he’s just the best written.

There’s really just no comparison, no character has developed and progressed as much as he has without flip flopping on the core of there character.

Like it or not he’s the best written by a mile by any literature standard.

[Dervrak]

I don't know if I would say Anduin is a "cancer" but he is a rather one dimensional, uninteresting character. Allthough Blizz has made attempts to make him come across as interesting, he still little more than the goody two shoes man-boy he always has been. Personally I hope he goes out in Shadowlands, Blizz can give him a nice send off like Illidan where he sacrifices himself to save the Shadowlands or something. Then leave Turalyon who is acting as Regent King in Anduin's absence as the new leader of the Alliance.

[Dazmalak]

Jiana is likely the most written about character not anduin he’s just the best written.

There’s really just no comparison, no character has developed and progressed as much as he has without flip flopping on the core of there character.

Like it or not he’s the best written by a mile by any literature standard.

I wouldn't say Anduin has developed or progressed, though. He is the same now as when he started: naive and "good" in the general perspective of things. I would say he is simply the mouthpiece for the author's politics and nothing more. Hold hands, get along, be kind and forgiving...you know, all the things that are great in real life, but are at odds with a story that used to be about ethnic wars. I don't think anything about his existence makes any logical sense except as a moral compass for the story. But he has no real reason to be that way given everything he's witnessed and been through, which makes him unrelatable.

[Cherry123]

let's be honest, we don't like him because he is not manly enough

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I really don't think so. If we consider times before it made sense to write about Anduin, sure - But if we're talking "since Anduin has made sense to write about" definitely not. He got the same amount of story in MoP when he stopped Garrosh from taking the Divine Bell vs. Jaina and the Purge. He and Jaina BOTH got no story in WoD. Legion gave Anduin a ton of spotlight, while Jaina sat in the back doing nothing. And BfA has one zone and a raid for Jaina, and an entire war arc for Anduin which included said raid.

You can no longer write the Alliance without it's High King Anduin, but you absolutely can write it without Jaina, as has been done many times.

anduin might have shared writing in game since mop but Jiana has been written about in wrath, rise of the lichking, tides of war, Warcraft3 ect.

The problem with this is that he hasn't developed, nor progressed. He's just an anxiety ridden hopelessly optimistic teenager now, as opposed to just a hopelessly optimistic teenager. None of his views have shifted whatsoever. In fact, everyone around him has to shift their views to match his. There's literally no progression I can even think of.

You're right that he hasn't flip flopped on the core of their character, but few characters have. (Minus Sylvanas and Garrosh.) So you're taking the lowest bar possible to cross and using that as your basis here. The problem you're not recognizing is that he hasn't changed at all. He's just seen some shit. I'd be anxiety ridden too in that case, but progression, this is very much not.



Not even relatively close to the truth.

Anduin has absolutely developed and progressed.

Classic-tbc he’s just a kid.

Wrath he’s a prince in training shadowing his dad.

Cata he starts going beyond his dads back and standing up to him so he can try and be his own person.

Mop he steps away from the alliance as a whole to try and continue becoming his own person which leads to him confronting garrosh of all people.

Legion then has him thrust into a position he’s not ready for and trying to match up to his dad.

Bfa has him trying to be a strong wartime leader and trying to coup with the stress of his people dying because of his choices as well as him giving up on the idea that any one can be redeemed when faced with sylvanas.

He’s been constantly progressing and developing while holding to his core that the alliance an horde shouldn’t be killing each other.

- - - Updated - - -

I wouldn't say Anduin has developed or progressed, though. He is the same now as when he started: naive and "good" in the general perspective of things. I would say he is simply the mouthpiece for the author's politics and nothing more. Hold hands, get along, be kind and forgiving...you know, all the things that are great in real life, but are at odds with a story that used to be about ethnic wars. I don't think anything about his existence makes any logical sense except as a moral compass for the story. But he has no real reason to be that way given everything he's witnessed and been through, which makes him unrelatable.

See my previous post, he’s undeniably progressed the fact that he’s stuck to his core beliefs doesn’t mean he hasn’t progressed that just means she’s a consistent character unlike Jiana or thrall.

[omeomorfismo]

Sylvanas is a classic villain sue, and the closest thing to a mary sue wow has - generally speak blizzard are pretty good at not writing overpowered characters

The problem with sylvanas is that while not only being boring herself - she hasn't earned her power over everyone else, so in order to make her strong they make everyone esle stupid, the lordaeron cutscene is a good example of this

- - - Updated - - -



Tyrande basically told him to fuck off when he said not to attack Darkshore

Genn has disobeyed him twice since Legion

Many nobles and citizens don't think him anywhere near the king Varian was etc

- - - Updated - - -

Let's not forget - Anduin's whole thing is to be likeable, he's a priest and a peacemaker - he's always been a nice guy. He lacks in other areas, for example he's nowhere near the fighter his father was

lol, anduin survived a massive bell smashed on him by the most powerfull orc warrior of MU wow gaining even superpowers. he is the ultimate tank....

btw think. genn and stormwind's citizen ever meant anything? from stormheim genn (and the southshore captain) didnt experienced anything. the flying boat was destroyed and alliance didnt suffered any loss (unlike the horde, that needed zuldazar to replenish the navy), every single anduin and genn interactions were written as the two hasnt any clash, damn the only mention of the kamikaze move was in the horde book as justification for the war of thorn to vaurok. basically genn now is kissing anduin footprints screaming "waaarg revenge" only because it is his recurring joke. the citizen are even more useless. stormwing is in peasants shortage since vanilla, still it spread soldier everywhere. the only one to do anything was benedictus, but still it bite thrall's ass instead the variann's one
tyrande the same, she is genn 2.0. with maybe the possibility she can become crazy and evulzzz (but at this point its a meme, we arent allowed to kill an alliance character xD). oh, and still lorthemar did more against garrosh in lei shen patch than everyone you cited here since legion

[Lorgar Aurelian]

You literally described him aging.

Is age a sign of progression? Literally during nothing of what you said did he change whatsoever.

I don’t know if your unaware but people tend to progress as they age and that shapes who they are, I mean this is some pretty basic stuff.

There were no formative moments. He wasn't "being couragous" when he broke the bell, and he didn't "step away from the Alliance as a whole,"

Sticking up to his father for Moria, going behind his fathers back to investigate the TH, leaving his guard to investigate Panaria, writing sylvanas off as some one who can’t co exist with peace.All of these are formative moments all of them and progress from where he was in the past.

he had never BEEN part of the Alliance, he was a child. He was a child running away from home because he was curious about the world that his father never let him see. He'd never been a part of the Alliance because to do so would suggest a child was active in the war, which he most certainly was not prior to MoP.

while he wasn’t part of the war anduin has absolutely been an active member of the alliance. Training in the ways of the light with tyranda and velan, picking up his views of the horde from Jiana, learning about history with the dwarfs and being one of if not the core reason the council of three hammers exist at all.

He confronted Garrosh because he knew not confronting Garrosh wasn't an option. The same exact way he's now doing with Sylvanas. He laid his trust in them until they showed there was no sign of going back on a completely awful deed, and only then did Anduin commit to them being a bad person and needing to stop them.

anduin had a ton of options other then confronting garrosh and trying to make him change his path, all of those options would have put him at less risk but would just be another act of aggression which would propagate the war which is the main thing he didn’t want.

Anduin also never gave up on garrosh he thought he could change his ways up till he left for wod even after being crushed by the bell it wasn’t until sylvanas was In charge did he find some one he thought was truly beyond peace.

It's why Teldrassil even happened. Sylvanas was making it clear she was making moves, but Anduin didn't want to believe it, and didn't commit to defending Alliance territory when it counted most. It's why Sylvanas and the Horde's coordinated assault even worked - Because it was the whole Horde, vs. Teldrassil and whatever forces the Alliance could muster AFTER the war had already begun.

this is all just comply wrong. Teldrassil happened because anduin was committed to opposing sylvanas he and every one else thought they were making a grab for silithas and sent troops to stop that leaving the tree unguarded.

It wasn’t even the whole of the horde which attacked it was only troops from org and they only made it to the tree because the night elfs sent there fighting force away, the hordes forces were so weak that teldrassil would have rebuffed them if them if the standing force wasn’t sent away.