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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    If there is a Dragon Age thread around here be free to dump this here, I struggled to find it.

    So Bioware released the Dragon Age 4 trailer at the game awards recently and I haven't seen anyone here posting anything about it.



    Okay I know what many of the key members behind Dragon Age (and by some key members I mean all of them) have left the company now. And it really shows in the visuals to this game via the trailer. And I want to go through one picture in particular.



    I mean what the hell is this?

    Okay so mild rant here. Dragon Age is a franchise I love, I play Dragon Age: Origins once a year because its one of my favourite games. I even enjoyed Dragon Age 2 that's not to say it was good, it wasnt, but I still got some enjoyment from the characters and story.

    The problem I have with this trailer is the atheistic. Look at that image, when did Dragon Age become DragonPunk Age. Dragon Age has always been a very grounded fantasy which blends Historical Fantasy and Traditional Fantasy (for the most part), Dragon Age: Origins especially was loosely based on A Song of Ice and Fire books by George R.R.Martin and it clearly shows if you played it. Wardens being the night watch and the Darkspawn being the white walkers, but not only that, like A Song of Ice and Fire it heavily featured a lot of politics in Origins and even Dragon age 2, some of the dialogue was very based in this heavy style where it wasnt just good v evil there were blurred lines and peoples motives made sense. But I digress...

    This was a sample of architecture in Origins to compare.




    In Dragon Age Inquisition it was clear there was a tonal shift, the move away from the traditional/historical fantasy and into a high fantasy setting that is more super hero-esque super science fantasy akin to, let's say, Final Fantasy and it works for Final Fantasy but not so sure I want it for Dragon Age, especially when that world has already been established only to see them completely change the design.

    Even the armor and weapons in the trailer looks very World of Warcraft-ish with the total impractical bow and bright sparkly strings and arrows, which is a stark contrast to the (sometimes) more traditional weapons they had before.



    Okay so sure its lovely and flashy and I am sure some people think its way more exciting that traditional armor and weapons and fantasy in general. I mean it looks fancy and cool its colourful and stuff, but where we come to where we got too feels vastly like a different game now.

    I know its a lot to rant on by looking at the trailer, and this is maybe overlooking at something before the game comes out. But seeing the slow transformation of the feel of the games seems very prevalent, its a similar thing that's happened to WoW over the years. Where its went to more traditional to more high/science fantasy.

    What do you guys think, a lot of Dragon Age fans I kn ow still looking forward to the game and I'd be lying if I said I wasnt too, the tonal shift (if there is one) will might take a while to get used to. But I do kind of prefer my fantasy more traditional/historical...

    tldr: Do you think Dragon Age has changed its tonal athletic since Dragon Age: Origins and is it something you have adapted to, do you like it or have you given up on the franchise?
    You're certainly not imagining things, the shift is dramatic and has been ongoing since DA2.

    Pity is that it has such contrast with the mundane story they seem to want to tell in da4, going by the trailer.
    So i wonder if it will be worthwhile.
    But frankly it seems to me that bioware is a traditional rpg company that somehow decided to try to make action games with pointless multiplayer bullshit while pulling too many pages from others' books, what with the mission table bullshit they incorporated into da:3.

    I did really like da:3's take on crafting though, and all around it was a decent game, if not an overly interesting one.
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  2. #42
    I've not been interested in Dragon Age games since the bullshit that was Dragon Age 2. It's a game about traversing the same locations over and over again, which just killed it for me. If memory serves, the gameplay was somewhat better than in the Origins, but the shameless re-usage of assets in Dragon Age 2 was too much to bear. It's not long that I replayed Origins and it's expansion, and I still like it.

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  3. #43
    I find it hard to read when peeps say Dragon Age is about 2 and inquisition and not Origin, yet Origin is the foundation, the base upon what you build on, DA2 with its remake of zones, blend and boring non tactical combat, it was all that Origin wasn't and yes also on higher difficulty. I didnt mind the characters but i found them a lot less interesting then the ones in Origin. Inquisition, lets just say I did it once and never look at it again. Dont even remember much about it yet Origin i can still remember vividly.

    I have not got any hopes for this version. For me it started and ended with Origin.

  4. #44
    Herald of the Titans Jazzhands's Avatar
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    They made Dragon Age games after Origins? And there was a live action Avatar The Last Airbender movie!?

    That aside, yeah this looks awful compared to the more realistic approach the series has always taken. Then again I haven't come to expect much from the series after Origins, Inquisition was OK, Dragon Age 2 is up there with Devil May Cry 2 as worst sequel ever to an amazing game.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by LarryFromHumanResources View Post
    Ah yes, the objective, true fact of calling a game "shallow".


    Decidedly NOT a subjective opinion, definitely not, no.
    Oh no! I used one adjective that makes you internet correct!
    How about we do a blow by blow.
    Was DA2 pushed out in a year which resulted in massive reuse of assets and locations (among other things)? Yes
    Was DA:I a game with tab-hotbar based combat, a mission table? Yes
    Is DA:O 'Clunky' (Isn't that the word that must never be used when critiquing a game?) Maybe. Is it the 'clunkiest'? Who knows. Is it the slowest game ever made? Given it's RT I'm going to go with no.

    If you like bing bing wahoo action games more power to you, they's obviously more popular (which is why EA made bioware go in that direction with ME and DA). That doesn't make them better RPGs than (barely) modified DnD ruleset.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Any idea on what type of main character we can expect? I didn't mind playing as the Holy Messiah Mr. Inquisitor. Everyone always complains about that, but in my opinion it was cool playing as Jesus.

    But I also wouldn't mind returning to a more grounded protagonist type like Hawke.
    Given how Varick talks about needing a 'new kind of hero' that's 'like you' I'm going to assume we're going back to a build your own hero mold.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  6. #46
    I'm sorry if it was said before, but DAO was NOT. based. on song of ice and fire. it was based, loosely on the same HISTORICAL and pretty darn infamous events that have INSPIRED the song of ice and fire.

    that said - visuals look like Tevinter, with all its magical nonsense. which would make sense, as they have been HEAVILY hinting at Tevinter as next location for a while now. and it would make perfect sense too, since from the very start, the lore basically blamed Tevinter mages and their meddling with golden city for darkspawn.
    Last edited by Witchblade77; 2020-12-15 at 02:14 PM.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Saltysquidoon View Post
    Oh no! I used one adjective that makes you internet correct!
    How about we do a blow by blow.
    Was DA2 pushed out in a year which resulted in massive reuse of assets and locations (among other things)? Yes
    Was DA:I a game with tab-hotbar based combat, a mission table? Yes
    Is DA:O 'Clunky' (Isn't that the word that must never be used when critiquing a game?) Maybe. Is it the 'clunkiest'? Who knows. Is it the slowest game ever made? Given it's RT I'm going to go with no.

    If you like bing bing wahoo action games more power to you, they's obviously more popular (which is why EA made bioware go in that direction with ME and DA). That doesn't make them better RPGs than (barely) modified DnD ruleset.
    I enjoy that you completely skipped over what I actually levvied at you, just handwaving it.

    I called Dragon Age slow and clunky, you called Inquisition shallow.

    Both are entirely subjective opinions. I don't care who's right or wrong. It's videogame. Play whatever you want. But YOU were levvying criticism at me for saying that Origins was slow and clunky saying YOU were stating facts.

    That's literally all I pointed out but you went "point by point" and reiterated things I haven't disagreed with.

    Yeah, Inquisition has a mission table, yeah it's more action oriented than Origins and arguably the tactical camera was a bit clunky, and yeah DA2 was rushed. I never said they weren't. Both are still better than Origins in my view.

    Because

    Drumroll

    Their super duper DND adapted ruleset and CRPG system based combat system is slow and clunky.
    Last edited by LarryFromHumanResources; 2020-12-15 at 03:07 PM.
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  8. #48
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryFromHumanResources View Post
    Ah yes, the objective, true fact of calling a game "shallow".


    Decidedly NOT a subjective opinion, definitely not, no.
    I prefer the type of gameplay Dragon age is going towards it feels more fun then.....what Orgins was. I still liked the game but Inquisition was cool to. Sorry but I think combat slowly improved, its by no means revolutionary but I don't need every game to be revolutionary.
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  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Saltysquidoon View Post
    Oh no! I used one adjective that makes you internet correct!
    How about we do a blow by blow.
    Was DA2 pushed out in a year which resulted in massive reuse of assets and locations (among other things)? Yes
    Was DA:I a game with tab-hotbar based combat, a mission table? Yes
    Is DA:O 'Clunky' (Isn't that the word that must never be used when critiquing a game?) Maybe. Is it the 'clunkiest'? Who knows. Is it the slowest game ever made? Given it's RT I'm going to go with no.

    If you like bing bing wahoo action games more power to you, they's obviously more popular (which is why EA made bioware go in that direction with ME and DA). That doesn't make them better RPGs than (barely) modified DnD ruleset.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Given how Varick talks about needing a 'new kind of hero' that's 'like you' I'm going to assume we're going back to a build your own hero mold.
    DA2 had resused assets. But the story was good. And i actually liked the city. The repetetive dungeons have been annoying.
    DA:I Hot bar was just something to get used to. The Mission Table was actually kinda fun. As you actually yould see some change sin the world if i remember correctly.
    DA:O was an amazing game. But it was clunky. Loved the story and the setting. Always thought the ending was a but lacking in... impact? It just was to small for all the horror they have been building up the whole game long.
    And you could play DA:I slow with top down. If you chose not to... who is really to blame?

    I really liked DA:O and DA:I. Loved both settings. Always thought DA:O was a bit to small for the story they were trying to tell. DA:I in orlais and the keep was amazing. IMHO!!!!!
    DA:2 was... well the companions were lackluster and the caves got repetetive REALLY fast. Story was great nonetheless.

    But if you despise 2/3 of a game series, i don't think you will ever be happy with what comes next.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    I prefer the type of gameplay Dragon age is going towards it feels more fun then.....what Orgins was. I still liked the game but Inquisition was cool to. Sorry but I think combat slowly improved, its by no means revolutionary but I don't need every game to be revolutionary.
    Yeah, I'm glad they went more down the action RPG path as well, I think I'd rather swing a big fuck off two hander than watch someone swing a big fuck off two hander

    The only criticism I really have of the tactical camera was that it got stuck on terrain and that it was awkward on PC but that's an issue with the PC port.
    Last edited by LarryFromHumanResources; 2020-12-15 at 03:09 PM.
    Corporate wishes everyone a happy new year

  11. #51
    Old God Orby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    I prefer the type of gameplay Dragon age is going towards it feels more fun then.....what Orgins was. I still liked the game but Inquisition was cool to. Sorry but I think combat slowly improved, its by no means revolutionary but I don't need every game to be revolutionary.
    The change in combat isnt something I actually mind, one of the things I really enjoyed from Dragon Age 2 was the more action based combat. Unfortunately one of Inquisitions weaknesses was its combat, unless you were playing a mage. Inquisition was a step down from DA2 in its combat if you were a melee. Everything was clunky. as hell.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    One of the very few criticisms I have of Origins is its brownness. The world looks boring as fuck. On top of its better graphics, I much prefer Inquisition's artstyle as well. Even villages look much better.

    As for everything being so high fantasy, I'd wager the city is Minrathous, which is the most magical place on Thedas proper, said to have buildings held upright by magic. Ferelden was a comparatively backwater, feudal country known for its simple, rugged people. Tevinter is the thousands-years old most powerful human nation on the continent, home to its mightiest and most prideful mages lording over an undercast of mundanes and slaves, it should by all rights have a much more grandiose architectural style, and if Dorian is any indication the Vints like to show off.

    The magic bow I'll grant is somewhat silly, but over the top weaponry started with DA2. Hell even some DLC and unique weapons in Origins look ridiculous compared to the usually quite grounded armor sets.
    Agreed. Origins was brown, grey and brown. It looks so fricking dull. I welcome more color with open arms. I am actually quite hyped about DA4. I want to know how the whole Dread Wolf problem can and will be solved.
    Also really hope we get to see Fenris again.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by VinceVega View Post
    But if you despise 2/3 of a game series, i don't think you will ever be happy with what comes next.
    Nooooo, don't criticize *product* you are just supposed to consume *product* and be excited for next *product*s.
    I already said I enjoyed DA2's story, but I'm not going to pretend having a good story somehow absolves it from being a bad game.

    Even Bioware admits that DA2 was rushed and resultantly a lower quality than it should have been (back when the company had standards). Its also well-known inquisition's development was a shitshow because EA forced them to use their FPS engine to make an RPG.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Pakheth View Post
    Agreed. Origins was brown, grey and brown. It looks so fricking dull. I welcome more color with open arms. I am actually quite hyped about DA4. I want to know how the whole Dread Wolf problem can and will be solved.
    Also really hope we get to see Fenris again.
    Fenris, the Sten and Dorian are three characters that I'm sure we'll see again, whenever as companions or not. Varric narrates the trailer but I do hope he stays that at most, a narrator and nothing more. I like the little guy but it's time for other characters to get the spotlight.
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  15. #55
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saltysquidoon View Post
    Nooooo, don't criticize *product* you are just supposed to consume *product* and be excited for next *product*s.
    I already said I enjoyed DA2's story, but I'm not going to pretend having a good story somehow absolves it from being a bad game.

    Even Bioware admits that DA2 was rushed and resultantly a lower quality than it should have been (back when the company had standards). Its also well-known inquisition's development was a shitshow because EA forced them to use their FPS engine to make an RPG.
    Enough with the dumb meme, Yeah DA2 clearly was rushed but it still offered some good fun and the Templare V Mage storyline was cool if a bit short. Inquisition was good and while by no means revolutionary, it deserves the praise minus their armor and attire people use like it decided to copy Earth cultural designs.
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  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Saltysquidoon View Post
    Even Bioware admits that DA2 was rushed and resultantly a lower quality than it should have been (back when the company had standards). Its also well-known inquisition's development was a shitshow because EA forced them to use their FPS engine to make an RPG.
    Sure, but plenty of us still enjoyed it. I preferred it to DA:O specifically because of the gameplay improvements, it felt a lot better to play even if it lacked when it came to environments and some of the other tidbits.

    And, again, it's not "well-known", because it's not factual. BW devs have repeatedly gone on-record saying that EA has never forced them to use Frostbite. Respawn similarly said that they were not forced to use Frostbite, either in the development of their titles (Apex Legends running on Source, Fallen Order on UE4). I doubt you'll find much disagreement in the belief that EA strongly encourages the use of Frostbite (i.e. if you license another engine it comes out of your total budget!), but there remains no evidence that it was forced.

    Beyond that the FPS engine has proven capable in sports games, in action games, in racing games, in open world games etc. etc. BioWare's problem is that they don't seem to bother investing in engineers, like ever, so their games are never technically impressive and are often technical nightmares, either in development or in the final product. Coupled with awful decision making, see: Hero Engine decision on SWTOR, scrapping all the work they did for Frostbite in DA:I and rebuilding it in ME:A....and then scrapping all that work and rebuilding it all for the third time in Anthem.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Leyre View Post
    There are no other Dragon Age games after Origins
    Dragon Age 2 is really an underrated game. I think a lot of people, myself included, went into it expecting the same type of game and same type of story that Origins had, but the developers went in a different direction. DA:O is effectively one long story, like a sprawling film; DA2 is more like 3 seasons of a TV show. Not in terms of length, but rather in terms of story construction. Things happen between acts, characters grow and change, and you get to watch how the city and the people change over the course of time. I get that people don't like it because there are a lot of recycled locations, but to me they made that element of the game work. You keep coming back to these familiar locations and because of that what has changed stands out more. I keep coming back to DA2 because I've never played another game like it in terms of story.

    I wasn't a huge fan of how the game systems changed, but I dunno once I got used to them they were fine and I had more than enough fun. The waves of enemies at first felt a bit silly, but ultimately it added a different kind of challenge than DA:O had.

  18. #58
    As much as i loved DA 1-3..... after the utter failure known as Anthem, i won't be buying any BW games unless it gets critical acclaim.

  19. #59
    Origins was good. The combat was clunky and so were the controls, sure it had a better story than two but it wasn't great. The combat and controls got better in the second two but then like was said in two the returning to zones over and over was a bit much. Inquisition was the closest to a good DA game they've done. I'm excited for this one, thank you for the links!

    I hope crafting scales so we can always make gear that's useful to fill in spots we don't find drops for.
    Last edited by blankfaced; 2020-12-15 at 09:17 PM.
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  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Leyre View Post
    There are no other Dragon Age games after Origins
    That's the only one i have not played. My first one was Dragon age 2 and then i played inqusition.

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