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  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    If you have a more fair way to monetize games that doesn't impact gameplay, I'm sure the industry would love to hear it.

    Like, I spend on skins sometimes too because I like them. But that doesn't mean I'm spending hundreds in skins in a game every year, I'll nab a few I like each year and call it a day. It's really not terribly difficult to set a "gaming budget" and limit your spending in F2P games while still picking stuff up.

    Haven't seen kids bullied in school over Fortnite, haven't been in school in ages. But that's pretty basic "school" stuff, if not Fortnite skins it'd be something else.

    And actually yeah, EA is making loads of cash off single player games. Jedi: Fallen Order was a massive hit for them, and their struggles with Anthem caused them to pivot DA4 from a live-service game to an offline single player game.



    Not at all. Going F2P dramatically expands the playerbase (games often see 100-1000% increases in active, concurrent, registered players etc.) which brings in both a lot more players improving the health of the game, and being able to both turn existing paying players into bigger spenders while picking up new big spenders, plus some additional smaller spenders on the side, usually helps their financials. I've worked on games that have done the transition and it's not like they're simply monetizing the existing playerbase more...well except for maybe CoH.



    Not "expect", but they cater to whales on the monetization front to a certain extent, much moreso in mobile where whales may legitimately help steer development. That's literally the nature of the F2P business model: A small crop of wealthy players dropping huge loads of cash largely subsidizing all the free players who don't spend a penny over years and years of playing. And that's a fantastic fuckin deal for free players, they're getting oodles of free content because wealthier folks are paying for it.



    It's a mutually beneficial arrangement, yo. F2P players aren't "out" anything for playing a F2P games for years without spending a penny.



    "Trick" isn't remotely accurate, but leverage "FOMO" is very accurate. But it's not something unique to gaming or F2P (seen the McRib? how about the limited time deals with WoW subs and cash shop cosmetics?), and sales are like...a standard thing across every business and generally pretty good for consumers.

    Again, this seems to be more, "People lack self control!" rather than, "The game is exploitative!" since I genuinely can't think of any truly exploitative major F2P games on PC/console, which is what we're talking about with a Riot MMO.



    Ok, so your spending is determined by how quickly you want to progress some aspects of the game. How dreadful that they'd incentivize spending some money! But that you can progress for free, albeit at a slower rate, is pretty rad. If you're "serious" about a F2P game I'd expect one to be willing to drop some cash on it as one would a B2P/P2P game, that's how they all kinda work, but for casual players who don't care as much about quick progression it doesn't much matter. I fit into the latter category (though don't play Genshin), and have no problems dropping cash in F2P games I'm more into.



    Not really, it's more to follow ye-olden Xbox Live model of tokens where you would always have tokens left over as there was no way to buy a "clean" amount of tokens. Those leftover tokens remain there, tempting you to buy some more to use them. PoE does that to a point, though their point system is pretty much 10:1, so 10 points = 1 dollar, so that 240 point armor is $24. Easy peasy.



    It appears it was $200 for the whole pack, which is 4 legendary ships and a TON of other stuff. STO is actually one of the more aggressively monetized games from what I know. I hope more games don't follow this model, but it's a game I casually play on the side from time to time and enjoy all the same.



    Yes, these are the whales I'm talking about. Many have the lifetime sub, so ongoing subs isn't a way to monetize them and they need to work on other offerings. As much as lifetime subs are great for players, they're a disaster for revenue generation.



    If someone "NEEDS TO HAVE EVERYTHING!", sure. But for someone playing normally, probably not. They may want a few skins a year depending on their budget, but that's entirely up to them to decide. Riot, or any company, having additional MTX options for bigger spenders doesn't mean they expect everyone to buy that shit.

    Just like Blizzard selling mounts and pets and whatnot doesn't mean that they expect everyone to buy that shit on top of the sub, either.
    Ok here's a quick monetization idea that doesn't exploit people. Set up a patreon like system where you can donate money to the development of more game content, keep servers running/maintenance, and tipping the devs and/or new game creation. Then let people see how much money is going into each area and how much each area costs yearly. So if some billionaire wants to have their great great grandkid play the game a hundred years from now they can dump all their money into keeping the servers up and running and general maintenance on the game. Then little Billy seeing that because of the billionaire and other people the game servers will be up for 150 years can then put 20 bucks into game updates instead of keeping the servers up.

    You are missing the point. If they weren't expecting the spenders to spend a shitload they wouldn't have ridiculously high prices on items. If they know they can get a million people spending 5 dollars a month or 100,000 spending 50 a month if they weren't intentionally exploiting the big spenders they would set the monetization at 5$ instead of 50.

    And yes stores have sales and other things designed to entice people to buy something they weren't going to in the first place but they also have a physical supply that can run out and costs resources to continually reproduce the product.

    Maybe I'm biased as my degree is in Psychology and Sociology and so see all the tricks they use. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe there are devs that seriously think all the f2p players are poor and are saving them from boredom and that everyone spending 200+ a month is a millionaire and when they quit after spending 800$ on a loot box they only did so cause they found a different game they enjoy more and not because the massive amount of creditcard debt they have wracked up playing the game. Maybe they also truly believe that people enjoy loot boxes and wouldn't want to pay 25$ for a mount and instead want to spend 1000$ to get it in a loot box because its fun and not because they invested a ton of money into getting something good and only got trash and so feel they need to spend until they get the mount or they just wasted a ton of money for nothing.

    Also this whole conversation was because you didn't believe that f2p games expected its paying players to spend more than 200 a year and yet I have given several examples of high costing packs. Clearly they expect the spenders to spend money.

  2. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    Don't get me wrong I don't think F2P games are the most evil thing in existence (battlepasses are). But I'd much rather play a monthly sub game where you aren't exploiting a fraction of your playbase.
    But subscription-based games do that anyway. Mounts, pets, transmogs, Blizzard has sold it all on their store, not to mention server transfers, level boosts etc. They are of course in no way alone in that, other subscription-based games do it too (FFXIV)

    Don't get me wrong, I actually prefer sub fee over f2p as well, but the MTX argument doesn't work in that regard

  3. #263
    Saw Ghostcrawler and immediately lost interest.

  4. #264
    hopefully it is a MMORPG instead of a MMO. and hopefully it uses some classical approach, finally offering me a good alternative to what WoW became. with better story and less „systems“. but i doubt it, because riot always was very e-sporty / pvp oriented. so i assume its more of a pvp oriented MMO. but we will see. will watch it closely.

  5. #265
    Problem is they are Asian owned so itl be another grindy garbage nonsense Asian MMO and not a Western Style MMO which means I will likely avoid it. Maybe if it was still the original Riot company Id want to check it out.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Cattleya View Post
    But subscription-based games do that anyway. Mounts, pets, transmogs, Blizzard has sold it all on their store, not to mention server transfers, level boosts etc. They are of course in no way alone in that, other subscription-based games do it too (FFXIV)

    Don't get me wrong, I actually prefer sub fee over f2p as well, but the MTX argument doesn't work in that regard
    But F2P usually locks systems and game effecting changes behind MTX rather than cosmetics (character slots, ability slots, crafting materials even gear etc etc). Cosmetics are fine to be MTX but it should never expand beyond that.
    Last edited by Vampyrr; 2021-03-10 at 04:13 PM.

  6. #266
    It will be very interesting to see what they get.

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    Problem is they are Asian owned so itl be another grindy garbage nonsense Asian MMO and not a Western Style MMO which means I will likely avoid it. Maybe if it was still the original Riot company Id want to check it out.
    That's the dumbest thing I've heard in a while. Do you think just because an investment company acquired Riot, the entire development team is gonna be gutted and replaced with Chinese developers ?

    I'd really appreciate it if people who don't know what the implications are of Tencent acquiring a company refrain from spreading nonsensical information so we can actually talk about meaningful implications that make sense, or implications that actually happened before.
    Last edited by Blezius; 2021-03-12 at 08:04 PM.

  8. #268
    Quote Originally Posted by Blezius View Post
    That's the dumbest thing I've heard in a while. Do you think just because an investment company acquired Riot, the entire development team is gonna be gutted and replaced with Chinese developers ?

    I'd really appreciate it if people who don't know what the implications are of Tencent acquiring a company refrain from spreading nonsensical information so we can actually talk about meaningful implications that make sense, or implications that actually happened before.
    If you think it wont and hasn't already influenced development direction you are delusional

  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    If you think it wont and hasn't already influenced development direction you are delusional
    How has it negatively impacted games like PoE or LoL? Neither seem to have changed much following their Tencent acquisition.

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    If you think it wont and hasn't already influenced development direction you are delusional
    "I'm just going to continue spreading misinformation without any evidence to backup my nonsensical claims"

    - You, probably.

  11. #271
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    How has it negatively impacted games like PoE or LoL? Neither seem to have changed much following their Tencent acquisition.
    Acquiring heroes and skins has dramaticalllly changed from league of old the boxes and shards is significantly different then just earn or buy currency buy the skin move on.

  12. #272
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    Acquiring heroes and skins has dramaticalllly changed from league of old the boxes and shards is significantly different then just earn or buy currency buy the skin move on.
    Yeah, the monetization system changed and...how is it worse?

    I haven't spent any money in it since the change (I barely play and had missed years worth of changes), but best I can tell now you can still earn champions purely with in-game currency pretty easily, and you can apparently even now slowly earn some paid skins with spending. That seems like an improvement over the old system where skins were paid only.

  13. #273
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommys View Post
    I like the old league lore when it was just character backstory. The new lore seems pointless. We have these events, but nothing in the game really changes. Everything happens outside the game.
    Which is why the need for the MMO.

  14. #274
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    I will spend $1000s to make my LoL MMO character totes adorbs!
    Tikki tikki tembo, Usagi no Yojimbo, chari bari ruchi pip peri pembo!

  15. #275
    Mechagnome RoutinelyWorgen's Avatar
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    Now Xenogenic has moved into the project https://twitter.com/Xenogenic/status...75919577952257
    Worgen hard, or hardly worgen?

  16. #276
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommys View Post
    I like the old league lore when it was just character backstory. The new lore seems pointless. We have these events, but nothing in the game really changes. Everything happens outside the game.
    Isn't that the point? The mmo will allow them to have said events, and many more.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyanion View Post
    In no way are you entitled to the 'complete' game when you buy it, because DLC/cosmetics and so on are there for companies to make more money
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Others, including myself, are saying that they only exist because Blizzard needed to create things so they could monetize it.

  17. #277

  18. #278
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    https://twitter.com/MarkYetter/statu...59332926156803

    So Mark Yetter is now on the project as Game Director, note that before joining Riot he worked on Black Ops II.
    Worgen hard, or hardly worgen?

  19. #279
    I don't know how that affects us?

  20. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by dextersmith View Post
    Saw Ghostcrawler and immediately lost interest.
    You just know mages will be broken

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